So, You Want To Fold Kk Preflop, Eh?

[HoosierAlum 0]

It's bingo bango bongo.Donk.PS -- Mentioning Grey Goose suddenly made me very thirsty. Is it wrong to want to drink at 8:15 on a Tuesday morning?

No.Im suprised Dags even took that long to call. Lol at the guy who advocates reraising to 2k.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

No.

No mention of Ketel One being > Grey Goose?

[HoosierAlum 0]

No mention of Ketel One being > Grey Goose?

So obvious there isnt much need to mention it.There are times I love playing professionally, like last night. It affords me the opportunity to get hammered all day and night on a Monday without having to worry about responsibilities in the morning. Ketel One OWNS.

[TheMathProf 0]

For the record, I have never layed down KK preflop in my life, and if I've layed down QQ preflop, it was probably only once or twice. Oh, and I don't know how I got sucked into this discussion again. This kind of **** is part of the reason I've grown to hate hold 'em.

I have to admit that I've never laid down KK preflop. I did lay down QQ once in a NL game, with a large stack, and no less than 5 big raises (some of them all-in) after my initial raise UTG, and I was covered. Ended up 5-way, with AA, KK, JJ, AQ, and T9 of diamonds.Guess who won the pot?

[Mercury69 3]

Best response, ever.Not sure why, just struck me as funny.

Loogie is the funny guy with the inscrutable poker face.

I have to admit that I've never laid down KK preflop. I did lay down QQ once in a NL game, with a large stack, and no less than 5 big raises (some of them all-in) after my initial raise UTG, and I was covered. Ended up 5-way, with AA, KK, JJ, AQ, and T9 of diamonds.Guess who won the pot?

T9 with a low str8?

[Jordan 1]

For the record, I have never layed down KK preflop in my life, and if I've layed down QQ preflop, it was probably only once or twice.

Really?Are we talking cash games or tourney's here?I just had to fold QQ yesterday playing 400nl...gg KK vs AA trying to trap me.that woulda been a fun pot.- Jordan

[astros11ss 0]

to the guy that said reraise to 2000... you would really fold if dags pushed back and you were getting better than 3 to 1 from the pot to call? i'm in no way a nl cash game expert, but it seems to me that you're lighting money on fire by rereraising with ak and then folding getting 3.3 to 1 from the pot. is your reasoning that he only puts in the fourth raise with aces or kings, not ak, not queens?

[doublemeup 0]

If Daniel Negreanu has only thrown KK away preflop once then certainly J-Dags can't do it.

[sixhands 0]

It's bingo bango bongo.Donk.PS -- Mentioning Grey Goose suddenly made me very thirsty. Is it wrong to want to drink at 8:15 on a Tuesday morning?

Hey drink away, it's 5pm somewhere on the planet

[CrazyJoe 0]

If Daniel Negreanu has only thrown KK away preflop once then certainly J-Dags can't do it.

and he was WRONG, so he is unlikely to do it again.

[sloshr 0]

THIS is the time to muck KK preflop:I was playing a micro NL game using smash strategy a while ago (if you don't know what it is, search the forum) and another frequent FCP poster was at the table (I believe it was DNA, but I'm not sure) playing the same strategy. We even shared a couple of comments at the table. I am dealt KK and am ready to move in, when he moves in first. I insta-fold, knowing he has AA or the other 2 kings.

[silkyjonson 1]

analyzing this hand is pointless. You can't just show that hand and then critique the play. there is no where near enough info, you would need hand histories and a good feel for the guy to be able to fold the kk pre-flop and have it be the correct play, just because you can fold that hand pre-flop does not mean your a good player, but if you are correct it is a obviously a sign of a player that is thinking and can paint a good picture.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

analyzing this hand is pointless. You can't just show that hand and then critique the play. there is no where near enough info, you would need hand histories and a good feel for the guy to be able to fold the kk pre-flop and have it be the correct play, just because you can fold that hand pre-flop does not mean your a good player, but if you are correct it is a obviously a sign of a player that is thinking and can paint a good picture.

..I'd venture so far as to say it means quite the opposite.

[No_Neck 0]

I've seen starving kids in Africa bitch less than some of you.

[turd ferguson 1]

People with AK like to see all 5 cards.

Best response, ever.Not sure why, just struck me as funny.

As usual.

THIS is the time to muck KK preflop:I was playing a micro NL game using smash strategy a while ago (if you don't know what it is, search the forum) and another frequent FCP poster was at the table (I believe it was DNA, but I'm not sure) playing the same strategy. We even shared a couple of comments at the table. I am dealt KK and am ready to move in, when he moves in first. I insta-fold, knowing he has AA or the other 2 kings.

This is almost as funny as Great Dane's brilliant strategy.

[PoppinFresh 0]

Why keep making new threads about this? Anyway now that I actually play NL cash games I can show specific examples where folding KK is right In this hand bb is a 10% pfr straightforward player, anyone want to go all in here?Seat 6 is the buttonTotal number of players : 6Seat 3: bb ( $753.61 )Seat 6: poppin ( $1039.35 )Seat 2: a ( $547.49 )Seat 5: b ( $207.25 )Seat 4: c ( $608 )Seat 1: d ( $120 )a posts small blind [$3].bb posts big blind [$6].** Dealing down cards **Dealt to poppin [ Kc Kd ]>You have options at Table 105992 Table!.c folds.d folds.poppin raises [$21].a calls [$18].bb raises [$30].poppin raises [$79].>You have options at Table 105992 Table!.a calls [$79].bb raises [$264].

[rwood 0]

who is talking about they've only laid down QQ a few times? QQ is a very easy fold compared to AA or KK...that is a somewhat routine laydown in a NL cash game. anyways, screw this thread, dont fold KK preflop. period. take it in the ***, thats what your bankroll is for. plus you'll suck out 20% of the time anyways. end of discussion. if John D'agostino cant do it to a 5k rebump, and Daniel says not to do it, and sammy farha cant lay it down for a 200k raise (vs greenstien in HSP), then why the hell are any of us even discussing this. there is no argument, you dont do it.

[PoppinFresh 0]

who is talking about they've only laid down QQ a few times? QQ is a very easy fold compared to AA or KK...that is a somewhat routine laydown in a NL cash game. anyways, screw this thread, dont fold KK preflop. period. take it in the ***, thats what your bankroll is for. plus you'll suck out 20% of the time anyways. end of discussion. if John D'agostino cant do it to a 5k rebump, and Daniel says not to do it, and sammy farha cant lay it down for a 200k raise (vs greenstien in HSP), then why the hell are any of us even discussing this. there is no argument, you dont do it.

[TeeSludge 0]

There are many players in AC 1/2 NL games who will ONLY re-raise pre-flop with KK or AA. The games are seriously that passive. If you pay attention to who these players are it doesn't make it that hard to lay down KK pre-flop. Seriously. However, in the 2/5 or 5/10 NL games I would probably never muck KK pre-flop.Just sayin.-Tre

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Why keep making new threads about this? Anyway now that I actually play NL cash games I can show specific examples where folding KK is right In this hand bb is a 10% pfr straightforward player, anyone want to go all in here?Seat 6 is the buttonTotal number of players : 6Seat 3: bb ( $753.61 )Seat 6: poppin ( $1039.35 )Seat 2: a ( $547.49 )Seat 5: b ( $207.25 )Seat 4: c ( $608 )Seat 1: d ( $120 )a posts small blind [$3].bb posts big blind [$6].** Dealing down cards **Dealt to poppin [ Kc Kd ]>You have options at Table 105992 Table!.c folds.d folds.poppin raises [$21].a calls [$18].bb raises [$30].poppin raises [$79].>You have options at Table 105992 Table!.a calls [$79].bb raises [$264].

Push. nh. well played.

[CobaltBlue 662]

That's why Cobalt is my favorite NLHE player on this site.

Ha. If that's serious, thanks. I'm finally coming back to refocus on NL after a bit of a break. I'll have to drop by NL strat more often.

[Abbaddabba 0]

who is talking about they've only laid down QQ a few times? QQ is a very easy fold compared to AA or KK...that is a somewhat routine laydown in a NL cash game. anyways, screw this thread, dont fold KK preflop. period. take it in the ***, thats what your bankroll is for. plus you'll suck out 20% of the time anyways. end of discussion. if John D'agostino cant do it to a 5k rebump, and Daniel says not to do it, and sammy farha cant lay it down for a 200k raise (vs greenstien in HSP), then why the hell are any of us even discussing this. there is no argument, you dont do it.

High stakes games with tough opponents tend to be a lot more aggressive than low stakes night with a half dozen weak/tight nits.... just saying.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Ha. If that's serious, thanks. I'm finally coming back to refocus on NL after a bit of a break. I'll have to drop by NL strat more often.

Actually, I really do enjoy the hands you post. I'd like to see ya LAG it up a bit more (limp/raising UTG with 85s), but, I really like your game. I'll stop now, at the risk of sounding homoerotic.

High stakes games with tough opponents tend to be a lot more aggressive than low stakes night with a half dozen weak/tight nits.... just saying.

Succinct, yet poignant and dead on.Very nice.

[CobaltBlue 662]

I'd like to see ya LAG it up a bit more (limp/raising UTG with 85s), but, I really like your game.

Well, the game conditions (opponents) have to be right...but I can step out every now and then.Had a nice live 2/5 NLHE hand in NO a couple weeks ago towards the end of my session. I'd been building up a lot of TAG credibility. Open-raised with A9o on the button to $15. SB and BB called. Flop was Q53. They checked. I bet $35. BB called. Turn 4. BB checked. I slowly pushed forward a stack of $100. BB sat there in pain for around two minutes before finally folding. Obviously he had something like KQ/QJ. My dad and brother were railing behind me and were convinced that I had AQ or better. Nope...a gut-shot and an over. Not a huge "step out" and I've certainly pulled bigger bluffs online, but this was the biggest I've had occasion to pull live.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Well, the game conditions (opponents) have to be right...but I can step out every now and then.Had a nice live 2/5 NLHE hand in NO a couple weeks ago towards the end of my session. I'd been building up a lot of TAG credibility. Open-raised with A9o on the button to $15. SB and BB called. Flop was Q53. They checked. I bet $35. BB called. Turn 4. BB checked. I slowly pushed forward a stack of $100. BB sat there in pain for around two minutes before finally folding. Obviously he had something like KQ/QJ. My dad and brother were railing behind me and were convinced that I had AQ or better. Nope...a gut-shot and an over. Not a huge "step out" and I've certainly pulled bigger bluffs online, but this was the biggest I've had occasion to pull live.

Just wait until he says "call" and beats you into the pot. Then you're staring at a blanked river with a ginormous pot, and the only way you're winning is by betting, and you're all but sure he'll call any bet--so, you push anyway. It's fun.Honestly, though, did you think that Live was easier/tougher/same thing..?