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Its the exceptions Im referring to. I dont mean to paint all players with the same brush.I understand the financial/legitimate arguments about UFA's, I understand some players are truly hurt. But those guys who are neither hurt, or in a contract impasse, and who use words like "tired", show a high degree of disrespect IMO.I realize soon you prob wont even know who turned them down and why...so this argument will be moot. But for now, knowing what I know, it still bothers me.
I agree there are some, where if I knew all the details of their decision, I would lose respect for.This guy does not know enough detail about the players he calls out to do so in such a public way, in an official capacity. Even if he did, it would be a petty, disrespecful thing to do.
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I agree there are some, where if I knew all the details of their decision, I would lose respect for.This guy does not know enough detail about the players he calls out to do so in such a public way, in an official capacity. Even if he did, it would be a petty, disrespecful thing to do.
The excuse being used by Crosby , Backstrom and them is being tired....If thats the real reason its lame, and thats the backlash..Also i believe comparing this tourney to the Spengler Cup is way off..
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The excuse being used by Crosby , Backstrom and them is being tired....If thats the real reason its lame, and thats the backlash..Also i believe comparing this tourney to the Spengler Cup is way off..
Why? Crosby is tired. He has played a ton of hockey in the last couple years, not to mention what I imagine is a very busy life. God forbid the guy wants to spend some time with his family or something. Like I said, I don't think he owes anything. And flying a long way to join a team already 3/4 of the way through the tournament is probably not what he feels like. Yes, he will be playing with his team on his back, but Crosby is representing Canada every single day. Another couple hockey games doesn't change anything.Backstrom is basically the same, though he's played slightly less hockey in the past couple years :club: Again, if it is me, I go. But these guys went to the Olympics, which is the real international competition, respected by everyone, thousands of years old. Thousands? Hundreds at least. This is just a tournament that organizers created to make money and showcase their product. Mostly the latter. They made the teams by country because that'd be the most exciting/interesting. A guy not wanting to play in a second-tier tournament does not make me any more or less proud to share my heritage, and does not indicate to me he is any more or less proud of his.Apparently I feel strongly about this.
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No Danny, you don't get it. Crosby did something that may or may not be disagreeable with some people, therefore he's a villain and a million news articles will pick up on it and vilify him and serge and the rest of his haters will follow along like some sort of cult, reveling in his apparent fall from grace.

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No Danny, you don't get it. Crosby did something that may or may not be disagreeable with some people, therefore he's a villain and a million news articles will pick up on it and vilify him and serge and the rest of his haters will follow along like some sort of cult, reveling in his apparent fall from grace.
this has nothing to do with Crosby...Backstrom is just as bad..FWIW..A lot of players have played just as many games as these guys..Its an obligation as a hockey player to play in this event..Oh and Danny..Poor hockey players are tired..They are making $8 mill a year plus plus...Tell that to the working schmo who works 80 hours a week and is making $50000 a year..
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Nobody has told me WHY it's an obligation for these people to play.I don't get how free citizens aren't allowed to have a free choice to make here. They can be tired, they can as fresh as day 1 of the season, I don't care what their reason is. Maybe they think Germany sucks. Who cares, it's a second-rate tournament. Why should everyone be obligated to go?They're paid their $8M a year to play in the NHL. Their obligation is to their NHL team. Them making money playing hockey has nothing to do with their decisions to play for the Olympics, the World Juniors, the World Championships, etc. They're all completely separate entities.Serge, say you spent 10-16 hours per day working as a banker, but also, half the time, you had to be on the road, living out of hotels, "working" in hostile environments, flying for countless hours each year, being apart from your wife, your kids, etc. You'd be completely exhausted, burned out, ready for a break. Then for some reason, you get a month or two off, and they want you to travel half-way around the world and compete in the 2nd or 3rd or 4th most important "world banking championship" and represent your country. This tournament could last up to 3 weeks of your well-deserved time off. Are you telling me that you would jump at this opportunity every single year?

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Nobody has told me WHY it's an obligation for these people to play.I don't get how free citizens aren't allowed to have a free choice to make here. They can be tired, they can as fresh as day 1 of the season, I don't care what their reason is. Maybe they think Germany sucks. Who cares, it's a second-rate tournament. Why should everyone be obligated to go?They're paid their $8M a year to play in the NHL. Their obligation is to their NHL team. Them making money playing hockey has nothing to do with their decisions to play for the Olympics, the World Juniors, the World Championships, etc. They're all completely separate entities.Serge, say you spent 10-16 hours per day working as a banker, but also, half the time, you had to be on the road, living out of hotels, "working" in hostile environments, flying for countless hours each year, being apart from your wife, your kids, etc. You'd be completely exhausted, burned out, ready for a break. Then for some reason, you get a month or two off, and they want you to travel half-way around the world and compete in the 2nd or 3rd or 4th most important "world banking championship" and represent your country. This tournament could last up to 3 weeks of your well-deserved time off. Are you telling me that you would jump at this opportunity every single year?
first off, you know my approach, and even Serge's in this convo, has nothing to do with Crosby.second, no one has to go. yes, free citizens, can do whatever they want. But I have the same freedom to comment on their lack of stepping up to what I believe is an obligation.all these arguments you guys are making would hold a lot more water if I didnt think they would ALL go to this tourney if there was money on the line. I dont know why you see the World Juniors as so different than the World Championships, when both are run by the same organization, and both tournaments are during players' "free time". Guys go to the juniors during xmas for christs sake. WHo exactly does it matter to, other than Canadians? (remember, Im talking about all players from all countries, not just Canadians, who turn down these invites). The juniors would be just as much a "second rate" tourney if there wasnt the allure of raising your earning potential.Ray Whitney is there, playing, and is the captain. UFA. Idiot? A true patriot? Or just a guy hoping to catch a bigger deal with a good tourney?Im really suprised you guys see so little value in the World Championships, when the World Juniors are so religiously followed+analyzed.
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Well, the biggest difference is that the World Juniors are the biggest tournament you can play when you're U20 and not in the NHL.The World Championships are not as prestigious. Maybe they would be if the best of the best came, but that will never happen when they start during the 2nd round of the NHL playoffs.Personally, I love international competition. I think they should move the WCs to late July or sometime in August so that the best players in the world can come in rested. You won't get the "tired" excuses, as even guys who went to the finals will have at least 6 weeks of downtime. Around that time, guys are probably itching to get back into the game. It would also be a good tune up for everyone for the NHL regular season which is right around the corner. At the same time, it's not close enough to the NHL season starting date to be used as an excuse come playoff time for guys who are burned out, since they'll get at least a month off before training camps start.With respect to Ray Whitney, maybe he is a patriot, maybe he feels pride playing for his country, maybe he's not satisfied with his season so wanted a chance to go out on a high note, or maybe he knows that this second tier tourney is the only time he'll have another shot at representing Canada, because as much as I like him as player, he's not getting near the Olympics or a tournament that truly draws the "best of the best." On the other hand, maybe he's trying to raise his value, sure.On a side note, we should stop referring to the Spengler Cup in here, as it's not really an international tourney, as it's open to club teams and national teams.

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first off, you know my approach, and even Serge's in this convo, has nothing to do with Crosby.second, no one has to go. yes, free citizens, can do whatever they want. But I have the same freedom to comment on their lack of stepping up to what I believe is an obligation.all these arguments you guys are making would hold a lot more water if I didnt think they would ALL go to this tourney if there was money on the line. I dont know why you see the World Juniors as so different than the World Championships, when both are run by the same organization, and both tournaments are during players' "free time". Guys go to the juniors during xmas for christs sake. WHo exactly does it matter to, other than Canadians? (remember, Im talking about all players from all countries, not just Canadians, who turn down these invites). The juniors would be just as much a "second rate" tourney if there wasnt the allure of raising your earning potential.Ray Whitney is there, playing, and is the captain. UFA. Idiot? A true patriot? Or just a guy hoping to catch a bigger deal with a good tourney?Im really suprised you guys see so little value in the World Championships, when the World Juniors are so religiously followed+analyzed.
Maybe Whitney is a patriot. Good for him. Doesn't mean it is bad for someone not to be like him. There are members of our military or government who could be working in the private industry for more money, but don't out of a sense of the greater good or national pride. I don't hold it against those that don't.I also appreciate Crosby is just the lightning rod in this issue. He is a poor example, but that isn't to say there aren't good examples.The main reason the WJC is 'better' is because everyone has the opportunity to play. It has been hurt in recent years with so many players not being released by their teams of course. For the most part though, everyone is eligible, so there's no reason for the best not to play. If I'm Slovakian, and a great playoff run means by goalie is not available, I am very discouraged to play. Why should I play on a handicapped team? And if I'm Marty Brodeur, my competition does not have their best players...where is the pride in beating a handicapped team?The existence of handicaps, even if they are distributed unpredictably, takes away the prestige of the tournament.
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hasnt it already been a little bad for the Bruins this year?With the way the East has shaped up this year, with the obvious lack of scoring the Bruins had, Kessel might of got them to the Finals..While the lack of scoring can be blamed on the injuries to Savard, Krejci its an angle i have heard discussed.No doubt its a trade that will take years to judge though
I'm not completely sure but keeping Kessel would have eaten more of the Bruins cap space and they may have had to move someone else.
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first off, you know my approach, and even Serge's in this convo, has nothing to do with Crosby.second, no one has to go. yes, free citizens, can do whatever they want. But I have the same freedom to comment on their lack of stepping up to what I believe is an obligation.all these arguments you guys are making would hold a lot more water if I didnt think they would ALL go to this tourney if there was money on the line. I dont know why you see the World Juniors as so different than the World Championships, when both are run by the same organization, and both tournaments are during players' "free time". Guys go to the juniors during xmas for christs sake. WHo exactly does it matter to, other than Canadians? (remember, Im talking about all players from all countries, not just Canadians, who turn down these invites). The juniors would be just as much a "second rate" tourney if there wasnt the allure of raising your earning potential.Ray Whitney is there, playing, and is the captain. UFA. Idiot? A true patriot? Or just a guy hoping to catch a bigger deal with a good tourney?Im really suprised you guys see so little value in the World Championships, when the World Juniors are so religiously followed+analyzed.
I'm late to the party and haven't read everything, but the World Championships don't compare to the World Juniors. Perhaps it's a matter of marketing, maybe the WC suffer because it's deemed as a playoff consolation, or maybe the juniors is coveted by the players because it's an opportunity to make a name for yourself and boost your value. I watch all the Canadian Junior games. I watched one WC game this year.
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Good discussion about this topic with good arguments on both sides..Zach, I am in the opinion that if I was a banker, lawyer or doctor and I was making that kind of money its a sacrifice I would have to make..you cant have the best of both worlds..its like those ******* athletes that dont sign autographs, dont spend time with kids and dont do community work...I am not saying this is like that, but there has to be some obligation on the stars part...

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Good discussion about this topic with good arguments on both sides..Zach, I am in the opinion that if I was a banker, lawyer or doctor and I was making that kind of money its a sacrifice I would have to make..you cant have the best of both worlds..its like those ******* athletes that dont sign autographs, dont spend time with kids and dont do community work...I am not saying this is like that, but there has to be some obligation on the stars part...
Perhaps it's best that players are able to say no to some things so they are able to say yes to so many more. I could see someone becoming burnt out very quickly from all the things they do. If saying no to the WC allows Joe Blow to get some rest and spend time with his family and enables him to enter next season refreshed and ready to play hockey, help charities and sign countless autographs then that's ok with me. Plus it gives other players a chance to experience the WC.
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Do you guys think that owners and gms go to the players and "tell" them to decline the invitation?If i was Ted Leonsis or Mario Lemieux, I rather have my star player not playing obviously..

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To anyone that cares..It looks like I will be going to Vegas for an impromptu trip to hang out with the brother in law..Its looking like second or 3rd week of June..It cant be the weekend of the 5th or the weekend of the 27th..Where are u staying Arp?Your uncles place??********MGM
I will be there.... going to the NHL awards.... staying at the Wynn, in all likelihood
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Dunno if this has been posted, did a couple searches and scrolled around a few threads. Anyway...TMZ Link Ex-NHL Star Accused of Sex Crime Against DaughterOriginally posted May 21st 2010 8:45 AM PDT by TMZ Staffrtga6p.jpgA former L.A. Kings hockey player-turned-assistant coach was arrested this morning in Washington D.C. for allegedly sexually abusing a 21-year-old woman -- his own daughter.TMZ has learned 51-year-old Mark Hardy is in police custody after his daughter told cops that Mark "put his hand down [her] shorts and touched her genital area without her permission."Hardy was arrested at the legendary Mayflower Hotel in D.C. -- where the alleged incident was said to have occurred early this morning. He's set to face a judge later today on the charge of misdemeanor sexual abuse.UPDATE: TMZ has just received a statement from L.A. Kings saying simply, "We are aware of the charge. Due to the legal nature of this matter, we will not have any additional comments at this time."Read more: http://www.tmz.com/2010/05/21/nhl-coach-ma.../#ixzz0omYUzErF

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