are statistics really that important ?

[RISINGSHARK 0]

Please can I have your views on this.I personally dont really go for this theory that you should know your flops seen % etcP.s. I am a winning poker player as justBlaze will confirm after I beat him last night.Many thanks.

[JFarrell20 1]

(SW)stats have no relevance in an odds-based game.Good luck.

[justblaze 0]

[sw] yea you crushed me.

[JaysonWeber 0]

If you are playing limit poker and you dont know statistics... I bid you good luck.

[MilesZS 0]

beating someone one time does not make you a winning player. Actually, there's a good example of why poker players pay attention to statistics.To know if you're a winning player you have to keep a record of thousands of hands, along with those statistics that you don't think matter.Anyone can beat anyone if they're catching cards.justblaze, you totally missed a worst.post.ever. opportunity.

[jogsxyz 0]

With no knowledge of statistics, how would you know if you were a winning or losing player?

[kindofblu 0]

Statistics are helpful 67% of the time...the rest...useless

[justblaze 0]

beating someone one time does not make you a winning player. Actually, there's a good example of why poker players pay attention to statistics.To know if you're a winning player you have to keep a record of thousands of hands, along with those statistics that you don't think matter.Anyone can beat anyone if they're catching cards.justblaze, you totally missed a worst.post.ever. opportunity.

good point. thanks for covering :wink:

[JFarrell20 1]

With no knowledge of statistics, how would you know if you were a winning or losing player?

welcome back... are you and RKARD the same person?

[QKRTHNU 0]

If you play strictly for entertainment and have no desire to improve your game, then no, the statistics of your play don't matter.But I'm sure a self-proclaimed Lederer type thinker / player and aspiring pro like yourself already knows that. :roll:

[gadjet 11]

I'd like to direct you at this time … to my signature…

[Abbaddabba 0]

As long as you can consistantly rig the deck, no, they're not really that important.

[Swift_Psycho 1]

With no knowledge of statistics, how would you know if you were a winning or losing player?

This is kind of a weird question. I'd just look in my wallet and/or on my online account and use addition and subtraction to find out how much I made/lost. Statistics isn't the only form of math...

[jlgosse 0]

Checking your wallet to see how much you've won/lost is an example of a simple statistic.

[chuckf410 0]

Please can I have your views on this.I personally dont really go for this theory that you should know your flops seen % etcP.s. I am a winning poker player as justBlaze will confirm after I beat him last night.Many thanks.

Well on a day to day basis, when playing as a hobby, no you don't need to know your percentage. You'll have ups and down in the short term. And your long term will not matter as it is a hobby and you're playing for fun, not profit.However in your situation you want to turn pro. You need your stats to anylyze your long term play to find where your holes are when playing when you're involved in long downswings. With the stats that you accumulate you can see patterns develop. i.e. in January I saw 37% of the flops and won 75% of the time. In February I saw 60% of the flops and won 43% of the time. Lesson learned is you're playing too many hands and go back to being more selective.

[vegasalwayswins 0]

Statistics and your % of coming out of the hand a winner are vital to the way you play your hand. If you feel like gambling, well, that's totally different, but I prefer the statistics, even though at times I myself gamble as well. For example: you have 5S6S, your opponent has ADQD. The flop comes: 3S, 7D, AS. Now, you have 12 cards that can make your hand. all the 4's, and all the spades. your opponent, he needs running diamonds to 'make' his hand, or just needs to avoid the 12 cards that help you. statistics would put this in a coin flip situation, but i would rather be the guy sitting with ADQD, as he is about a 75% favorite right now to win the hand. Odds can be beaten, but hey, would you rather be the 25%, or 75%?

[Guest]

For example: you have 5S6S, your opponent has ADQD. The flop comes: 3S, 7D, AS. Now, you have 12 cards that can make your hand. all the 4's, and all the spades. your opponent, he needs running diamonds to 'make' his hand, or just needs to avoid the 12 cards that help you. statistics would put this in a coin flip situation, but i would rather be the guy sitting with ADQD, as he is about a 75% favorite right now to win the hand. Odds can be beaten, but hey, would you rather be the 25%, or 75%?

Um... If statistics put this in a coin flip situation, isn't this hand roughly 1:1 and not 3:1 in favour of AQs? See, that's why statistics matter...

[gadjet 11]

Please can I have your views on this.I personally dont really go for this theory that you should know your flops seen % etcP.s. I am a winning poker player as justBlaze will confirm after I beat him last night.Many thanks.

Well on a day to day basis, when playing as a hobby, no you don't need to know your percentage. You'll have ups and down in the short term. And your long term will not matter as it is a hobby and you're playing for fun, not profit.However in your situation you want to turn pro. You need your stats to anylyze your long term play to find where your holes are when playing when you're involved in long downswings. With the stats that you accumulate you can see patterns develop. i.e. in January I saw 37% of the flops and won 75% of the time. In February I saw 60% of the flops and won 43% of the time. Lesson learned is you're playing too many hands and go back to being more selective.

Statistics can be misleading if you rely on them to heavily… Who's to say in January the cards weren't just hitting you every which way you looked, while in february you couldn't hit any draws etc… or you got dealt monster after monster but ended up getting cracked… Statistics need to be put in perspective with the rest of your game. Yes they are important in a hand (flop percentages etc) and yes I track statistics for the long term, but relying too heavily on them can be a hindrance… i.e. The statistics of you having A's 10 times when your confidence is high and you play them aggressively for the win, vs. the A's 10 times the next week when you confidence was low and you misplayed them. Look back at the books and it says the first ten times you won 8 times, but in the last 10 times you won only 3 and it gives no indication as to why and this isn't due to varience, there's more to the game than statistics of flops seen showdowns won. Long term these do give you great feed back in your game. I just wouldn't recommend going so overboard with them… i.e. comparing them week to week or month to month.

[RISINGSHARK 0]

REspect to QKR (whatever) and gadjet.Those are the sort of answers I m looking for.I think we sort of agree that stats are very misleading.I do think an awful lot. Lederer type. Pure trantric sex as well.REAL THINKING.Odds and statistics ar completely different as anyone with a brain knows !!!!!!!!

[RISINGSHARK 0]

and chuck sorry, always respect your views

[RISINGSHARK 0]

yeah i spelt tantric incorrectly, it is St Pats day !!!!!!!!

[speedz99 145]

Please can I have your views on this.I personally dont really go for this theory that you should know your flops seen % etcP.s. I am a winning poker player as justBlaze will confirm after I beat him last night.Many thanks.

Well on a day to day basis, when playing as a hobby, no you don't need to know your percentage. You'll have ups and down in the short term. And your long term will not matter as it is a hobby and you're playing for fun, not profit.However in your situation you want to turn pro. You need your stats to anylyze your long term play to find where your holes are when playing when you're involved in long downswings. With the stats that you accumulate you can see patterns develop. i.e. in January I saw 37% of the flops and won 75% of the time. In February I saw 60% of the flops and won 43% of the time. Lesson learned is you're playing too many hands and go back to being more selective.

You were seeing 60% of the flops? You don't need stats to tell you that you shouldn't be seeing the flop every other hand.On a side note, I think we have run out of new topics.

[chuckf410 0]

i.e. in January I saw 37% of the flops and won 75% of the time. In February I saw 60% of the flops and won 43% of the time. Lesson learned is you're playing too many hands and go back to being more selective.

Statistics can be misleading if you rely on them to heavily… Who's to say in January the cards weren't just hitting you every which way you looked, while in february you couldn't hit any draws etc… or you got dealt monster after monster but ended up getting cracked… Statistics need to be put in perspective with the rest of your game. Yes they are important in a hand (flop percentages etc) and yes I track statistics for the long term, but relying too heavily on them can be a hindrance…

But what if you take your stats and see that you did really well in January due to tight play, but got over confident in February and started playing more and more hands just because for the last four weeks you were doing 'really well' and is was simply a matter of tight play. The percentage of flops seen is just one stat among many that you need to track. I only mentioned and used the one for brevity and to make a general point.But if your goal is to make a living at this, you have to keep the numbers. Otherwise you won't see where you're weak and it will come crashing down. If you play the game for fun, the numbers drop in thier importance.

[Awful 0]

There is no quicker way to diagnose and isolate leaks.There is no easier way to determine when you're beating the game and when you're inventing the idea that you're a winner.There is no more communicable measure of skill and play when seeking advice on your overall game.Can stats be harmful or incorrect out of context? Of course. That's why it's important to understand the meaning of the games. As much as they can be misused, they're the most powerful quantitative measure of your play when compared to good guidelines and seen in the proper light.

[chuckf410 0]

i.e. in January I saw 37% of the flops and won 75% of the time. In February I saw 60% of the flops and won 43% of the time. Lesson learned is you're playing too many hands and go back to being more selective.

You were seeing 60% of the flops? You don't need stats to tell you that you shouldn't be seeing the flop every other hand.On a side note, I think we have run out of new topics.

Let me qualify this, these are not my real numbers. They are for the general example as a drastic change in playing style. Something that you can see by keeping stats and that you would probably miss without numbers to back up your analysis of your play.