Daniel's Hand Versus Brunson From Hsp

[lamann1 0]

Hoping someone can clear this one up for me more out of curiousity than anything. I'm sure it's a pretty simple explanation and I'm just not following.On the hand where DN had AQ and Todd Brunson had AK, Todd moved all in after the flop of Queen, blank, blank. They then ran it twice and Brunson lost both. When he went to give Daniel the 83K and change that he raised after the flop they said the total pot was something like 95K total. Todd then said that he would borrow the money and give Daniel 100K in Bellagio chips (Daniel threw Todd another 5K to make the number easier), so just kept the pot.Doesn't Todd owe him close to 200K though since they ran it twice, or am I just not following?

[grocery_mony 8]

i though when they run it twice its for half the pot each run. maybe i am wrong or maybe the rules are diffrent depending on what the players agree to before the game.

[No_Neck 0]

doesn't double the pot, it splits it an half.

[eYank 0]

i though when they run it twice its for half the pot each run. maybe i am wrong or maybe the rules are diffrent depending on what the players agree to before the game.

yeah you are rightwhen they run it twice each time is for half the pot

[bascomeb 0]

lol todd didnt run it twice for 100k each. he knows hes a huge underdog.they run it twice to so if todd wins one pot and dn wins won pot its chopped. But if one of the 2 wins both times, they win the whole pot

[GoCryWolfe 0]

i though when they run it twice its for half the pot each run. maybe i am wrong or maybe the rules are diffrent depending on what the players agree to before the game.

You're right. Running it twice gives a chance to the player that is losing at the moment a chance at winning some of the pot. If Daniel won the first one, and Todd won the second one, they woulda chopped the pot like they both had the same hand. If Todd won the first and second, he woulda won the whole pot, and vice versa.

[mrdannyg 274]

Hoping someone can clear this one up for me more out of curiousity than anything. I'm sure it's a pretty simple explanation and I'm just not following.On the hand where DN had AQ and Todd Brunson had AK, Todd moved all in after the flop of Queen, blank, blank. They then ran it twice and Brunson lost both. When he went to give Daniel the 83K and change that he raised after the flop they said the total pot was something like 95K total. Todd then said that he would borrow the money and give Daniel 100K in Bellagio chips (Daniel threw Todd another 5K to make the number easier), so just kept the pot.Doesn't Todd owe him close to 200K though since they ran it twice, or am I just not following?

running it twice does not count it as two hands.you run it twice basically to confirm the results. if each had won it once, then they would split the pot. since DN won it twice, he gets the whole pot, which was $95K.basically, when you run it twice (or more), each run is just for half (or whatever fraction) of the pot.edit: oops, no one had responded when i Replied. maybe i should refresh threads more often

[CrazyJoe 0]

why in the hell would Todd want to double the pot when he had 3 outs? come on.... think about things before you ask a question

[lamann1 0]

why in the hell would Todd want to double the pot when he had 3 outs? come on.... think about things before you ask a question

I did think about it Joe, but thanks for the courtesy answer. I clearly said right in the original post that I was sure it was something obvious and that I just wasn't following so I outright said that I assumed I was off on my thinking.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.Maybe in the future just a solid answer like many did here rather than the need to be an asshat.

[grocery_mony 8]

i think the real question is why would daniel agree to run it twice? todd had to hit a 3 outer why give him 4 cards to chop the pot? it worked out but i have a hard time figuring this one out unless i am missing something.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.ok that makes more sence

[No_Neck 0]

I did think about it Joe, but thanks for the courtesy answer. I clearly said right in the original post that I was sure it was something obvious and that I just wasn't following so I outright said that I assumed I was off on my thinking.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.Maybe in the future just a solid answer like many did here rather than the need to be an asshat.

don't mind Joe, he has taken to many shots to the head.

[loxo 0]

i think the real question is why would daniel agree to run it twice? todd had to hit a 3 outer why give him 4 cards to chop the pot? it worked out but i have a hard time figuring this one out unless i am missing something.

Yep, from what I know about this (which is little) I gotta agree.

[serge 904]

I did think about it Joe, but thanks for the courtesy answer. I clearly said right in the original post that I was sure it was something obvious and that I just wasn't following so I outright said that I assumed I was off on my thinking.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.Maybe in the future just a solid answer like many did here rather than the need to be an asshat.

I was just wondering why Daniel would agree to run it twice WITHOUT seeing Todd's hand..if he saw Todd s hand there is no way he would agree to run it twice...If I am Daniel and I see Todd agreeing to run it twice..I would be suspicious to whyjust my two cents

[bascomeb 0]

i think the real question is why would daniel agree to run it twice? todd had to hit a 3 outer why give him 4 cards to chop the pot? it worked out but i have a hard time figuring this one out unless i am missing something.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.ok that makes more sence

less variance

[lamann1 0]

I was just wondering why Daniel would agree to run it twice WITHOUT seeing Todd's hand..if he saw Todd s hand there is no way he would agree to run it twice...If I am Daniel and I see Todd agreeing to run it twice..I would be suspicious to whyjust my two cents

Now that my confusion has been cleared up I think that you are absolutely right about your comment. That's honestly where some of the confusion came in for me as I couldn't follow why Daniel did that, but I'm sure there was a good reason. Seems like it is a courtesy they extend to each other a lot of the time as well, so maybe one of those things where it is somewhat expected.

[No_Neck 0]

less variance

and it doesn't change the EV

[JeremyG 0]

i think the real question is why would daniel agree to run it twice? todd had to hit a 3 outer why give him 4 cards to chop the pot?

1. Because 3-outers happen. Running twice helps reduce variance.2. Because nobody wants to lose $50k (D's half of the pot) on a 3 outer.3. Because later on, Daniel will make a bad call or raise and have just a few outs, and Brunson will be much more likely to run it twice with him.Daniel had virtually nothing to lose. Less than 1 in 10 times will Brunson win even HALF the pot. By doing this, he looks like a good guy and it will help him in the future.

[lamann1 0]

1. Because 3-outers happen. Running twice helps reduce variance.2. Because nobody wants to lose $50k (D's half of the pot) on a 3 outer.3. Because later on, Daniel will make a bad call or raise and have just a few outs, and Brunson will be much more likely to run it twice with him.Daniel had virtually nothing to lose. Less than 1 in 10 times will Brunson win even HALF the pot. By doing this, he looks like a good guy and it will help him in the future.

All great points. Thanks for the info. Makes it a lot clearer in my mind.

[Bgfoot 0]

After DN won the hand, Todd's money was still in front of him $95,800.Todd asked DN to loan him $100,000, therefore Todd pulled back the $95,800, threw DN $800.00, DN gave Todd a $5,000 chip to complete the $100,000 loan.Then Todd decided to give DN four cranberries ($25,000 Bellagio chips)

[wwmoon85 0]

i think the real question is why would daniel agree to run it twice? todd had to hit a 3 outer why give him 4 cards to chop the pot? it worked out but i have a hard time figuring this one out unless i am missing something.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.ok that makes more sence

Daniel didnt know that brunson had AK. Daniel even mentioned before he called that he thought brunson may have Aces or Kings. Then when he asked brunson if he actually did have aces or kings, brunson nodded. So thats why he asked to run it twice.

[TheWatchMan 0]

I did think about it Joe, but thanks for the courtesy answer. I clearly said right in the original post that I was sure it was something obvious and that I just wasn't following so I outright said that I assumed I was off on my thinking.I completely agree that he wouldn't want to run it twice with three outs. As a point of reference though he didn't see Daniel's hand before they agreed to do that although I'm quite sure he knew what it was.Maybe in the future just a solid answer like many did here rather than the need to be an asshat.

it was an amazingly obv questionps, what was todd doing!

[lamann1 0]

it was an amazingly obv questionps, what was todd doing!

Lord knows we never have questions with obvious answers asked around here right? I pretty much called myself as asking one that probably had a very clear answer, but thanks for reconfirming what I already knew.

[NoSup4U 0]

2 parts to what the OP was asking: Running it twice blind makes no difference than if you run it twice knowing what your opponent has. All running it twice does is smooth out your wins and losses over time, it does not change how much you expect to win. (so its not like being the favorite or underdog makes running it twice more or less desirable)For example: You are a 2-1 favorite in a hand for a 300 pot. Running it once, you would win 300, win 300, lose 300, giving you a 300 profit. If you ran it twice for half the pot, you would: Win 150, lose 150 (pot 1), win 150 lose 150 (pot 2) and win 150 win 150 (pot 3), giving you the same 300 profit.It basically makes it like you have 6 smaller pots to win or lose (at the same odds) instead of 3 large pots. It just is a way some players like to safeguard themselves from losing a really huge pot all at one time.Secondly, as bgfoot said, the $100K that was being exchanged at the end was Daniel giving Todd a $100K loan since he had just busted him out.Mark

[Jeepster80125 0]

it was an amazingly obv questionps, what was todd doing!

You, sir, are an idiot. It may be obvious, but to the amateurs that browse here it may not be so obvious.ps. he had two overs and knew he was beat, therefore the two runs.pps. please stop posting. ppps. Thanks, from everyone else here.EDIT:pppps. See you in hell.