Combatting Live Tells

[Sheiky 0]

I play mostly online, where I play generaly $25NL $10-20 tourneys etc.But my friends are interested in poker now so I'm starting to play live more often.When I play live, I feel I give of some super obvious tells, and whenever I raise without the nuts my heart starts to pump, which is incredibly annoying and gay as I play for the same stakes online and don't feel a thing.How do I A. Stop getting an adrenalin rush whenever I three bet someone and B. Stop giving away obvious tells?Do you live players have some set routine for every decision so that you become unreadable?

[ChuckP 0]

You obviously do not have a lot of experience playing live games. I would try and play more live games to become more experienced. Your probably not giving off as many tells as you think. If your friends are new at poker, they will not pick up on tells. I would really focus on keeping your facial expressions the same whether you have the nuts or your are bluffing someone. You need to have your opponents guessing about what you really have. Try and read a couple poker books. They are really helpful for inexperienced players.

[KingJames 11]

Sheik,I was the same way when I started playing live. My heart would pound and my palms were sweaty when I was in a good sized pot.As stated above, you're probably giving away less than you think. I would work on remaining calm (breathing is key). When I make a 3 bet, bluff or value, I try to do the same things. I make the bet, verbally and put the chips out, then I go into the tank and pick a spot and stare, without answering any questions.Just like online play, betting patterns are going to give away more info than heart rate and twitches, so if you are playing TAG, deceptive poker you'll be fine.GL

[Acid_Knight 2]

Buy Read Em and Reap.Read.Stop doing the bad things he talks about.Profit.

[kingcon31 0]

Yeah I used to have my heart race a lot when I started playing, but after too long it stopped happening. I don't know if that happens for everyone, but I guess I just got used to the thrill of playing a big hand.Anyways one of the best things I do is chew gum. I really feel like chewing gum controls my breathing and doing stupid stuff like smiling in weird situations. Also, sort of like a previous guy posted, when I make a big bet on the river I do a Barry Greenstein like thing where I just look down at the table (usually at the pot).Also, when I play I noticed most people dont act at similar speeds all the time. Make sure you take a similar amount of time for each decison. Dont act quickly on a bluff or when you have a good hand, and then act slowly when you got the opposite type of hand.

[Giggidy 0]

As stated above, you're probably giving away less than you think.

Especially if they're new to the game - just play ABC, overcharge them for flushes/straights etc

[gfry11 0]

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[gfry11 0]

I feel the biggest transition between online and live seems to be thinking everything through...in other words...SLOW DOWN.I mean EVERYTHING. There is no need to rush like in online...don't get the clock called on you everytime...but take it easy and let the action come to you.Some things I started to do:--Calculate the pot when the action gets to you, not before. --Preflop, don't look at your cards until the pot gets to you.--As always, when you bluff, don't do it just to bluff...and unless the table is exactly right...bluff about a third as much as you would online.--Don't be so afraid to lose.I know these seem very obvious, but it helped me get started as far as feeling more comfortable. The third one seems super obvious, but my reasoning is that when bluffs are well thought out and calculated, you are going to feel very confident in them...dramatically calming you down. This is why I think players play so much better when they are on a roll...they are super-confident, and are absolutely sure they are making the right play. Also, at the levels you are playing, your tells are not being read as much as you think.For the last one, yeah, don't TRY to lose, but your bluffs aren't going to work everytime , and when a bluff gets called it may seem silly when you have to show it. If you do...who cares...you're not there to impress others by your play, let them think what they want. When I throw in a bluff, value, or make a hero call...I ALWAYS tell myself it's going to work...if it doesn't, then I don't sweat it. I learn from the mistake, or give the other player credit for outplaying me, and play the next hand.

[TravisG 0]

Mhm, i guess if you're not the live type it will never stop. i played (and took down) a shitload of live tournaments now and the high pressure when i bluff has just never gone away. i just don't do anything like rubbing my nose anymore (sounds stupid but i really did that in the beginning whenever i 3bet bluffed or whatever).

[copernicus 0]

I disagree with one notion above, which is on bluffing. Bluffing is much more profitable live. Online you'll be called down a lot by marginal hands that think "hey, theres another one starting in 1/2 hour". Live you'll also get a lot fewer calls to light 3 bets and 4 bets.A few tricks:before you take an action think about the same non-poker related thing....a song lyric, a movie scene, an ex gf, a vicious scrum...something that has meaning, so it takes you out of poker momentarily and into that situation. that will calm down a lot of the shakes and similar tellsmaintain the same seating position throughout a hand. it doesnt have to be the same hand to hand, but dont adjust during a hand. Foot/leg position is particularly important if anyone has a view of themcover your mouth, ala Chris Ferguson. Sunglasses if they arent too out of place for the environment/seriousness of the gametake the same amount of time to take any action, unless you really need to go into the tank for a decision...but dont act quickly unless youre folding. along the same line, develop a routine you follow for every action..the way you look at your hole cards, what you do after you look (always putting a chip on top of them, always holding them in your hand whether youre going to muck or not, etc), your action after a board card falls (watching other players, not flashing down to your own stack when a gin card hits etc).never talk during a critical situation...its not always what you say, but how you say it, and anything you say could be intepreted totally differently than you think it will be!think of all of your routines as a predator camoflouging himself from his prey

[TravisG 0]

I disagree with one notion above, which is on bluffing. Bluffing is much more profitable live. Online you'll be called down a lot by marginal hands that think "hey, theres another one starting in 1/2 hour". Live you'll also get a lot fewer calls to light 3 bets and 4 bets.

i was to add something like that to my post after i submitted it, but i forgot it and moved on. so yeah, live players seem to be more aware of their tournament live than online players, which makes moves like 3bet shoving with a flush draw more profitable than online.

[gfry11 0]

i was to add something like that to my post after i submitted it, but i forgot it and moved on. so yeah, live players seem to be more aware of their tournament live than online players, which makes moves like 3bet shoving with a flush draw more profitable than online.

Agreed here...I was thinking along the lines of cash games where reloading is possible. Bluffing in tournaments is MUCH more difficult to do online.

[bobbywithani 0]

Have a couple of drinks, if you are able to stop after two. That will help you relax a lot.

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

Try this...http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...howtopic=125247

[Kaveros 0]

Just block it out. I know that probably wont help but that is the best way I can explain.Ignore all your feelings. It is just a game and it doesnt matter. Just ignore, that is all i can say.One major reason for giving up tells however is the reaction you give to your opponents.So when I perhaps make a big bet at the river or put in a large raise on the turn, I often close my eyes.When I cannot see my oponent looking at me it makes me a lot more comfortable.Just remember though that if you are playing against average players, especially people who play online, they probably arent aware of live tells for the most part and it shouldnt be muchof a problem if you are giving them off.edit:Just keep a straight face.Before I starte playing live I would wath Antonius. Watch the way he plays his bluffs and his value bets. No difference.No expression. It will be hard at first but after a while you should begin to numb yourselfdouble edit:could you give us some examples of the tells you think you are giving off?Are they hand twitches, blinking, or just a really fast heart beat?

[PokerPatty 0]

The more tournaments you play the better you will become with your tells. It's a good starting point that you are aware of them, now you can work on them.

[Sheiky 0]

could you give us some examples of the tells you think you are giving off?Are they hand twitches, blinking, or just a really fast heart beat?

It's not something totaly definitive I think (IE I don't start taking apart an oreo whenever I bluff), It's more of a whole demeanour change and I think my facial expression changes a lot too. Like, one example, I was playing HU with a player I know well and I get kings in the BB and he raises, I start to debate whether I should re-raise of flat and all of a sudden I notice i'm acting completely differently. I'm taking more time for a start, i'm looking at different areas on the table, I'm looking at what's in the pot and how much I have to call, I'm counting out the chips needed for a call and calculating how much I should raise.I definitely agree that I'm probably not giving away as much as I think I am, but I play against the same three people regulary and i'm 90% certain that there are times they act differently based purely on their read of me (and normaly they're right). It doesn't help that I'm the type of guy that can never keep a straight face even to the most unfunny of jokes either.Thanks a lot for the replies everyone, I think they've been very helpful and next time I play i'm going to take some suggestions and put them into practice.

[Dejo56 0]

One big thing, whether you got the nuts or not: shut your mouth. Experienced players will look at if/how you are talking and see that as some sort of sign. After bluffing, it's natural to have a bit of an adrenaline rush, but if you keep your mouth shut and don't fiddigt (i.e. look at cards again, force a laugh, make awkward movements) you should be okay. Then again, more experienced players don't look too much at that, unless they perceive them as amateurs.PS: You can look down and try to focus on something else, but make sure to do this always, not only when you (semi-)bluff.

[AimHigher 0]

Good thread, I am similarly unexperienced at live play. I was once playing in a $55 tourney in Toronto. In an early hand I moved in with kings on a raise and a call and the player to my right looked at me and was like, "Hmmmmmm."I couldn't help but start cracking up. It was like an involuntary reaction. Later on in the session, it open folded to me in the SB and I moved in on him short with K9. He did the same thing and this time I laughed, but it was clearly less geniune. He called with AT and it was over.I've regretted it ever since because I made it riduclously obvious. He was probably calling anyway, but I made the decision infinitely easier on him.

[Bessel 0]

I think a major reason I (and maybe you) feel relaxed playing online poker is that it is in dollars and thus doesn't feel "real". If it were in pounds, I would find it much more difficult distance myself from the monetary value of decisions.Are you playing live cash games or donkaments? I would find a cash game extremely hard having learnt to play in dollar amounts online.

[Sheiky 0]

Good thread, I am similarly unexperienced at live play. I was once playing in a $55 tourney in Toronto. In an early hand I moved in with kings on a raise and a call and the player to my right looked at me and was like, "Hmmmmmm."I couldn't help but start cracking up. It was like an involuntary reaction. Later on in the session, it open folded to me in the SB and I moved in on him short with K9. He did the same thing and this time I laughed, but it was clearly less geniune. He called with AT and it was over.I've regretted it ever since because I made it riduclously obvious. He was probably calling anyway, but I made the decision infinitely easier on him.

Oh god I'm the worst at this. Once I tried to make one of my mates who likes to make massive folds lay down KQ on a K8xJKr board on the river to a 3/4 pot bet. He was thinking for ages and ages and he flipped his cards up to see my reaction, I was so incredulous that he was even thinking about folding that I started to crack up, I was close to saying 'OMFG ****ING CALL YOU HAVE THE NUTS'. He ended up folding, but the other people in the game knew I was bluffing pretty easily because of my reaction.

[rivergirl 2]

Yeah I used to have my heart race a lot when I started playing, but after too long it stopped happening. I don't know if that happens for everyone, but I guess I just got used to the thrill of playing a big hand.Anyways one of the best things I do is chew gum. I really feel like chewing gum controls my breathing and doing stupid stuff like smiling in weird situations. Also, sort of like a previous guy posted, when I make a big bet on the river I do a Barry Greenstein like thing where I just look down at the table (usually at the pot).Also, when I play I noticed most people dont act at similar speeds all the time. Make sure you take a similar amount of time for each decison. Dont act quickly on a bluff or when you have a good hand, and then act slowly when you got the opposite type of hand.

Personally i used to chew alot of gum live, mainly cause i'm a smoker and it keeps me occupied since i can't just light up at the table. I later found out, that gum chewing creates a big tell live. For instance chewing harder or faster when in a hand....actually had someone tell me it was the only thing they could pick up on me (as he was leaving the table of course). Its one of those things you don't realize (i never did), but spitting out the gum truly helped. My advice would be, learn to do the same thing everytime. I'm very chatty at a table, mainly cause i'm a girl and i get bored easily. But i stay chatty and hang into the conversation even when i'm in a hand. I continually do the same thing. Talking during a hand isn't necessarily a bad thing, unless it is the only time you speak. Find a routine, a betting pattern and stick to it, whether you are bluffing or you got the stone cold nuts. I try to spot unusual things in people's play, sticking to a game plan that stays consistent will not give anything away.

[aucu 3]

There are a lot of things you can do to clam up your tells, read the books to know what they are but some things I do-give yourself a mental 3 count before each bet/raise/fold/turn of a card,,,,,-stack you chips so you don't have to count them while betting, depends on you stakes but most of my stacks are $100 stacks 20x5 but I keep a couple stacks of $50 and $25 in front or on top so that the bets/raises are fluid and give off less tells-never re-look at your cards

[uncooper 1]

This whole article is awesome, but the section on Information Reciprocatlity addresses this issue nicely:http://tommyangelo.com/articles/reciprocality.htm

[Citizen Erased 0]

This seems like as good a topic as any to ask:I'm set to play a live game tomorrow night. What sort of tells should I look out for to give me an edge?The players aren't good enough to give out 2nd level and upwards tells, so just the basics should suffice :)Thanks a lot.