Lhe Challenge(?) Thread

[Smartluck 0]

I believe Danny is the only repeat in first names we have in this thread amongst regulars. I know we have a Jamie, Dustin, Marchant, Brad, Dutch, etc., but I don't think there is another repeat.Oh and Dutch's name is quite clearly Dutch and I'll not hear otherwise.

who is this refering to?

[antistuff 0]

this might not be as interesting as i thought it was. opponent is a good player. has stats like 24/14/2. he sees me as a maniac who has been playing 27/16/2 full ring. i still do not think he is capping oop light. i'm thinking about his range hereLimit Holdem Ring gameLimit: $1/$28 playersConverterPre-flop: (8 players) Hero is BB with 2 A 6 folds, SB raises, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, Hero calls.Flop: K A 5 (7SB, 2 players)SB bets, Hero calls.Turn: 3 (4.5BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero checks.River: A (4.5BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.Results:Final pot: 6.5BB

[Dirtydutch 8]

who is this refering to?

Navy, I believe.

[DinkDonk 1]

I'm glad Brad quoted this, because I somehow missed it.Yeah, interesting stuff. I tend to try to pick on pots people are passive in and get out of the way when the situation is marginal and a few idiots seem interested, but I've been starting to realize that I need to get a little tighter with my opens and a little looser with my 3-bets. I've never really put enough emphasis on PF play, I guess, also.

The preflop decisions in a vacuum are for the most part really marginal in EV difference. The thing is, they are very important in having effects on other things. You can significantly widen your ranges for almost no cost. Also, preflop spewing can do wonders for your image. People will see you 3-bet with like 57s and think that you're a horrendous spew monkey without realizing that it's like a tiny mistake at most in certain situations. It garners you a ton of action in spots where they make exponentially bigger mistakes as a result of their flawed image of you.So my point is that while pre-flop play decisions has comparatively little effect on your win-rate when you look at it decision by decision, it sets a framework for your entire dynamic with players and even entire tables. It can allow you to greatly improve the EV of post-flop decisions and that makes it quite important.

[Dirtydutch 8]

The preflop decisions in a vacuum are for the most part really marginal in EV difference. The thing is, they are very important in having effects on other things. You can significantly widen your ranges for almost no cost. Also, preflop spewing can do wonders for your image. People will see you 3-bet with like 57s and think that you're a horrendous spew monkey without realizing that it's like a tiny mistake at most in certain situations. It garners you a ton of action in spots where they make exponentially bigger mistakes as a result of their flawed image of you.So my point is that while pre-flop play decisions has comparatively little effect on your win-rate when you look at it decision by decision, it sets a framework for your entire dynamic with players and even entire tables. It can allow you to greatly improve the EV of post-flop decisions and that makes it quite important.

Sounds like I'm making a pretty massive mistake, then. I'm delighted to hear this; thanks.

[DinkDonk 1]

You should see they guy! Smokin hot too!

I'm going to have to agree on this one. He happened to use his internet espionage powers to find me on facebook, so I obv looked through his pictures and he and his wife are quite the attractive couple. Though in a few pictures he did look quite similar to McLovin.

[Dirtydutch 8]

I assume Marchant is Cobalt?

[Painter567 0]

I'm going to have to agree on this one. He happened to use his internet espionage powers to find me on facebook, so I obv looked through his pictures and he and his wife are quite the attractive couple. Though in a few pictures he did look quite similar to McLovin.

Def could pass for McLovin with lighter hair!Ok, damn, got to get some sleep tonight!

[Painter567 0]

I assume Marchant is Cobalt?

Yep

[antistuff 0]

i like limp reraising from utg and utg+1. i'm trying to balance my range that i do it with. the guy who capped pre runs like 36/11/4. this most definitely could be an ego thing and he could be capping with 100% of his raising range here, as hes not gonna let someone limp/3 bet him!!! given that read i opted for a very passive line postflop. Full Tilt PokerLimit Holdem Ring gameLimit: $1/$29 playersConverterPre-flop: (9 players) Hero is UTG with A K Hero calls, 3 folds, MP3 calls, CO folds, Button raises, SB folds, BB calls, Hero 3-bets, MP3 folds, Button caps, BB calls, Hero calls.Flop: 7 K 7 (13.5SB, 3 players)BB checks, Hero checks, Button bets, BB folds, Hero calls.Turn: J (7.75BB, 2 players)Hero checks, Button bets, Hero calls.River: 8 (9.75BB, 2 players)Hero checks, Button bets, Hero calls.Results:Final pot: 11.75BB

[DinkDonk 1]

Sounds like I'm making a pretty massive mistake, then. I'm delighted to hear this; thanks.

Keep in mind that I'm not recommending a complete overhaul of your pre-flop game. Just make subtle changes. Like, if a spot is marginal and a guy doesn't have a solid read on you, consider taking a more aggressive approach than normal.For example, a guy sits down on your left and in his second orbit he opens from the cutoff- if you 3bet him with a suited connector and happen to show it down, he's not at all going to consider that what you did preflop was like a .1BB (this is a completely trivial number for this spot and shouldn't be thought of as mathematically contrived) mistake at most, he's just going to say ZOMG he reraised me with 7 high! And that image is going to stick with him for as long as he plays with you. And not only that, but if other regs are at the table and see it, they are at least going to somewhat consider you to have a wider 3-betting range than you actually do.

[DinkDonk 1]

Anti, I love the A2 line. The AK one I think is prettttty close. I sort of like your line, but I think c/r the flop miiiight have more value? I'm really not all that experienced with FR, though. In any case, I love the way you think about the game.

[Dirtydutch 8]

Keep in mind that I'm not recommending a complete overhaul of your pre-flop game. Just make subtle changes. Like, if a spot is marginal and a guy doesn't have a solid read on you, consider taking a more aggressive approach than normal.For example, a guy sits down on your left and in his second orbit he opens from the cutoff- if you 3bet him with a suited connector and happen to show it down, he's not at all going to consider that what you did preflop was like a .1BB (this is a completely trivial number for this spot and shouldn't be thought of as mathematically contrived) mistake at most, he's just going to say ZOMG he reraised me with 7 high! And that image is going to stick with him for as long as he plays with you. And not only that, but if other regs are at the table and see it, they are at least going to somewhat consider you to have a wider 3-betting range than you actually do.

Yeah, I totally understand. Cool stuff. I'm always really happy to figure out I'm making a mistake, weird as that seems.Also, I'm not saying I never 3-bet with a suited connector. I just statistically don't do it enough, apparently.

[checkymcfold 0]

i kinda quit playing because i think this discussion is more +ev than making money atm.dutch, something else to keep in mind is that "statistically" isn't really what matters in terms of achieving what you want to get out of it in the end, but rather the number of SHOWDOWNS you make when you do it. if i'm multitabling a lot, i actually keep track of the last time i did something wonky (or that would be perceived that way) in my notes, so i have a better feel for when i need to do it again in order to keep looking retarded.antistuff, i like the line with a2 and don't mind your line with ak, but i raise somewhere with the ak most of the time, i think. usually on the river.

[Dirtydutch 8]

this might not be as interesting as i thought it was. opponent is a good player. has stats like 24/14/2. he sees me as a maniac who has been playing 27/16/2 full ring. i still do not think he is capping oop light. i'm thinking about his range hereLimit Holdem Ring gameLimit: $1/$28 playersConverterPre-flop: (8 players) Hero is BB with 2 A 6 folds, SB raises, Hero 3-bets, SB caps, Hero calls.Flop: K A 5 (7SB, 2 players)SB bets, Hero calls.Turn: 3 (4.5BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero checks.River: A (4.5BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.Results:Final pot: 6.5BB

I mentioned the other night I've been using this line a ton. I think it's probably pretty common and effective at the mid stakes, but its relevancy is working its way down the ladder.

[Dirtydutch 8]

i kinda quit playing because i think this discussion is more +ev than making money atm.

As did I about an hour ago.

[checkymcfold 0]

just to brag a little, though, i'm up a very slightly short bankroll in the last two days and last 1700 hands.

[Dirtydutch 8]

just to brag a little, though, i'm up a very slightly short bankroll in the last two days and last 1700 hands.

The braggiest part is that you've played more than 40 hands in the last two days.

[checkymcfold 0]

The braggiest part is that you've played more than 40 hands in the last two days.

i played almost 10k hands last week. i've been working REALLY hard on upping my stamina and drive to grind it out, and it's finally paying dividends after a couple frustrating months of learning how to play 3-4 tables without sucking hard.

[Smartluck 0]

yo-yo contest on FSN...

[Dirtydutch 8]

i played almost 10k hands last week. i've been working REALLY hard on upping my stamina and drive to grind it out, and it's finally paying dividends after a couple frustrating months of learning how to play 3-4 tables without sucking hard.

Do you have any techniques you recommend for this or pretty much just tough it out? I played 3,000 straight on the 28th, and it killed my will to live.

[checkymcfold 0]

Do you have any techniques you recommend for this or pretty much just tough it out? I played 3,000 straight on the 28th, and it killed my will to live.

embrace the emptiness that we kid ourselves into thinking is life, then take one more step further and you'll be playing 2k hands a day.seriously, though--i think it's a mistake to push yourself too fast, all at once. what i did was make myself play about 50-75 hands more than i felt like for a pretty lengthy period of time, and eventually i got to where i wanted to be. now even 1k doesn't feel like a lot.

[Dirtydutch 8]

I only did it to retain my VIP status. I quit two hands after I achieved it (I ran like hell; -180BB, and didn't play too well), and collapsed to the floor.

[checkymcfold 0]

I only did it to retain my VIP status. I quit two hands after I achieved it (I ran like hell; -180BB, and didn't play too well), and collapsed to the floor.

i'm glad i don't know what you look like, because that makes this mental image a lot more entertaining.i just busted a guy for another 25BB in about 11 hands HU. i am a sick motherfucker.i think that my favorite part of demoralizing a guy in HULHE is that point at which he says "omg this guy wtf i'm not going to bet anymore unless i have top pair" and basically decides to slowly hand you the rest of his money.

[Dirtydutch 8]

i'm glad i don't know what you look like, because that makes this mental image a lot more entertaining.

I think it's funnier if I'm really fat, too. Everything is funnier if you're really fat.