New Challenge (old Challenge)

[tskillz187 0]

So I intend on posting more hands here so that I can plug the many leaks I have in my game. I hope that's not a problem with anyone.If people could explain their reasoning, that would be great, too.I'm currently on my Mac, so have no HUD, but the villain in this hand keeps complaining about how bad he runs...Absolute PokerNo Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.10/$0.255 playersConverterPre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with UTG calls, CO folds, Hero raises to $1.1, 2 folds, UTG calls.Flop: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero checks.Okay, on a board this low I decided to check behind as I'd expect people to check/raise this as a bluff a large percentage of the time, and I'd prefer to just take the free card. Turn: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG calls.I think a delayed c-bet here works better as it looks a lot stronger than betting the flop, and when he checks the turn I know his range has got to be pretty weak.River: ($7.05, 2 players)UTG bets $3.77, Hero calls.No idea why I flatted. I'm a ridiculous nit. If you raise, which I'm assuming you would, how much do you make it, and do we call a shove?

Train wreck hand. You hafta bet this flop, you play great against almost any hand, bet if you get c/r laugh, smile, then clap your hands, then reraise. On the turn when you miss now it's not bad to take your free card, on the river you are obv raising. I'd make it $14 or so, probably just put him in depending on stacks.

[NoSup4U 0]

So I intend on posting more hands here so that I can plug the many leaks I have in my game. I hope that's not a problem with anyone.If people could explain their reasoning, that would be great, too.I'm currently on my Mac, so have no HUD, but the villain in this hand keeps complaining about how bad he runs...Absolute PokerNo Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.10/$0.255 playersConverterPre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with UTG calls, CO folds, Hero raises to $1.1, 2 folds, UTG calls.Flop: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero checks.Okay, on a board this low I decided to check behind as I'd expect people to check/raise this as a bluff a large percentage of the time, and I'd prefer to just take the free card. Turn: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG calls.I think a delayed c-bet here works better as it looks a lot stronger than betting the flop, and when he checks the turn I know his range has got to be pretty weak.River: ($7.05, 2 players)UTG bets $3.77, Hero calls.No idea why I flatted. I'm a ridiculous nit. If you raise, which I'm assuming you would, how much do you make it, and do we call a shove?

I think the iso raise pf is fine. You should bet this flop almost always. If villain does check raise bluff this flop, you make even more money because then you shove all in over the top of him and he folds. Do you see why given your logic betting this flop is much better?Logic on the turn is incorrect imo. If you don't bet the flop and now you bet the turn, villains think you are full of shit and call you down with A high. I would still bet the turn though assuming I bet the flop, and planning to shove the river unless it bricks off like a 7 or below.River you have the second nut flush vs a villain who probably isn't any good, plus it doesn't look like you could possibly have a flush here so I would raise a lot of the time because it doesn't look like villain could have a boat given how he played the hand. I think hand reading at the lower limits can be a little dicey because you see donkeys check down sets and stuff all the time. But if villain is competent, he never has a boat here and probably will call a river raise with any Q.Mark

[RDog 0]

Strat/Theory QuestionI feel like im getting 3bet a lot lately which I feel like I deal with pretty well except when I have semi good hands. Here is a hand to explain what I mean. Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (5 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comsaw flopMP ($152.55)Hero (Button) ($136.45)SB ($118)BB ($232.10)UTG ($59.35)Preflop: Hero is Button with 10, 102 folds, Hero raises to $3.50, SB raises to $12, 1 fold, Hero raises to $27, 1 foldTotal pot: $25 | Rake: $0So normally when im in position my standard play is to flat here and play post flop. But I feel like when I have hands like 99-JJ losing a lot of value b.c. I end up folding to a lot of cbets when overcards flop or calling down when I flop an over pair and losing. So what I have been trying out recently is 4betting small preflop and folding if my opponent shoves or 5bets. My thinking behind the play is that I can win the hand pre pretty cheap and If im beat I can get out semi cheap rather safe flop. I feel like this is a bad way to look at the hand b.c. im basically allow the villian to play perfect and fold all worse and shove all better. So my question is, is this a bad outlook on the hand? and how else can I attack these marginal spots

This is ALL Villain dependent. In general, I don't like 4 bet folding 99-JJ. I think those hands are too good to turn into a bluff. Button to blinds you should be 4 bet/calling with JJ regardless. If it is someone that in general 3 bets a ton or someone that has been 3 betting me a lot this session, I 4 bet/call there pretty much always with 99-TT because they are expecting you to be frustrated and 4 bet bluff a wide range so it increases their 5 bet shoving range. If it isn't someone that is 3 betting you a ton then I think calling is your best option with 99-TT. In general, I just think 4 bet/folding hands that are so strong is by far the worst option of the 3 in just about all situations.

[chgocubs99 0]

I bet/fold the river because there's no worse hands my hand can beat that he's doing that for value. He's not going to raise A10 on the river. Bet/folding also lets us control the price for showdown (if we get there.) Instead of c/c a pot sized bet, I lead for 1/3rd pot and fold to a raise under the assumption that he's raising for value here 98% of the time and a bluff spazz 2% of the time. Since we can't beat a hand in his value river raising range we fold.

I still don't think this the correct way to go about playing that river. I understand why you did it, I still think c/c is a better line. You're probably beat since we saw that he raised here, but if we didn't have that information, that logic is flawed. Say he had a different hand in his range and folded to your bet. He may bluff those same hands if you had just checked the river to him. The money you win there is > than the $10 or so you may lose check/calling a slightly bigger river bet than you made.

Train wreck hand. You hafta bet this flop, you play great against almost any hand, bet if you get c/r laugh, smile, then clap your hands, then reraise. On the turn when you miss now it's not bad to take your free card, on the river you are obv raising. I'd make it $14 or so, probably just put him in depending on stacks.

Agree with all this.

[Citizen Erased 0]

Firstly, thanks to both you guys for replying and helping me out. Your logic makes a lot more sense than mine.

Train wreck hand. You hafta bet this flop, you play great against almost any hand, bet if you get c/r laugh, smile, then clap your hands, then reraise. On the turn when you miss now it's not bad to take your free card, on the river you are obv raising. I'd make it $14 or so, probably just put him in depending on stacks.

Interesting point that both you and Mark made is that we want to be getting it in here. Are we saying we have the best hand here, or have decent equity if we get it in? Of course, we have two types of equity in this hand:Fold EquityOkay, obviously this folds out total bluffs, and one pair hands. The thing is with flop, in my opinion, is that a check/raise is air, or a set based on his call OOP pre-flop. I would not expect a set to flat on this board OOP, so that is his raising range and obviously he's not folding a set here, so yeah, that will be covered lately. Based on this guy's complaining about running bad, I'd expect him to begrudingly fold one-pair hands here, which are A2/A4/A8, all of which I expect him to call wth pre-flop, suited or not. Assuming I bet and he raises, we're probably looking at a bet of $2.25, and so he'd raise to ~$8. Villain and I both had $30 PF (stupid converter cut that out) so he'd have to call $21 more to win $39, so he's getting evens... Yeah, I think it's safe to say the majority of players would throw down one-pair here. Pot Equity If he does call, he's doing it with 22, 44, 88, and draws. I personally wouldn't him to check-raise draws but let's factor them in: 2 diamonds, and I guess 56. I'm not particularly familiar with using PokerStove, but I got these results:Board: 2d 4d 8hDead: equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 51.266% 51.27% 00.00% 22839 0.00 { KdTd }Hand 1: 48.734% 48.73% 00.00% 21711 0.00 { 88, 44, 22, AdQd, AdJd, Ad9d, Ad8d, Ad7d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad3d, QdJd, Qd9d, Qd8d, Qd7d, Qd6d, Qd5d, Qd3d, Jd9d, Jd8d, Jd7d, Jd6d, Jd5d, Jd3d, 9d8d, 9d7d, 9d6d, 9d5d, 9d3d, 8d7d, 8d6d, 8d5d, 8d3d, 7d6d, 7d5d, 7d3d, 6d5d, 6d3d, 5d3d }and KevinFHS got these results, which assigns a tigher range than mine:Board: 2d 4d 8h Dead: equity win tie pots won pots tied Hand 0: 35.745% 35.74% 00.00% 8493 0.00 { KdTd } Hand 1: 64.255% 64.26% 00.00% 15267 0.00 { 88, 44, 22, Ad9d, Ad8d, Ad7d, Ad6d, Ad5d, Ad3d, QdJd, Jd8d, 9d8d, 8d7d, 8d6d, 7d5d, 6d5d, 6d3d, 5d3d }Would you agree with the ranges here? If so, that means we're actually a favourite and so it's actually profitable to shove (slightly disregarding the weighting of ranges, which I believe we can't factor in) for me, but it's not for Kev's range. Which would you agree with, and do you think we're actually ahead if we shove?

I think the iso raise pf is fine. You should bet this flop almost always. If villain does check raise bluff this flop, you make even more money because then you shove all in over the top of him and he folds. Do you see why given your logic betting this flop is much better?Logic on the turn is incorrect imo. If you don't bet the flop and now you bet the turn, villains think you are full of shit and call you down with A high. I would still bet the turn though assuming I bet the flop, and planning to shove the river unless it bricks off like a 7 or below.River you have the second nut flush vs a villain who probably isn't any good, plus it doesn't look like you could possibly have a flush here so I would raise a lot of the time because it doesn't look like villain could have a boat given how he played the hand. I think hand reading at the lower limits can be a little dicey because you see donkeys check down sets and stuff all the time. But if villain is competent, he never has a boat here and probably will call a river raise with any Q.Mark

I definitely agree with the difficulty of reading hands at these levels. I mean obviously a good player would fold half the range I've given above through PokerStove, but since I know basically nothing about ths villain, I have to assign him a regular $25nl range, which, I think you'd agree, is as wide as I've made it. Still, assigning hand ranges is something I'm definitely trying to work a lot on.Looking back, I have no idea why I don't raise the river. I guess I have an awful case of MonstersUnderTheBed syndrome - robbing me of value since 2007 :(Thanks again for the replies, guys. Definitely helps a lot.Hope my reply's not too long.

[chgocubs99 0]

With the fold equity you can use either range and it's still a good shove.Edit: Plus he's going to just call with some of those one pair hands and a wide variety of others. Then you get to see the turn and re-evaluate in position.

[cardcore 0]

my morningyawn

[RDog 0]

So I intend on posting more hands here so that I can plug the many leaks I have in my game. I hope that's not a problem with anyone.If people could explain their reasoning, that would be great, too.I'm currently on my Mac, so have no HUD, but the villain in this hand keeps complaining about how bad he runs...Absolute PokerNo Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.10/$0.255 playersConverterPre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with UTG calls, CO folds, Hero raises to $1.1, 2 folds, UTG calls.Flop: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero checks.Okay, on a board this low I decided to check behind as I'd expect people to check/raise this as a bluff a large percentage of the time, and I'd prefer to just take the free card. Turn: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG calls.I think a delayed c-bet here works better as it looks a lot stronger than betting the flop, and when he checks the turn I know his range has got to be pretty weak.River: ($7.05, 2 players)UTG bets $3.77, Hero calls.No idea why I flatted. I'm a ridiculous nit. If you raise, which I'm assuming you would, how much do you make it, and do we call a shove?

Another point that I don't think has been made. Poker, for the most part is completely about equity. You want money to go in the pot when your equity is good and limit the amount of money that goes in the pot when your equity is bad. On that flop. you have a TON of equity against most hands, you lose half on brick turns. By not betting the flop and waiting until the turn you are putting your money in backwards. Checking when you have more equity and betting when you have less. In the end, this line is losing you money cause long term...........more equity = more money for you.Edit: Also, you should never be worried about being CR when you have good equity.

[Acid_Knight 2]

my morningyawn

[ ] smooth[x] profit

[KHSPoker21 0]

[ ] smooth[x] profit

[x] omaha

[Sheiky 0]

So I intend on posting more hands here so that I can plug the many leaks I have in my game. I hope that's not a problem with anyone.If people could explain their reasoning, that would be great, too.I'm currently on my Mac, so have no HUD, but the villain in this hand keeps complaining about how bad he runs...Absolute PokerNo Limit Holdem Ring gameBlinds: $0.10/$0.255 playersConverterPre-flop: (5 players) Hero is Button with UTG calls, CO folds, Hero raises to $1.1, 2 folds, UTG calls.Flop: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero checks.Okay, on a board this low I decided to check behind as I'd expect people to check/raise this as a bluff a large percentage of the time, and I'd prefer to just take the free card. Turn: ($2.55, 2 players)UTG checks, Hero bets $2.25, UTG calls.I think a delayed c-bet here works better as it looks a lot stronger than betting the flop, and when he checks the turn I know his range has got to be pretty weak.River: ($7.05, 2 players)UTG bets $3.77, Hero calls.No idea why I flatted. I'm a ridiculous nit. If you raise, which I'm assuming you would, how much do you make it, and do we call a shove?

What others have said + if this is a standard example of how you generally play, then I think you're giving up a tonne and being far too weak-tight. You're eyes should light up when this flop comes. I'm saying to myself 'Oh awesome, I hope he decides to c/r so I can shove it in', you're going to be mis reading a lot of situations if you look at this flop and say 'That's ok, but if he check-raises, I don't like the situation that much so i'll check' On the river too, this is where your money at $25nl is won! It's in value towning these clueless fish to death, it's in 3 barrelling top pair second kicker because you know he'll never check all three streets with better, it's in playing 2-pair+ strong and getting it in against weak draws and one pair hands, and it's in value-raising second nut flushes!

[nutzbuster 7]

my morningyawn

aids(can I haz some?)

[chgocubs99 0]

Kind of amusing...from hand 376 to 481 I was playing a guy at 1-2NL, and he went from $120 to $20, and we never showed down a hand once.

[BSmitty23 0]

Didnt play at all yesterday, and ran pretty bad today to start, then I see a guy sitting at 1/2 who I've won a decent amount off of before. He's a reg, but for some reason I just hold it over him. Obv he was tilted, and my fav hand of the day ensued.Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $2.00 BB (2 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comHero (SB) ($922.50)Button ($200)Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, QButton raises to $6, Hero raises to $18, Button raises to $48, Hero raises to $922.50 (All-In), Button calls $152 (All-In)Flop: ($400) 7, 3, Q(2 players, 2 all-in)Turn: ($400) J(2 players, 2 all-in)River: ($400) 8(2 players, 2 all-in)Total pot: $400 | Rake: $0.50Results:Button had 6, A (high card, Ace).Hero had Q, Q (three of a kind, Queens).Outcome: Hero won $399.50Graph for the month so farGLGL All

[matchstix 0]

Anyone going to CAZ tonight?

[NoSup4U 0]

Anyone going to CAZ tonight?

I was just there Friday but won't be tonight. My buddy James will be there though. (not an FCPer)Mark

[tskillz187 0]

plz don't break my heart Eagles.

[RDog 0]

plz don't break my heart Eagles.

F the Iggles.

[Naismith 0]

I would pay half my poker roll for the Eagles to get blown out and Brian Dawkins tear up his leg on the last play of the game and have to retire.

[Jordan 1]

I would pay half my poker roll for the Eagles to get blown out and Brian Dawkins tear up his leg on the last play of the game and have to retire.

lol

[Acid_Knight 2]

I would pay half my poker roll for the Eagles to get blown out and Brian Dawkins tear up his leg on the last play of the game and have to retire.

Tell us how you really feel.

[ice4804 0]

gg shot-taking$0.5/$1 No Limit Holdem6 playersConverted at weaktight.comStacks:UTG ($95.50)UTG+1 ($55.70)Hero (CO) ($102.50)BTN ($103.90)SB ($119.80)BB ($69.20)Pre-flop: ($1.50, 6 players) Hero is CO UTG raises to $3.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $3.50, 3 foldsFlop: ($8.50, 2 players)UTG bets $6, Hero calls $6Turn: ($20.50, 2 players)UTG bets $20.50, Hero goes all-in $93, UTG goes all-in $65.50River: ($199.50, 2 players)Final Pot: $192.50UTG shows: Hero shows: UTG wins $189.50 ( won +$94 ) Hero wins $7 ( lost -$95.50 )turn shove was actually a mis-type but w/e. sigh...

[TB17 0]

I would pay half my poker roll for the Eagles to get blown out and Donovan McNabb tear up his already broken legs on the last play of the game and have to retire.

Agreed

[KHSPoker21 0]

I would pay half my poker roll for the Eagles to get blown out and Brian Dawkins tear up his leg on the last play of the game and have to retire.

/\ /\ congrats sir, you're a true bucs fan

[RDog 0]

gg shot-taking$0.5/$1 No Limit Holdem6 playersConverted at weaktight.comStacks:UTG ($95.50)UTG+1 ($55.70)Hero (CO) ($102.50)BTN ($103.90)SB ($119.80)BB ($69.20)Pre-flop: ($1.50, 6 players) Hero is CO UTG raises to $3.50, 1 fold, Hero calls $3.50, 3 foldsFlop: ($8.50, 2 players)UTG bets $6, Hero calls $6Turn: ($20.50, 2 players)UTG bets $20.50, Hero goes all-in $93, UTG goes all-in $65.50River: ($199.50, 2 players)Final Pot: $192.50UTG shows: Hero shows: UTG wins $189.50 ( won +$94 ) Hero wins $7 ( lost -$95.50 )turn shove was actually a mis-type but w/e. sigh...

Raise the flop 99.9% of the time.Also, .