meijin 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 With all of the Annie Duke hate posts going on, I decided to do a little research and see what the stats are as opposed to opinion and speculation from alot of folks that (for the most part) have never met either Annie, Jennifer or Kathy.From the Hendon Mob Database (excluding 2005 numbers)Annie Duke:$2,987,420 all time money winnings23rd on the all time money list6th place on the 2004 money list79th on the WSOP all time money list1st on the all time women's money list1 WSOP bracelet21 WSOP cashes3 WPT cashes with 1 final tableJennifer Harman:$1,347,331 all time money winnings71st on the all time money list84th on the 2004 money list3rd on the all time women's money list2 WSOP bracelets12 WSOP cashes8 WPT cashes with 2 final tablesKathy Liebert:$1,897, 457 all time money winnings44th all time money list2nd on the women's all time money list1 WSOP bracelet12 WSOP cashes8 WPT cashes with 3 final tablesSo, in looking at these stats, the 3 are pretty damn close to each other in accomplishments. We have the 1, 2 and 3 all time female money winners with Annie having the most as well as the most WSOP cashes. Jen has one more WSOP bracelets than the other two, but they all have at least one. Kathy has the better overall WPT record. So how can you trash any of them for these accomplishments? And for the Annie haters specifically, how many of you have a single bracelet or 21 WSOP cashes?I have met Annie and Jen. I got to spend alot of time around Annie (playing and not playing) over a 4 day period of time. I found her to be quite nice in all settings. I only met Jen briefly, but she was also quite nice.Personally, I would give Jen the edge in who is best. I do this because of her ability to play in the big limit cash games and do well...especially taking something like $9 million or $12 million off of Andy Beal when many of her male counterparts (like BG) could not even beat him in one setting. I don't believe that either Annie or Kathy have ever regularly played the 2K/4K or 4K/8K "big games". Maybe I am wrong and someone can correct me on this point.Give up on the hate...if you don't like her, fine...but if you want to trash her play then you are just flat wrong and the stats don't lie.Michael Link to post Share on other sites
lordchadwick 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Well said. Link to post Share on other sites
allinbluff35 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 subract the $2 million dollars she won in the "tournament of champions" last year Link to post Share on other sites
pokerloser 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Yes, but I ask, didn't 2 mill of Annies $ came from that 1 lame azz single table tourney after the wsop last year? And I would take Jennifer over the other 2 anyday in any cash game.This puts her $ under 1 mill. in my mind.Other than that your stats show a pretty level playing field overall.Nice stats meijin. Link to post Share on other sites
lordchadwick 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 subract the $2 million dollars she won in the "tournament of champions" last yearShe did beat some pretty heavy hitters in that game though.Not a big Anne fan, but still, I think she deserves more respect than this. Link to post Share on other sites
meijin 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Author Share Posted June 8, 2005 Fine...subtract it...she still has 1 WSOP bracelet in an open event, 21 WSOP cashes, 3 WPT cashes with a final table appearance. And this is chump change? This is something that can be accomplished by an over rated player who thinks too much of their own play? Bullshite.Michael Link to post Share on other sites
elkang 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Nice post. Let me just say that I only mind when she is proclaimed the greatest woman player.She is argurably not. Meanwhile, she can easily kick my ass at a poker table and I think she's good for poker. Link to post Share on other sites
CoolHandLaw 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 subract the $2 million dollars she won in the "tournament of champions" last yearWhy subtract it? Wasn't it a sanctioned event? Even if it wasn't, should it make a difference to her overall stats?I don't hate/like her..im indifferent. But just curious to know why should her $2million win make any difference. Link to post Share on other sites
pockets 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 For the record, there is nothing at all recent about the Annie Duke hatefest. This has been going on since the forum opened. Link to post Share on other sites
711Buddha 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 In regards to Annie,She is a consumate professional and deserves credit for that.However,She is NOT hot.I would not hit it.Not with a 10' pole.Not even if it was yours. Link to post Share on other sites
iveyfan30 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 ive never said she wasnt a good player, she obviously is.....i just think she is one of the most annoying ppl on the planet, well next anybody thats ever been on american idol.... Link to post Share on other sites
MilesZS 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Please, no more god damned posts about god damned Annie Duke. Why does anyone give a sh/t? Can we talk about what is ACTUALLY happening in poker rather than about god damned Annie Duke? I think I know why I hate her -- because there's a god damned Annie Duke thread every god damned day and I am tired of seeing her god damned name. Link to post Share on other sites
renaedawn 1 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Please, no more god damned posts about god damned Annie Duke. Why does anyone give a sh/t? Can we talk about what is ACTUALLY happening in poker rather than about god damned Annie Duke? I think I know why I hate her -- because there's a god damned Annie Duke thread every god damned day and I am tired of seeing her god damned name.dittoI've defended her in other posts because I have met her (just as a casual fan) and she was very nice to me.However, I am SO SICK of this god damned Annie Duke every freakin' day shit. We talk about her more than Daniel for cripe's sake! Link to post Share on other sites
dmoneypoker 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 subract the $2 million dollars she won in the "tournament of champions" last yearShe did beat some pretty heavy hitters in that game though.Not a big Anne fan, but still, I think she deserves more respect than this.Fossilman doubled her up twice with lame hands, then she beats Howard's 7-7 with 6-6. Yes that's poker, she beat the crap out of Hellmuth heads up, but even Annie herself has admitted she was a huge dog that day and got extremely lucky to win it. Obviously she is a highly skilled player, though.As for Jen Harman she is the best out of these 3 and one of the best oin the world because of her cash game record.... someone mentioned what she did against Beal? One session she beat him while her kidneys were failing... you can read this in "The Professor, The Banker and the Suicide King" which I expected to be a lot better but is very interesting in the least. The only ones to have consistent success vs Beal were Jen, Lederer and Todd Brunson and that includes doyle, chip, chau, gus, ivey and mr. best player in the world himself Barry Greenstein who got crushed every time. If i remember correctly Ted Forrest did ok too. Link to post Share on other sites
koa 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 I don't believe that either Annie or Kathy have ever regularly played the 2K/4K or 4K/8K "big games". Maybe I am wrong and someone can correct me on this point.MichaelThere only few people in the world that play in 4k/ 8K and those other two are definetely not one of them. Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 Please, no more god damned posts about god damned Annie Duke. Why does anyone give a sh/t? Can we talk about what is ACTUALLY happening in poker rather than about god damned Annie Duke? I think I know why I hate her -- because there's a god damned Annie Duke thread every god damned day and I am tired of seeing her god damned name.exactly Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWalsh 0 Posted June 8, 2005 Share Posted June 8, 2005 What I don't like is how many of the people hate her because of the whole DN fiasco and let this affect their perception of her talent. When I first started playing, Annie Duke was one of the names I knew, before DN and PI, Duke was a personality and given credit for being a good player. Link to post Share on other sites
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