preflop odds

[uwda 0]

Can someone help me with the math to calculate the odds of hitting a straight before the flop? I understand the basics of calculating odds based on unseen cards and outs, but if I've got 9-8, I could get a straight by getting 5-6-7, 6-7-T, 7-T-J, etc.

[PotDragon 0]

Not really sure what you are looking for that is not in any 1 of a hundred books. For the math...read some Skalansky.Or...click the link to the odds calculator.http://cardplayer.com/poker_odds/texas_hol...oldem/index.phpHope this helps.

[fryer98 30]

I think he's asking..."If I have 8-9 (or any connection cards), what is the percentage that I will get a straight?"Right?

[uwda 0]

Yes, that's right. Lots of books will tell you the odds of making a staight after you've got 4 connectors, and I understand the math behind that. It just gets way more complicated if you've only got 2 connectors with 5 cards coming.

[fryer98 30]

Yes, that's right.  Lots of books will tell you the odds of making a staight after you've got 4 connectors, and I understand the math behind that.  It just gets way more complicated if you've only got 2 connectors with 5 cards coming.

Well, I knew what you were asking, but I don't have the answer for you.The guys that I play against...they have a 99% chance, I swear.

[Sushiman 0]

You don't have to know the exact odds, and that's pretty pointless since even if you make the straight it might or might not be the nuts. What I find to be more helpful is the possibility of of each connector. Hands like 56, 78, 89 can each make 5 straights, 4 of which are the nut straight. Hands like 46, 57, 79 can also make 5 straights, but only 3 are the nut straight. Technically 10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight. The further apart the two cards, the less number of nut straights it can make.

[princeof56k 0]

Calculating the odds of a straight, without seeing flop yet, is a lot more complicated than trying to calculate making a flush under the same conditions. I tries to do it myself once, but I figured it wanst worth the effort.Remember the odds of making a straight when you have AK, 98, or 34 are all different. 98 has the best odds. 34 is worse. And AK is the worst (dont forget the one card 5432A straight).

[Canada 0]

From Mike Caro's site:Flopping a straight with QJ is 101 - 1.Obviously 89 is slightly better than this.If you use 100-1, it won't be far off....

[princeof56k 0]

From Mike Caro's site:Flopping a straight with QJ is 101 - 1.

Yes thats the odds for flopping a straight, but I think he was asking about the odds of making a straight if you go all the way to the river (and you can make a striaght anytime).

[mx957 0]

Can someone help me with the math to calculate the odds of hitting a straight before the flop? I understand the basics of calculating odds based on unseen cards and outs, but if I've got 9-8, I could get a straight by getting 5-6-7, 6-7-T, 7-T-J, etc.

Odds of hitting a straight before the flop = 0. Can't make a straight with only 2 cards (SW).

[crowTrobot 2]

10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight.

sure on the flop, but not not necessarily on turn or river obviously

[nbliss16 0]

I've got another question, sort of along those lines. How do you calculate your pot odds to something like, say, an all in re raise before the flop.For instance, say I am at the WSOP on day 4 (75$ ante, $300-$600 Blinds) of the main event (near the middle of the day) and I hold 10 10 in middle position and I come in for a $2400 raise and the cutoff re raises all in and his total stack in $45,000 and After my raise I got $32,000 left. How in the hell do you calculate your pot odds for something like that? Don't you have to put him on a hand in order to calculate your odds? Or is it a range of hands? How do you guys do this? What would it be if I held J10s or QQ? Does it change? I always here people say "he is seeing if he is getting the right price on his money" and I never understand it.Help me please!

[knght311 0]

10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight.

sure on the flop, but not not necessarily on turn or river obviously

every single one is the "nut straight"...not pure nuts

[fryer98 30]

I've got another question, sort of along those lines. How do you calculate your pot odds to something like, say, an all in re raise before the flop.For instance, say I am at the WSOP on day 4 (75$ ante, $300-$600 Blinds) of the main event (near the middle of the day) and I hold 10 10 in middle position and I come in for a $2400 raise and the cutoff re raises all in and his total stack in $45,000 and After my raise I got $32,000 left. How in the hell do you calculate your pot odds for something like that? Don't you have to put him on a hand in order to calculate your odds? Or is it a range of hands? How do you guys do this? What would it be if I held J10s or QQ? Does it change? I always here people say "he is seeing if he is getting the right price on his money" and I never understand it.Help me please!

Yes, you HAVE to put them on a hand.

[knght311 0]

I've got another question, sort of along those lines. How do you calculate your pot odds to something like, say, an all in re raise before the flop.For instance, say I am at the WSOP on day 4 (75$ ante, $300-$600 Blinds) of the main event (near the middle of the day) and I hold 10 10 in middle position and I come in for a $2400 raise and the cutoff re raises all in and his total stack in $45,000 and After my raise I got $32,000 left. How in the hell do you calculate your pot odds for something like that? Don't you have to put him on a hand in order to calculate your odds? Or is it a range of hands? How do you guys do this? What would it be if I held J10s or QQ? Does it change? I always here people say "he is seeing if he is getting the right price on his money" and I never understand it.Help me please!

yes you do have to figure out what he is holding...if you think that he has two overs...then the odds of you winning is roughly 50%...so if you have to call more than 50% of the pot...then "pot odds" dictate that it is a bad call...in this specific situation there is 49050 in the pot and it is 32000 to call...not good odds...but if you think he has a smaller pair...lik 99-22 then it is an easy call as you are 80-20 to win the pot1010 vs QQ you need atleast 150K in the pot to call if they have QQ1010 vs 10J...you are a 65% favorite so any call is fine

[princeof56k 0]

10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight.

sure on the flop, but not not necessarily on turn or river obviously

every single one is the "nut straight"...not pure nuts

The JT makes the nut straight when a J or T does not appear on the board. For example you hold JT and the villian has AJ. The board is KQT92. You do not have the nut straight. Sure it doesnt happen that often, but you have to consider this.

[Actuary 3]

I get 9.2% to get a str8 with 89 by the river.

[crowTrobot 2]

10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight.

sure on the flop, but not not necessarily on turn or river obviously

every single one is the "nut straight"...not pure nuts

exampleyou: JTflop: QK9 you have nut straight turn: T you don'totherwise i'm not sure what you mean by nut straight

[Eclypse 0]

Let’s do it for 9-8:There are 50 cards available for the flop so there are 19,600 total flop combinations:(50/3)*(49/2)*(48/1) = 19,600You can make a straight with 5-6-7, 6-7-T, 7-T-J or T-J-Q, which make up 256 of the 19,600 total combinations. You can get each 3-card straight-package on the flop 4*4*4 = 64 ways. Since there are 4 packages, there are 64*4 = 256 total ways to make a straight.There are 19,600 – 256 = 19,344 total combinations that DO NOT make a straight and 256 combinations that DO make a straight. Therefore, the odds are 19,344/256 = 75.56-to-1 against flopping a straight when you hold 9-8 (if the 9-8 is suited, you would have to remove the straight-flushes (there are 4) and re-calculate).So, to answer your question for 9-8 off-suit only, the odds are 75.56-to-1You should be able to figure out the rest now.

[Actuary 3]

the question included all 5 cards, not just on the flop

[Eclypse 0]

the question included all 5 cards, not just on the flop

Oops! I guess I should've read a few more posts. The original post was not clear on that.The first thing you have to do is decide if you want to include straights that use only one, or even none of your hole cards. Technically, you can make an Ace-high straight with 9-8 if you consider playing the board as part of the solution.

[Actuary 3]

my 9.2% comes from assuming both the 8 & 9 are necessarily used

[nbliss16 0]

I've got another question, sort of along those lines. How do you calculate your pot odds to something like, say, an all in re raise before the flop.For instance, say I am at the WSOP on day 4 (75$ ante, $300-$600 Blinds) of the main event (near the middle of the day) and I hold 10 10 in middle position and I come in for a $2400 raise and the cutoff re raises all in and his total stack in $45,000 and After my raise I got $32,000 left. How in the hell do you calculate your pot odds for something like that? Don't you have to put him on a hand in order to calculate your odds? Or is it a range of hands? How do you guys do this? What would it be if I held J10s or QQ? Does it change? I always here people say "he is seeing if he is getting the right price on his money" and I never understand it.Help me please!

yes you do have to figure out what he is holding...if you think that he has two overs...then the odds of you winning is roughly 50%...so if you have to call more than 50% of the pot...then "pot odds" dictate that it is a bad call...in this specific situation there is 49050 in the pot and it is 32000 to call...not good odds...but if you think he has a smaller pair...lik 99-22 then it is an easy call as you are 80-20 to win the pot1010 vs QQ you need atleast 150K in the pot to call if they have QQ1010 vs 10J...you are a 65% favorite so any call is fine

Thanks man that helped a ton.I think I have never gone further with this concept becuase you only get 30 seconds to act on your hands at the site I play on and it would take me longer then that to do the math. Thanks man

[TheTorpedo 0]

10J is the best connector because it can make 5 straights and every single one is the nut straight.

sure on the flop, but not not necessarily on turn or river obviously

every single one is the "nut straight"...not pure nuts

Assuming there is no T/J on the board. Example you hold TJ board is 2789J here QT beats youAnother example board 789TJ your TJ is useless anc certainly trumped by any Q (and KQ would be the nut straight)

[AndrewBlack 0]

I've got another question, sort of along those lines. How do you calculate your pot odds to something like, say, an all in re raise before the flop.For instance, say I am at the WSOP on day 4 (75$ ante, $300-$600 Blinds) of the main event (near the middle of the day) and I hold 10 10 in middle position and I come in for a $2400 raise and the cutoff re raises all in and his total stack in $45,000 and After my raise I got $32,000 left. How in the hell do you calculate your pot odds for something like that? Don't you have to put him on a hand in order to calculate your odds? Or is it a range of hands? How do you guys do this? What would it be if I held J10s or QQ? Does it change? I always here people say "he is seeing if he is getting the right price on his money" and I never understand it.Help me please!

yes you do have to figure out what he is holding...if you think that he has two overs...then the odds of you winning is roughly 50%...so if you have to call more than 50% of the pot...then "pot odds" dictate that it is a bad call...in this specific situation there is 49050 in the pot and it is 32000 to call...not good odds...but if you think he has a smaller pair...lik 99-22 then it is an easy call as you are 80-20 to win the pot1010 vs QQ you need atleast 150K in the pot to call if they have QQ1010 vs 10J...you are a 65% favorite so any call is fine

Thanks man that helped a ton.I think I have never gone further with this concept becuase you only get 30 seconds to act on your hands at the site I play on and it would take me longer then that to do the math. Thanks man

also!!!!!I Think its a good idea to put your opponent on a range of hands. (IE)if you know your opponent won't make this move with a pair smaller than 7's but would doit with 8's up and 2 big cards you can just look at it in a very logical sense. 2 hands you dominate (88 and 99) 4 hands CRUSH you aa kk qq jj, and a number of hands are a coinflip. for me to make this call, The pot would have to be laying me BETTER than 2:1 AND I would almost NEVER make this call if it meant risking my tournament life. Of course theres millions of other variables that can be thrown in there, but I just wanted to give a quick logical look at the situation.