New Challenge: Movin' On Up

[droberts 3]

KJ,Why the massive over bet with AK? I'd expect you to make it 4 or 5 bucks preflop there....

if i knew he was calling im 100% shoving.. once watched a guy either shove every hand or call pre flop no matter the raise, so i insta sat down at table and get AK first hand.. a few limpers including the maniac so i just shoved 100bbs from BB.. he snap called with 86o

[SuperJon 175]

first week at 25NLgoin' to play some live 1/2 tomorrow at the dog track. max 100 buy in is lame, but lotsa fishies.

[KingJames 11]

KJ,Why the massive over bet with AK? I'd expect you to make it 4 or 5 bucks preflop there....

they were both huge fish but I was really hoping to get the half stack min 3bettor to call with a worse ace. Like a range of all pairs and throw in some AQ AJ KQ and worse AX and we're doing pretty well.Nice Garf Jon!!!!!!!

[SuperJon 175]

Today's topic, flatting raises out of the blinds.Is it ever okay?Like most players, I'm a slight loser out of the blinds. Generally, when someone raises my blind, I'm either 3betting or folding. Of course, there are times when I have a hand that I would prefer to flat with. For example, a hand like 88 or AJs. Hands, that imo, are just being turned into bluffs by 3 betting unless the raiser is a LAG. I think hands like the ones in my example are able to c/c a decent amount of flops and re-eval on the turn.Any thoughts...

[Ninja Ace 1]

Today's topic, flatting raises out of the blinds.Is it ever okay?

Multiway yes, HU, generally, no. It's bad enough to be playing out of position with a weak hand, but to lose the advantage gained from being the aggressor as well... I simply just hate thinking about how to profit long term.

Generally, when someone raises my blind, I'm either 3betting or folding. Of course, there are times when I have a hand that I would prefer to flat with. For example, a hand like 88 or AJs. Hands, that imo, are just being turned into bluffs by 3 betting unless the raiser is a LAG.

Well they are and they aren't... especially if you're 3betting a lot wider... at which point you'll see buttons start doing silly things like flat 3bets with Ax suited, small suited connectors, and pretty much their entire open range just cuz they're tired of you 3betting, but they just aren't willing to stop stealing. And I can honestly say, even if say you have AJ and your opponent flats you with AQ... over the long term with all the boards that come out, if you're any decent at navigating post flop, even though your opponent has the stronger hand he should be the one losing net.And no matter what your range is... it's going to have a bottom. If the bottom isn't weak enough then you're just never going to get action. I'll give you an extreme example from a story I heard my gf tell about her sister down at Foxwoods this week. She was a new player and was afraid of raising preflop... for 3 hours she was dealt raisable things like 8's, AK, etc and always limped in. Finally after 3 hours she suddenly opens UTG to 10 big blinds. Of course everyone folded, and was surprised that she ONLY had Kings.

[KosinTrouble 0]

Same facking $hit every day....Full Tilt Poker $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 751060The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History ConverterMP: $3.74CO: $7.33Hero (BTN): $5.19SB: $5.00BB: $6.20UTG: $2.80Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero is BTN with 9 9 2 folds, CO raises to $0.10, Hero calls $0.10, 2 foldsFlop: ($0.27) 9 4 A (2 players)CO bets $0.05, Hero raises to $0.42, CO calls $0.37Turn: ($1.11) 7 (2 players)CO checks, Hero bets $1.11, CO calls $1.11River: ($3.33) A (2 players)CO bets $3.33, Hero raises to $3.56 all in, CO calls $0.23Final Pot: $10.45CO shows A 9 (a full house, Aces full of Nines)Hero shows 9 9 (a full house, Nines full of Aces)CO wins $9.76(Rake: $0.69)Full Tilt Poker $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players - View hand 751030The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History ConverterBTN: $8.31SB: $4.95Hero (BB): $5.20UTG: $5.22CO: $5.07Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero is BB with 9 9 2 folds, BTN raises to $0.17, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.12Flop: ($0.36) 9 A A (2 players)Hero bets $0.30, BTN calls $0.30Turn: ($0.96) A (2 players)Hero checks, BTN checksRiver: ($0.96) 9 (2 players)Hero checks, BTN bets $0.50, Hero raises to $4.73 all in, BTN calls $4.23Final Pot: $10.42BTN shows 7 A (four of a kind, Aces)Hero shows 9 9 (four of a kind, Nines)BTN wins $9.73(Rake: $0.69)Kosin Trouble

[hartman72 0]

Wow, those are pretty brutal.

[KingJames 11]

I run good:Dont have a cow, heres your converted handFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 6 playersUTG: $25.00 (Hero)UTG+1: $29.32 CO: $25.25 Button: $24.90 SB: $8.75 BB: $7.90 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with (6 players)UTG+1 folds, CO raises to $0.75, Button folds, BB calls $0.65, Hero calls $0.50Flop: ($2.25) (4 players)BB checks, Hero bets $1.50, CO raises to $6, BB folds, Hero raises to $24.25, and is all in, CO calls $18.25Turn: ($50.75) (3 players)River: ($50.75) (3 players)Hero showed , and won ($48.22) with a straight, Queen highCO showed , and lost with two pair, Kings and QueensHero won $48.22(Rake: $2.53)

[KingJames 11]

Feral Cow Poker Hand ConverterFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 6 playersSB i got tis man: $16.09 BB Scull44: $51.78 UTG voracious: $32.87 UTG+1 sonofgh: $12.95 CO NeverEasy2: $23.15 Button Hero: $25.00 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is Button with (6 players)3 folds, Hero raises to $0.60, i got tis man calls $0.50, Scull44 foldsFlop: ($1.45) (2 players)i got tis man bets $1, Hero raises to $3.25, i got tis man calls $2.25Turn: ($7.95) (2 players)i got tis man bets $7.95, Hero raises to $15.90, i got tis man calls $4.29, and is all inRiver: ($32.43) (2 players)i got tis man showed , and won ($30.81) with a flush, King highHero showed , and lost with three of a kind, Sevensi got tis man won $30.81(Rake: $1.62)

[KingJames 11]

Still had a nice +1bi day, but sighhhhhConverted by the cows of Feral Cow PokerFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 6 playersCO i got tis man: $31.48 Button Scull44: $51.08 SB voracious: $43.56 BB sonofgh: $11.60 UTG NeverEasy2: $23.15 UTG+1 Hero: $25.00 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG+1 with (6 players)NeverEasy2 folds, Hero raises to $0.85, i got tis man folds, Scull44 raises to $3, voracious folds, sonofgh raises to $11.60, and is all in, Hero raises to $25, and is all in, Scull44 foldsFlop: ($26.30) (2 players)Turn: ($26.30) (2 players)River: ($26.30) (2 players)sonofgh showed , and won ($24.99) with two pair, Aces and NinesHero showed , and lost with two pair, Queens and Ninessonofgh won $24.99(Rake: $1.31)

[jmbreslin 0]

KT when you're in such a bad run that you're losing quads over quads, it might be a good time to step away from the tables for a bit...

[jmbreslin 0]

Still had a nice +1bi day, but sighhhhhConverted by the cows of Feral Cow PokerFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 6 playersCO i got tis man: $31.48 Button Scull44: $51.08 SB voracious: $43.56 BB sonofgh: $11.60 UTG NeverEasy2: $23.15 UTG+1 Hero: $25.00 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG+1 with (6 players)NeverEasy2 folds, Hero raises to $0.85, i got tis man folds, Scull44 raises to $3, voracious folds, sonofgh raises to $11.60, and is all in, Hero raises to $25, and is all in, Scull44 foldsFlop: ($26.30) (2 players)Turn: ($26.30) (2 players)River: ($26.30) (2 players)sonofgh showed , and won ($24.99) with two pair, Aces and NinesHero showed , and lost with two pair, Queens and Ninessonofgh won $24.99(Rake: $1.31)

Did you have some reason to believe your QQ was ahead of villain's range there? He's a shortie 4-betting all in. You're praying to see AK, no? Or does Scull's dead money make it worthwhile (assuming you're ahead of his range)?

[KingJames 11]

Um... sonofgh is a 1/2 stack fish who will jam worse pairs and AK, AQ AJ etc and scull had a high 3bet% so i just jammed bc flatting 4bets is a no no... I may be wrong here but I don't fold QQ in this spot ever...

[babylondonks 5]

Just came 4th in a donkament for 1.8k saves my trip to vegas a little bit

[KingJames 11]

Just came 4th in a donkament for 1.8k saves my trip to vegas a little bit

BINK

[KosinTrouble 0]

Just came 4th in a donkament for 1.8k saves my trip to vegas a little bit

GRATS ON THE GOOD RUN! That means you can pay for me to come down too now!Kosin Trouble

[KosinTrouble 0]

KT when you're in such a bad run that you're losing quads over quads, it might be a good time to step away from the tables for a bit...

Yup, thats pretty much what I did. Ended up going outside to play bball with the son. The thing that is really getting to me, is I keep getting it in good but just cant hold. On that particular day I was down $40, I pushed a total of 11times. Twice I was behind but it was still pretty much a coin flip so I dont mind that. 2 was the quads and fullhouse above. The others according to hem when I reviewed the hands I got it in when I was a 70%+ fav and lost all of them to runner runners. So I know I am playing correct, getting the money in when I am good, just nothing will hold for me of late.I took another break after I hit the -$40 mark, sent the hands to a few people looking for comments and posted a few on DC and got some feed back including a message from a DC Coach which really helped. So I went back (glutton for punishment) because I knew I was playing right, I knew that I was making the right calls, making the right reads ect...Ended up the day down -7.88, to me it was proof that I am doing it right. I am just getting hit with variance stick like there is no tomorrow. Kosin Trouble

[KingJames 11]

Was really close to folding this... Feral Cow Poker Hand ConverterFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 4 playersUTG Hero: $45.67 Button ehkvvv: $28.62 SB R J Brouwer: $26.66 BB as des as 069: $9.44 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with (4 players)Hero raises to $0.75, 2 folds, as des as 069 calls $0.50Flop: ($1.60) (2 players)as des as 069 checks, Hero bets $1, as des as 069 calls $1Turn: ($3.60) (2 players)as des as 069 checks, Hero bets $2.50, as des as 069 raises to $7.69, and is all in, Hero calls $5.19River: ($18.98) (2 players)Hero showed , and won ($18.04) with two pair, Queens and Threesas des as 069 showed , and lost with a pair of ThreesHero won $18.04(Rake: $0.94)

[babylondonks 5]

biiiink

[QED 4]

I thought I was running good when I hit quads twice tonight, I'd rather be the guy that called my 3 bets oop two hands in a row with small pairs and got there both times.

[KingJames 11]

Sick hold... first hand at the tableConverting hands till the cows come homeFull Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 4 playersButton: $25.58 SB: $34.49 BB: $25.00 (Hero)UTG: $15.48 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is BB with (4 players)UTG calls $0.25, SB calls $0.15, Hero checksFlop: ($0.75) (4 players)SB bets $0.75, Hero raises to $2.25, UTG folds, SB raises to $34.24, and is all in, Hero calls $22.50, and is all inTurn: ($50.25) (3 players)River: ($50.25) (3 players)SB showed , and lost with a pair of FoursHero showed , and won ($49.25) with a straight, Eight highHero won $49.25(Rake: $1)

[KingJames 11]

I almost wanted to fold this one too... epic punts to me recently...This converter is going to be a cash cow...Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 5 playersButton: $24.57 SB: $25.00 BB: $25.85 UTG: $25.00 (Hero)CO: $25.00 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with (5 players)Hero raises to $0.75, 2 folds, SB calls $0.65, BB foldsFlop: ($1.75) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $1.10, SB calls $1.10Turn: ($3.95) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $3, SB calls $3River: ($9.95) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $7.75, SB raises to $20.15, and is all in, Hero calls $12.40, and is all inSB showed , and lost with a pair of TensHero showed , and won ($47.74) with a flush, Seven highHero won $47.74(Rake: $2.51)

[SuperJon 175]

kinda goes back to what i was asking about flatting hands oop to a raiselimper was literally running 95/20 over 50ish hands, so i'm pretty sure he's calling. raiser was your standard tag.is it a leak to call here?PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comButton ($25)SB ($25)Hero (BB) ($36.37)UTG ($28.56)MP ($31.68)Preflop: Hero is BB with Q , J :heart:UTG calls $0.25, MP bets $1.25, 2 folds, Hero calls?

[Ninja Ace 1]

I almost wanted to fold this one too... epic punts to me recently...This converter is going to be a cash cow...Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em $0.10/$0.25 - 5 playersButton: $24.57 SB: $25.00 BB: $25.85 UTG: $25.00 (Hero)CO: $25.00 Preflop: ($0.35) Hero is UTG with (5 players)Hero raises to $0.75, 2 folds, SB calls $0.65, BB foldsFlop: ($1.75) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $1.10, SB calls $1.10Turn: ($3.95) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $3, SB calls $3River: ($9.95) (2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $7.75, SB raises to $20.15, and is all in, Hero calls $12.40, and is all inSB showed , and lost with a pair of TensHero showed , and won ($47.74) with a flush, Seven highHero won $47.74(Rake: $2.51)

hahahhahahahahha you donk he tarped u with his overpair

[Ninja Ace 1]

kinda goes back to what i was asking about flatting hands oop to a raiselimper was literally running 95/20 over 50ish hands, so i'm pretty sure he's calling. raiser was your standard tag.is it a leak to call here?PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comButton ($25)SB ($25)Hero (BB) ($36.37)UTG ($28.56)MP ($31.68)Preflop: Hero is BB with Q , J :heart:UTG calls $0.25, MP bets $1.25, 2 folds, Hero calls?

I 3bet ALL DAYothers will tell you I'm a tardit is what it isbasically my rule of thumb is I will 3bet suited connectors as if I had paired the top card... I mean you'd raise AhKh like you had aces right?but treating sc's like you paired the top card only works at all for like... bets and raises... when you use it as a passive line it gets really really wrongthat said I think flatting here is fine as well... it's just not in my gameplan