thelivewire 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 I work at a bank in the Homeowners Assistance Dept helping people save their homes. We offer loan modifications, it depends on who your investor is, whetther you have mi/pmi and six million other factors. Go for the loan mod if they offer it, find out who your investor is and post. I can let you know if you have a chance at a mod or not..is your loan 80/20 or 100% one loan? Link to post Share on other sites
llou 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 This is something that is totally an aside, but I'm still quite interested in the answer to. Why do people need 5 bedrooms and 3.5 bathrooms? It just seems completely hate the idea that a person needs 3500 square feet to live with two other people. Maybe I just grew up a little less fortunate than some and don't see the need for 3500 square feet to live comfortably. Although, everyone is different obv, so to each their own I guess. I'm just curious, I guess.You're right. Two people do not need that much space. It sounds like the OP is once again considering buying "as much house as he can get" -- rather than focusing on "how much house do we need?". Stretching the financing to the max is what got him into trouble in the first place -- and now he wants to stretch again to try to fix it. A little more financial conservatism might be a better idea. Link to post Share on other sites
chgocubs99 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 My take:Well thought out, solid post. I agree with it.Plus you said "sugar mommy" Link to post Share on other sites
grocery_mony 8 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 This story highlites the short term view individuals and corporations have come to take. I dont blame the op a couple of years ago it was the thing to do. I see this same short sightedness in the corporate culture in North America. Management only cares about the numbers for the next quarter not 5 years out. They cannot see the advantage of spending say $100000 to replace a aging peice of equipment now when they can spend 25k on a band aid now and put off the major purchase which is eventually gonna have to happen anyways. There is no leadership in management just cost cutters looking for a good quarter to get a bonus.Its a double edge sword. If you make people more accountable for defaulting they may not take the risk of buying a house. But I am sick of people walking away letting someone else clean up there mess. There was a time where debtors went to jail for defaulting. Thats an extreme but more personal accountability is necessary. Link to post Share on other sites
dlingdling 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 In terms of the ethics of the situation...when it comes to business, things are completely different.This is one of the big reasons the economy is where it is: a total ethical breakdown. The attitude that one has no obligation to do business ethically, and that one's actions have no systemic impact is wrong. It's not okay to jettison ethics when you go off every day to your job.This story highlites the short term view individuals and corporations have come to take. I dont blame the op a couple of years ago it was the thing to do. I see this same short sightedness in the corporate culture in North America. Management only cares about the numbers for the next quarter not 5 years out. They cannot see the advantage of spending say $100000 to replace a aging peice of equipment now when they can spend 25k on a band aid now and put off the major purchase which is eventually gonna have to happen anyways. There is no leadership in management just cost cutters looking for a good quarter to get a bonus.Its a double edge sword. If you make people more accountable for defaulting they may not take the risk of buying a house. But I am sick of people walking away letting someone else clean up there mess. There was a time where debtors went to jail for defaulting. Thats an extreme but more personal accountability is necessary.This.OP's not hurting for money. He negotiated the purchase price and the loan agreement. He chose not to read the fine print. Negotiate your way out of this bad loan and swallow the pill of paying off the amount you're underwater, then make a better deal next time.IMO the only people ethically justified to walk away are those who are destitute, who have no other way of making the payments. To do it on a whim, so OP can trade up, is despicable. It worsens the banking crisis and makes it harder for all of us. Link to post Share on other sites
Cappy37 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Poppycock.The OP shouldn't just consider the post flop action here. He needs to give serious consideration to the likely turn and river bets based on higher probability occurences. Getting married and having a kid sound extremely likely in his position.Short sightedness or assuming everything will continue status quo is part of what got him in this situation in the first place.Agree 100%, but you got the order backwards. Link to post Share on other sites
PokerFan 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 This is one of the big reasons the economy is where it is: a total ethical breakdown. The attitude that one has no obligation to do business ethically, and that one's actions have no systemic impact is wrong. It's not okay to jettison ethics when you go off every day to your job.This.OP's not hurting for money. He negotiated the purchase price and the loan agreement. He chose not to read the fine print. Negotiate your way out of this bad loan and swallow the pill of paying off the amount you're underwater, then make a better deal next time.IMO the only people ethically justified to walk away are those who are destitute, who have no other way of making the payments. To do it on a whim, so OP can trade up, is despicable. It worsens the banking crisis and makes it harder for all of us.The OP did not get in this bind by himself, The fact is everyone in the home transaction was making money and some how that made it all ok, I'm familiar with stated income and it does not take an economics major to figure out stated income is one ingredient in this housing mess... While I agree that walking away from the first house is less than ideal. I'm also tired of all these corprate big wigs getting huge Jack as the companys they are employed by go down the tubes.. I once knew a guy that told me..."You know? I'm tired of getting screwed...I'm going to start doing the screwing"...that is where the OP is at.... Link to post Share on other sites
dlingdling 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 The OP did not get in this bind by himself, The fact is everyone in the home transaction was making money and some how that made it all ok, I'm familiar with stated income and it does not take an economics major to figure out stated income is one ingredient in this housing mess... While I agree that walking away from the first house is less than ideal. I'm also tired of all these corprate big wigs getting huge Jack as the companys they are employed by go down the tubes.. I once knew a guy that told me..."You know? I'm tired of getting screwed...I'm going to start doing the screwing"...that is where the OP is at....The OP's not in a bind. That's what makes walking away as unethical as the corporate bigwigs taking bonuses from bailout funds. Link to post Share on other sites
Lrgetrout 1 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 The OP's not in a bind. That's what makes walking away as unethical as the corporate bigwigs taking bonuses from bailout funds.6 Months ago I would have been on your side. But today, I'm more on the side of ...The OP did not get in this bind by himself, The fact is everyone in the home transaction was making money and some how that made it all ok, I'm familiar with stated income and it does not take an economics major to figure out stated income is one ingredient in this housing mess... While I agree that walking away from the first house is less than ideal. I'm also tired of all these corprate big wigs getting huge Jack as the companys they are employed by go down the tubes.. I once knew a guy that told me..."You know? I'm tired of getting screwed...I'm going to start doing the screwing"...that is where the OP is at....That having been said, the OP should still consider foreclosure a last resort if the lender(s) will not make a modification to basically give him a loan that he could get today.And even if he does say "screw it, foreclose on me bitches", he should still only be getting as much home as he needs. Not as much home as he wants. Link to post Share on other sites
whatgreatis 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 Why is this in genpo? Link to post Share on other sites
chgocubs99 0 Posted February 8, 2009 Share Posted February 8, 2009 The OP did not get in this bind by himself, The fact is everyone in the home transaction was making money and some how that made it all ok, I'm familiar with stated income and it does not take an economics major to figure out stated income is one ingredient in this housing mess... While I agree that walking away from the first house is less than ideal. I'm also tired of all these corprate big wigs getting huge Jack as the companys they are employed by go down the tubes.. I once knew a guy that told me..."You know? I'm tired of getting screwed...I'm going to start doing the screwing"...that is where the OP is at....I disagree with this entire post. There's no point in starting a debate on it here, but to say that a person or a corporation is doing something wrong by making money, when the person paying is a willing participant, is ridiculous. This is a capitalist society we live in here...you are allowed to profit as much as you want. If you don't like the terms or cannot afford it, don't sign the paper and buy the house. Pretty simple. Link to post Share on other sites
PokerFan 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I disagree with this entire post. There's no point in starting a debate on it here, but to say that a person or a corporation is doing something wrong by making money, when the person paying is a willing participant, is ridiculous. This is a capitalist society we live in here...you are allowed to profit as much as you want. If you don't like the terms or cannot afford it, don't sign the paper and buy the house. Pretty simple.I think your short sided...You don't go to a bank and take all the money you need to buy a home...You apply and based on your ability to pay your approved or denied...The checks and balances in the home loan process got completley out of control mainly due to many people's/company's greed.And now that the rules of home loans have changed the OP has to deal with the changes..ie lower home values, harder to qualify for people that might buy his home. The fact is he can just walk away and since we are in a "what's in it for me" time in history, I would not blame him if he did.. Link to post Share on other sites
hank213 1,823 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I think your short sided...You don't go to a bank and take all the money you need to buy a home...You apply and based on your ability to pay your approved or denied...The checks and balances in the home loan process got completley out of control mainly due to many people's/company's greed.And now that the rules of home loans have changed the OP has to deal with the changes..ie lower home values, harder to qualify for people that might buy his home. The fact is he can just walk away and since we are in a "what's in it for me" time in history, I would not blame him if he did..If there's any short sightedness here it's in the assumption that one can walk away from a mortgage with little to no negative repercussions over the next several years. Link to post Share on other sites
PokerFan 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 If there's any short sightedness here it's in the assumption that one can walk away from a mortgage with little to no negative repercussions over the next several years.He has stated and understands the repercussions... Link to post Share on other sites
chgocubs99 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I think your short sided...You don't go to a bank and take all the money you need to buy a home...You apply and based on your ability to pay your approved or denied...The checks and balances in the home loan process got completley out of control mainly due to many people's/company's greed.And now that the rules of home loans have changed the OP has to deal with the changes..ie lower home values, harder to qualify for people that might buy his home. The fact is he can just walk away and since we are in a "what's in it for me" time in history, I would not blame him if he did..Let me get this straight.You come to me and want a beer that costs $5. It cost me $5 to get it myself. You have $1 on you. I tell you I'll still give you the beer...but you have to pay me back $1 a week. When you're done, you'll have paid me $10, but you get the beer now even though you don't have the $5. I've stayed in business doing this. It's worked for me. I make $5 or so on every beer, then I take that money and pay the guy that gets the beer his share, then do what I want with whatever is left over. Someone else comes up who I don't really think can afford to pay back $1 a week. I let them pay less the first few weeks, then up it. When it's done, they'll have paid me $12. They decide to do it. They really like this beer and are going to take the chance. There's a ton of papers letting them know they consequences if they don't pay it back, but they are pretty sure they will get back on their feet. It is risk/reward for me...obviously I need them to pay me back eventually, or I'll go out of business since I won't be able to afford to pay the guy that gets it, nor will I be able to buy my own beer, etc. But I decide to take the chance too. Turns out the second person doesn't ever get back on their feet like I thought...they can't pay me back. All the other beer people will know about this. I didn't get my money, and now they may not ever be able to get a beer again.I have screwed that person? Link to post Share on other sites
pokerinc 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 ugh...I just want to say 'the loan THEY put me in was stated/stated' is such a lame thing to say. You bent the rules to purchase a home you didn't qualify for. Yes THEY bent them to, but at your benefit. You purchase a home w/ an ARM and 0% freaking down, gee could there be risk?People keep blaming the lenders, but everyone was guilty over these last five years. That said I'd be pretty careful just letting your credit tank b/c it gives your chick all the power over your shit, which sucks. Link to post Share on other sites
PokerFan 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 ugh...I just want to say 'the loan THEY put me in was stated/stated' is such a lame thing to say. You bent the rules to purchase a home you didn't qualify for. Yes THEY bent them to, but at your benefit. You purchase a home w/ an ARM and 0% freaking down, gee could there be risk?People keep blaming the lenders, but everyone was guilty over these last five years. That said I'd be pretty careful just letting your credit tank b/c it gives your chick all the power over your shit, which sucks.I agree alot of people had a hand in this situation but only one guy is left holding the bag....and I'm saying, he has explored his options and I'm good with any way he goes including jamming the keys back to the bank.. Link to post Share on other sites
dlingdling 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 ... since we are in a "what's in it for me" time in history, ...We're in a "what's in it for us" time in history. What's-in-it-for-me didn't work. It's never worked. Greed and questionable ethics have brought us this disaster, both in the financial and civic world. Most people are realizing that personal integrity and shared responbility are the way we can thrive again. I wish the banks were being slammed for their bad decisions and predatory practices, but OP is not a victim of these. He just wants to walk away because it's convenient. Link to post Share on other sites
Chaserjim 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Author Share Posted February 9, 2009 Ty for all the comments. I think I had made up my mind on a route to take.The credit loss from foreclosure is just too big of a negative.Also - I would be taking the easy way out.and possibly getting in the same boat with this new home. So here's what I'm gonna do.I will stop making payments anf force them to enter a loan mod with me. If a mod happens, then I can sell responsibly, and purchase responsibly.If they won't renegotiate a contract with me, I will then repay the missed payments , and deal with the dings on my credit (still not as bad as a foreclosure) and find some other alternative that may come available from our new administration in washington. Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Ty for all the comments. I think I had made up my mind on a route to take.The credit loss from foreclosure is just too big of a negative.Also - I would be taking the easy way out.and possibly getting in the same boat with this new home. So here's what I'm gonna do.I will stop making payments anf force them to enter a loan mod with me. If a mod happens, then I can sell responsibly, and purchase responsibly.If they won't renegotiate a contract with me, I will then repay the missed payments , and deal with the dings on my credit (still not as bad as a foreclosure) and find some other alternative that may come available from our new administration in washington.Don't miss payments. Just ask for the mod. Link to post Share on other sites
whatgreatis 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Why is this in genpo? Link to post Share on other sites
GetSprung 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Thank god for fixed rate mortgages. Government buy down one time?` Link to post Share on other sites
blakheart 3 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Op, I work for a subprime servicing compnay and can tell you some of the facts about your plan that you may not have considered.1.- Right now all FHA loans require a review of both you and your wife's credit. She can not get an FHA loan if you foreclose on a home.2. With the goverment essentially underwriting Fannie and Freddy I think it is possible for some of the FHA Guidelines to creep into their guidelines as well. Especially since defaults on Freddy loans are now at 7%. (a really big scary number, by the way)3. You made a deal, maybe a bad deal in hindsight, but your own deal. All of your noise about stated income and adjusting rates do not absolve you of responsibilty to honor your deal. If you choice to go down this path it is no more morally correct then guys who collude online. They can justify their actions in their mind somehow, but at the end of the day it is wrong. If the housing was still going up and you flipped the home for $100K in profit I don't think you would be whinning about unethical lending practices. You signed the application with your overstated income.You signed the loan docs.You signed the seperate disclosure that explained it was an ARM loan.You are responsible for that debt.Anything else is just rationalization. Link to post Share on other sites
blakheart 3 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Ty for all the comments. I think I had made up my mind on a route to take.The credit loss from foreclosure is just too big of a negative.Also - I would be taking the easy way out.and possibly getting in the same boat with this new home. So here's what I'm gonna do.I will stop making payments anf force them to enter a loan mod with me. If a mod happens, then I can sell responsibly, and purchase responsibly.If they won't renegotiate a contract with me, I will then repay the missed payments , and deal with the dings on my credit (still not as bad as a foreclosure) and find some other alternative that may come available from our new administration in washington.Who is your lender- I have insight on how to get a loan mod accomplished. I work for Homeq Servicing, one of the largest subprime servicers. You do not need to miss payments to get a mod. I would suggest applying for a short refinance with another company at current market value. Your lender will consider your application for a short payoff as well as modification options. You do not need to miss payments. Link to post Share on other sites
mase_gotsem 0 Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 Sell your house. Do the thing with the girlfriend. Get a personal loan to cover the difference or work it out with your mortgager. The benefits of keeping your credit clean are going to FAR outweigh the extra $xx,000 you pocket by going the deadbeat route.and then if worse comes to worse you can go all out scumbag and get a 75k line of credit and claim bankruptcy <-- spelled right ? Link to post Share on other sites
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