Hsp $500k Game

[matchstix 0]

If you guys are talking about ep. 11, here it is on youtube.http://youtube.com/watch?v=hYNS4uahk7s

[FileError404 0]

Man, they must laugh their asses off behind Gold's back. He's so bad and his comments are just retarded. I don't want to be the best player but I want to be the best bluffer in the world? Doyle almost looked embarrassed for him. Like bluffing is separate from playing... Then, my favorite moment, when he says how many outs he has, Patrick starts laughing out loud.

[El Guapo 8]

Man, they must laugh their asses off behind Gold's back. He's so bad and his comments are just retarded. I don't want to be the best player but I want to be the best bluffer in the world? Doyle almost looked embarrassed for him. Like bluffing is separate from playing... Then, my favorite moment, when he says how many outs he has, Patrick starts laughing out loud.

Yeah that was great editing, after watching him this year he has been very consistent when you is bluffing he talks a ton and when he is trying to get value he still talks but its not as loud and obnoxious. I know we see the cards, but I am pretty sure most at that table have picked this up.

[FourFlusher 0]

Did they ever settle the WSOP money dispute between Gold and the other guy?I thought the play was pretty tight...with that kind of money behind you have to go slow, at first, anyway.

[CobaltBlue 662]

Barry bet three streets and was projecting strength the whole time...Antonio's hand doesn't beat a whole lot of hands that play that way. You'll notice that he called out the three plausibles...A8, A4, 84. There are a bunch of flushes that he doesn't beat. It was actually pretty similar to when Doyle laid down the better flush against Jamie.

[showstopper24 0]

I was surprised at how scared some of the players played.

[Sheiky 0]

I'm glad they've uped the buy in, they're acctualy playing proper poker now instead of donking around which was crap to watch.What are people's thoughts on Doyle folding the flush against Jamie?I can't make my mind up whether it was a great read and a good fold(he had the best flush, but he read that Jamie was strong and imo it's a good laydown) or he folded because he's scared of losing $500k.

[HubDub04 0]

You guys need to remember that this is the biggest poker game as far as stakes go that has ever been televised. Of course for the first couple hours the players are gonna be nervous. I'm really expecting the play to loosen up and the players to play more of a normal game once the tension eases.

[DCJ001 0]

Did anyone else notice how tight antonio esfandiari played.....It took him for ever to call with his top set aces. If was like he was playing scared or something.

Maybe he spent some time wondering if Barry flopped a flush. And, if Antonio raised on the river, and Barry reraised big, Antonio might not be able to call in case Barry flopped a flush.When thinking about the way that this game is played, it's best to not think about it in the same way that you'd play a $5 turbo.

[El Guapo 8]

I am a little dissapointed that the blinds are staying 3/6/12 I thought they would go up to 6/12/24 at a minimum.

[Sheiky 0]

What, giving everyone an M of less than 20 and turning it into a scared donkshove fest that holds no real entertainment value?I think it's the play of people who care about their money that makes HSP interesting, not the ridiculous amount of money itself.

[FARGOpokerND 22]

no one has mentioned how crazy it would have been if Guy checked his JJ when he flopped his set? we could have had DN-Gus all over again.

[blakheart 3]

Doyle's fold to Gold was a great read. Anyone who thinks different is being results oriented. Gold thought he had the best hand and Doyle read him for strength. Doyle did not want to go for his whole stack when he could have easily been beat with no outs. Is it me, or is Gold playing with a lot of his bankroll? After splitting the main event and then paying taxes on that he probably walked away with 3-4 million. He hasn't really won anything since. Isn't buying into a $500k game with a $3mil roll a little crazy? I guess the same could probably be said about a lot of those guys. Wasika is most likely playing on the same size roll, and Antonio can't have that big a roll either. It makes the show really interesting since these guys are really concerned about getting felted here. I think Guy has an advantage early since he is the only one not playing scared money at all. All the rest seem to be be playing really carefully, at least early.

[TravisG 0]

Doyle's fold to Gold was a great read. Anyone who thinks different is being results oriented. Gold thought he had the best hand and Doyle read him for strength. Doyle did not want to go for his whole stack when he could have easily been beat with no outs. Is it me, or is Gold playing with a lot of his bankroll? After splitting the main event and then paying taxes on that he probably walked away with 3-4 million. He hasn't really won anything since. Isn't buying into a $500k game with a $3mil roll a little crazy? I guess the same could probably be said about a lot of those guys. Wasika is most likely playing on the same size roll, and Antonio can't have that big a roll either. It makes the show really interesting since these guys are really concerned about getting felted here. I think Guy has an advantage early since he is the only one not playing scared money at all. All the rest seem to be be playing really carefully, at least early.

isnt gold some kind of rich tv producer?

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

Given the comments, play, and even Blogs (for example Galfond) of the players involved in this game it seems clear that one of the most important questions is answered: "Are they really playing with their own Money?"That at its heart is what still makes this a great show!

[ROBBBIGG 0]

"People will wonder how they could fold to such a small bet!"

[TravisG 0]

Given the comments, play, and even Blogs (for example Galfond) of the players involved in this game it seems clear that one of the most important questions is answered: "Are they really playing with their own Money?"That at its heart is what still makes this a great show!

can you give a link to galfonds blog? thanks

[Influcted 0]

Where can I find this episode?

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

can you give a link to galfonds blog? thanks

Not certain of direct links (apparently Galfond Posts on 2+2), but there was another FCP thread on HSP where this was posted...

Phil Galfond explains his play on HSP: (from 2+2)So I got on this next season of HSP thanks to a friend of mine putting in a good word for me.I was 2nd alternate on day 2 and starting on day 3.Day 2 was a 100k min buyin and day 3 was 500k min. I brought 720k with me, planning on playing with 220k max on day two if I got a seat (which the producer made to sound unlikely) and saving the last 500k for the next day, or whatever I had leftover from day 2.I showed up for day 2 around 2pm, just after taping started. Mori, the producer, was extremely nice. He let all of my friends come on set (there were not many people on set). He made me feel very comfortable there, as did all of the other producers and everyone working on the show.It was cool on set. Free food. Random pros walking around. I did some on camera hand analysis for a GSN.com feature, which I wasn't prepared for, but I think I did okay. I was watching the game for hours. Extremely loose action. People were calling down when someones entire range is ahead of their hand. I almost had a boner about it.I got into the game with 2 hours left of taping on day two. I don’t know if I can say exactly who was playing, but I’ll say that the table was very loose and aggressive (in a good way for me) and very talkative. It was the best game I’d played in all year. I was glad I got in, but bummed that I only had two hours. Not to mention that it was live and on a TV set, so I was probably dealt 40 hands the whole time. The players were very friendly for the most part. Jamie Gold was actually a really nice guy (I say actually because I didn’t expect him to be) and improved a lot since last season. Negreanu also played much much better than he had in previous years, and is a great guy from what I can tell. I’m gonna stop listing off players in case I’m not supposed to.I had 100k on the table and 100k in my pocket and was saving the rest for day 3. 90% of hands were straddled and a few were double straddled. That left me with ~40-80bbs effective. With that, and no one folding preflop, the game got really boring for me. I basically had to play 10% of my hands if I wanted to max my EV. Phil Hellmuth called me a nit, which is probably the most embarrassing thing that I can remember happening to me in my lifetime.I was really proud of my ability to hand read live. I was worried that I wouldn't to be able to pick up on things, but I was catching tons of timing tells and was able to put people on hands pretty well, which was what I did to keep busy while folding. There was one hand where I bet and got two really weak seeming calls on a very drawy board. I was really mad because I had the nuts (like 4th nuts, but clearly the best hand) but I couldn't check turn and let draws hit even though I was sure they were folding their midpairs with a gutter or oesd. I guess I don't know if my reads were right, but I feel good about them.There was another hand that I wasn't a part of where one player shoved the river for about 2/5 pot after check-raising the turn. The other player tanks, saying his hand is as good as ace high. People started to chatter about what he could possibly have, which made me feel awesome since I was 90% sure he had 88-JJ with one club and was calling the turn in hopes for a club to hit or a free showdown and was folding to a river bet. After he folded, Negreanu said that he knew the one player would never bluff there, and I thought to myself how I'd always bluffshove that river. I’m looking forward to seeing that hand to check my read.Overall though, it was a boring day for me. Lots of anticipation and only got the chance to play for 2 hours with a small roll since I was saving 500k for the big day.Just before going to bed that night, I was informed that 3 of the TV Pros from day 2 decided last minute that they wanted to play on day 3, and that I wasn’t good TV because I was so tight and didn’t talk enough to the players who don’t know me. So, I lost my spot on the table. To say the least, I was very mad. Had I not been saving $500k for day 3, I would’ve been able to play a much more open game. I guess nobody there had any idea of my reputation and playing style, because I have never been accused of being a nit before that day. Usually I get ‘station’ ‘monkey’ or ‘FPS-machine’. I also had less than 50 hands to show what I had. Hellmuth spent over 15 minutes negotiating and discussing insurance deals when he was all-in.Not to mention the fact that I had to fly halfway across the country and move $720k twice (not easy for me, and probably will get me audited) to play for 2 hours and get bumped from my guaranteed spot by people who have been on the show many times, live in Vegas, and aren’t affected at all by being on the show one more day.Another frustrating aspect of it is that I didn’t get a chance to prove myself. America still thinks that my whole Day 2 table (besides me) is full of the best poker players in the world, when I would’ve salivated over playing any of them HU. (Maybe wouldn’t have salivated over one or two but would surely be a favorite) I know that I need to get over this part. It shouldn’t bother me what the public thinks, and I’m working on not caring as much.After getting angry for a while, I looked for somewhere/someone to place my anger. That’s when I realized that there was really no one to be angry at. I was lied to, in a sense, which is my number one pet peave by far. But the players we almost all extremely friendly, and I’m positive the ones who wanted to play the next day didn’t consider the effects on me. Mori gave me a shot at being on one of the most watched poker shows on TV. He was nothing but nice and accommodating. While I’m sure he had a lot of say as to whether I got to keep my day 3 spot, I don’t blame him much for his decision. He doesn’t want to upset some of his biggest name players, and I didn’t show him anything on day 2 that he could show to execs to defend his decision to keep me on the show. As far as he knows, I am a complete nit and maybe not even good at poker.I think it’s really unfortunate that America would rather watch bad, loud poker than extremely high level thinking from the true best players in the world, but I guess they don’t know any better.I would love if someone would do a show where Me, durrr, Aba, and two more (Not saying I’m necessarily one of the best 5 online players and don’t wanna make a top 5 list) each play HU v Ivey, Doyle, Negreanu, etc. Like, we each pair up with a pro and play best of 3 HU 200bb freezouts. Each team puts up $2mm or whatever and whichever team wins most out of 5 splits the prize amongst themselves. Online pros v Live pros. Then maybe America would realize how it really is. Anyways, I’m ranting now.I didn’t have a good experience at HSP, but it was really nobody’s fault. Mori told me he owed me and would make it up to me. My friends didn’t believe him, but I do. He seems very genuine. Hopefully I’ll get my chance sometime soon.Oh. I finished up $20k! YAYAYAYAY!!!!!!!!

[TravisG 0]

ah thanks, interesting read. do you think hes right about the "online pros are better then live pros" thing?

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

ah thanks, interesting read. do you think hes right about the "online pros are better then live pros" thing?

Not that day.In general, I think it is a silly statement. Frankly On-line poker allows a player to get a TON of experience quickly. Furthermore it REQUIRES them to become adept at identifing betting patterns - since this is the primary non-physical "tell" that will give you an edge over an opponent. The better players more quickly rise to the top while the poorer players more quickly are cast aside - this is because of the sheer "velocity" of the on-line model. However aggression and solid technical play are not exclusive to the On-Line player. Yes, like a blind man's sense of hearing, they may refine those skills more quickly than their Live counterparts, however the fact remains that there is an arsenal of Live weapons that the on-line player may not be as skilled at applying. The interpersonal aspects and physical tells available to Live players CAN BE as important as the on-line tools perhaps more so.Bottom line is in a Live game, I'll take the top 5 Live Players over the Top 5 On-Line players (assuming the list is mutually exclusive) with a fairly large edge. In an On-line game, I'll give the slight advantage to the on-line players, but not by as much.

[TravisG 0]

thats true overall. though i'd have to say that the betting pattern reading abilitys of "live pros" don't have to be worse than the ones of the onlines pros, especially when some live pro also spends a ton of time online.

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

thats true overall. though i'd have to say that the betting pattern reading abilitys of "live pros" don't have to be worse than the ones of the onlines pros, especially when some live pro also spends a ton of time online.

Exactly. It isn't exclusive to OL Poker, while the physical tells and many aspects of the Social Game ARE by definition exclusive to Live play.

[Sheiky 0]

www.pokertube.com for this weeks episode.The debate between live and online players is a pretty dumb one as everyone does both now anyway.

[Snamuh 0]

There is a TON of jockeying around still going on here. It is relatively early in the Game. Players like Doyle have a Big Picture perspective. That was what let him lay down that hand vs. Gold. He KNOWS he will have better spots to get him money in the pot.

I feel this is completely wrong. This isn't a tournament, it's a cash game. There isn't a "better spot." It's a +EV play or not.

What, giving everyone an M of less than 20 and turning it into a scared donkshove fest that holds no real entertainment value?I think it's the play of people who care about their money that makes HSP interesting, not the ridiculous amount of money itself.

M does not exist in cash games.