How Do You Know When Your A Losing Player?

[makeyourself 0]

Hey,i know i know it seems like a blatantly obvious question but how do you know when you are a 'losing player'? It's a given your losing :)but what i mean is how much can you put losing say over a month, down to a 'downswing'? i know somebody will just go 'check pokerdb' or just look at results but as you can't track cash wins i don't think thats the full story.how much would you personally consider losing is enough for you to just say 'i suck' and quit? every1 has different amounts, i accpect some people will say 100$ and others 50k$. I guess im curious if poker for people is like a gambling addiction, but it just so happens your winning. or if its like a buisness where when you lose alot you decide to quit. personally i've been playing a while and this month has been pretty awful, and made me question my ability. no matter what i lost in a month (to an extent, but i don't play ultra high so we aint talking thousands and thousands) i don't think i would or culd quit as i enjoy the game probably too much (like most), but certianly gonna take a break then come back when mentally rebuilt.

[freak2304 0]

obviously depends on what level you play, how long you've been playing total, how long you've been playing at that specific level, etc. There's alot of variables to take into account. But I'd say being honest with yourself about your ability is step 1. Only you are there for every session you play and that should be enough to tell yourself if you are/will be a losing player.

[navybuttons 15]

if you love it you won't ever quit.i was a loosing player for 3 years. i stopped blaming the cards, got my head in order (with regards to tilt), accepted that i had and always will have leaks, and did tons of work and studying to correct those leaks (i still do). there's still times where i lose confidence, but those times are the best times for plugging leaks.it comes down to how much you want it. read this thread: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat...rue#Post7372140that's a guy who wanted it and got it through hard work. BKiCe is another player who comes to mind whose hard work and dedication lead to large profits relatively early in his poker career.goodluck.

[Balloon guy 158]

If you are playing for a living it's easyIf you are playing for fun then it's not so easy.If the losses affect your life style, then you are a losing player.If they don't then you have an expensive hobby.Why you playing?

[makeyourself 0]

obviously depends on what level you play, how long you've been playing total, how long you've been playing at that specific level, etc. There's alot of variables to take into account. But I'd say being honest with yourself about your ability is step 1. Only you are there for every session you play and that should be enough to tell yourself if you are/will be a losing player.

to be honest i didn't mean this post to be a 'im on a bad run wtf is going wrong' thread. i keep ok records and been playing about 2 years profitably so im pretty sure i'm just playing bad this month. i meant it more of a thread for people to post what would take them to give up/ and or could you etc. would be interesting if any1 actually is a losing player, there has to be alot of people out there who are. do you think some people keep coming back when losing a lot or you think its usually fresh blood that gives to the community?

[FoxwoodsPro 0]

If you are playing any limit under 10-20 NL , and you don't "think" your the best at the table then you are a losing player or destined to be one. I think thats a good way to determine it.If not a hobby

[freak2304 0]

to be honest i didn't mean this post to be a 'im on a bad run wtf is going wrong' thread. i keep ok records and been playing about 2 years profitably so im pretty sure i'm just playing bad this month. i meant it more of a thread for people to post what would take them to give up/ and or could you etc. would be interesting if any1 actually is a losing player, there has to be alot of people out there who are. do you think some people keep coming back when losing a lot or you think its usually fresh blood that gives to the community?

of course! there's tons of losing players who keep coming back. There has to be to account for the winners in the game. There's not just thousands of new players picking up the game every day for that to happen.

[makeyourself 0]

If you are playing any limit under 10-20 NL , and you don't "think" your the best at the table then you are a losing player or destined to be one. I think thats a good way to determine it.If not a hobby

i personally don't agree with that at all. maybe your playing for different reasons but personally i play to suppliment my income and i enjoy it so much. i don't have the 'dream' of being destined to be a top pro etc. an also alot of people can't afford to play 10 20, i win but i don't think i wuld ever have the roll to play in those games and probably would feel uncomfortable with 2k on the table due to im not used to gambling that high. what i would say is its hard to tell if you are the best at the table as people are often coming and going, taking hit and runs and all together not sitting at a table for 1 or 2 hours. i wouldn't say i immediatly consider myself the best because thats arrogance and that leads to worse things.... ...... .... not good in poker

[makeyourself 0]

If you are playing for a living it's easyIf you are playing for fun then it's not so easy.If the losses affect your life style, then you are a losing player.If they don't then you have an expensive hobby.Why you playing?

i don't play for a living, althought i would love to i don't have the ability/ bankroll management and also it would put a lot of pressure on me to win. also im only like 20 so just wanna concentrate on having a 9-5 :)i would say i play for a hobby mainly but the $ helps

[pragtyro 0]

but what i mean is how much can you put losing say over a month, down to a 'downswing'? i know somebody will just go 'check pokerdb' or just look at results but as you can't track cash wins i don't think thats the full story.

you can still track cash wins with a pen and paper...

[FoxwoodsPro 0]

not to be rude, but if your doing this as a hobby, what concern is this topic to you? determining the limit? Obv. you want to win but if your doing this as a hobby consider your deposit a loss or an entertainment expense and dont worry about being a "losing player" sit back and enjoy the rideI think im addicted to these 180s j/s

[psujohn 0]

I read that only something like 5% of players are long term winning players. A lot of that probably has to do with players who carry money up the poker economy - win at 1/2 and lose it back at 2/5, etc. And any given player's win/lose rate is forever in flux as they learn/adapt and go through declines in their play/tilt/etc. Winning vs losing player truly is difficult to determine. It's very possible for someone with positive short term results to be a losing player and vice versa. If your question is - how do I determine if I'm just in a downswing or if I suck I'd say that chances are good that most sustained downswings are at least partially due to decline in your play. If your question is - how do I determine if I'm a long term winner or long term loser the only way I know is to play long term. 100s of thousand of hands.If your question is - what would it take to make me give up poker, the answer is that it'd take more than knowing that I was a losing player. First because as long as I can afford to be a losing player and still derive pleasure from the game it'd be worth it to keep playing and second because I believe and I can improve and increase my win rate/become a winning player.

[FoxwoodsPro 0]

Good Topic BTW

[strate 0]

biggest tip-off ur a losing player is making these threads.haha, j/k,yea i agree, play thousands of hands.

[TucsonMonster 0]

There is no such thing as a losing player. You make them think they are on a bad run, or just plain unlucky. Or else the game becomes unprofitable. Remind them the times of which they won. When this happens, they stay in the game. Then they just are unlucky. But you will never find someone who is a 'losing' player

[farmist 0]

When your name is farmist

[ErikRyland1 0]

if you love it you won't ever quit.i was a loosing player for 3 years. i stopped blaming the cards, got my head in order (with regards to tilt), accepted that i had and always will have leaks, and did tons of work and studying to correct those leaks (i still do). there's still times where i lose confidence, but those times are the best times for plugging leaks.it comes down to how much you want it. read this thread: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat...rue#Post7372140that's a guy who wanted it and got it through hard work. BKiCe is another player who comes to mind whose hard work and dedication lead to large profits relatively early in his poker career.goodluck.

Might be my new sig... I'll think about it

[profxavier9 0]

thats a rhetorical question right?

[Royal_Tour 0]

My guess is if you cant use you're in the proper format over your, than.. "your a losing player"

[Royal_Tour 0]

i personally don't agree with that at all. maybe your playing for different reasons but personally i play to suppliment my income and i enjoy it so much. i don't have the 'dream' of being destined to be a top pro etc. an also alot of people can't afford to play 10 20, i win but i don't think i wuld ever have the roll to play in those games and probably would feel uncomfortable with 2k on the table due to im not used to gambling that high. what i would say is its hard to tell if you are the best at the table as people are often coming and going, taking hit and runs and all together not sitting at a table for 1 or 2 hours. i wouldn't say i immediatly consider myself the best because thats arrogance and that leads to worse things.... ...... .... not good in poker

i don't play for a living, althought i would love to i don't have the ability/ bankroll management and also it would put a lot of pressure on me to win. also im only like 20 so just wanna concentrate on having a 9-5 :)i would say i play for a hobby mainly but the $ helps

k a serious answer now.U mentioned "downswing" and how do you tell the difference?well a downswing is what a player goes through due to variance, bad luck whatever you wanna call it.Its what happens when you are cold decked, or invest your money in with the best of it, only to continue to lose over and over during a short period of time.It happens to everyone.If you are a cash game player and you find that you win, but then lose it all over the course of a few weeks, perhaps you are playing out of your bankroll and cannot handle a swing.If you find that you are constantly up and down up and down, perhaps you have a leak in your game, usually one that involves risking too often.If you find that you are taking bad beats and you're losing money, well thats just part of the game. Thats a downswing, and you will know if you are on one, or just plain old bad

[iowahawk09 0]

I use to be a losing player, and I'm not afraid to admit it. I actually did quit for about a year and half. This came after months of losing. I had a fairly solid bankroll built up from about a year of playing. Over the next 2 months, I hit a horrible downswing that caused me to tilt and chase my losses. Eventually I ran my BR dry, and dipped into my credit card. I only had one credit card at the time since I'm in college and it had a 5k limit on it. I said enough was enough when I maxed out my card from constantly chasing my losses. I was just so fed up and the bad beats kept coming in my mind. Little did I know that it wasnt the bad beats that were causing me to go bust, but poor hand selection, not knowing pot odds, being stubborn when I knew I was beat, etc. It was at this time, that I realized that I was a losing player and I couldn't handle the mental pressures of playing poker.I took about a year and half off and just lived a normal college life and worked 30 hours a week to pay off my credit card and try to save some money. During this time I read alot of poker books, watched poker on tv, and studied my own game, but strictly studying and no playing.Around a year ago I made a $500 deposit and started to rebuild my roll and test out my newfound understanding of the game. I was sure I had the technical skills to be successful, but wondered if I could mentally handle it. Fast forward to today, and I have almost double what my old bankroll use to be and I have reached some level of calm when playing poker. I rarely tilt and whenever I do, I just remind myself of how much I missed playing poker during my time away, and I do not want that to happen again. Usually that straightens me out.But long story short, it took me about $10k before I finally stopped chasing my losses and finally grasped what it takes to be successful (br management, etc.)

[HermanKahn 0]

k a serious answer now.Its what happens when you are cold decked, or invest your money in with the best of it, only to continue to lose over and over during a short period of time.It happens to everyone.

It hasn't happened to me. I get bad beats, but never anything I couldn't bounce back from because 1) I always play within my limits and 2) I spent (and spend) a hell of a lot of time analyzing my leaks before they got to be a serious problem. Keeping a razor-sharp eye on your bottom line forces you to play disciplined and work hard at finding optimal strategies. How sharp? I built my bankroll entirely out of one minimum deposit on one internet site, and since then I've never--I mean NEVER--played poker with money I didn't legitimately EARN playing poker.That's how you can be sure you're a winning player.-

[HermanKahn 0]

not to be rude, but if your doing this as a hobby, what concern is this topic to you? determining the limit? Obv. you want to win but if your doing this as a hobby consider your deposit a loss or an entertainment expense and dont worry about being a "losing player" sit back and enjoy the ride

Absolutely not. Simply put, I want to be the best player I can be. If you aren't continuously thinking about how you play and why, you might as well give it up and bet on red.

[mase_gotsem 0]

well i came to the conclusion i am a losing player when it comes to ring games at least online so i try to stay away or play min buy ins on low limits just to fool around .

[aedread 0]

Winning player - upswings are greater then down swingsLosing player - downswings are greater then up swings.Game is half about variance, catch a wave, ride it as far as it goes, float for a while, and catch the next one.