Pot Odds RAC 23 Posted December 8, 2006 Share Posted December 8, 2006 The other night at the Casino play was getting pretty sloppy. String bets and bets out of turn were happening at an alarming rate. Several players complained. At one point as I was considering how much to raise, the player two seats to my left tossed in a call to the standing bet. As his chips hit the felt, I announced: "Raise"After I put out my chips, the dealer took the chips belonging to the player who acted out of turn and said $XX more dollars to call.Guy mucked and shot a look to kill at me.I did have a decent hand, wasn't hiding my cards with my hands, and wasn't slow playing, so I hope he learned a lesson.Now, if I'd done it on purpose would it have been cheating?Does intent determine cheating? Link to post Share on other sites
runthemover 39 Posted December 8, 2006 Share Posted December 8, 2006 if you're playing for candy, all the rules go out the window. Link to post Share on other sites
Actuary 3 Posted December 8, 2006 Share Posted December 8, 2006 1. DunkinDonuts: You get that smart eating sugar and coffee your whole life? 2. If someone next to me is exposing their cards, I'll simply show them my cards, thus essentially evening out the playing field. Link to post Share on other sites
theresa113 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Ethically you need to tell the person you can see their cards. You also have to do it in a direct way. I usually say "Hey, I can see your cards and I am not even trying. So please make sure you cover them well." Some people are not that sharp so be direct. I also think you should tell the table you saw cards as well since you have extra information. Maybe I go overboard, but the thing is, I want a fair game and to have a fair game, you have to be honest. It is just the way I am. I also believe in Karma. Link to post Share on other sites
Merby 3 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I'm not old enough to play in casinos yet, but I'm wondering whether or not I should tell every1 if I see the bottom of the deck. The dealers likely are good at hiding it, but at friendly games, I always tell because I don't feel right playing with that extra advantage. When I win I want it to be because of skill and right moves, not because I knew my odds are a lil better because I saw the bottom card. So in a casino should I keep my mouth shut, or should I tell every1 that I saw the bottom card? This is not an issue at a casino. The casinos use cut-cards (blank plastic cards the same size as the deck) so you can never see the bottom card of the deck. At least I've never been able to see it... Link to post Share on other sites
Sluggo 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Be a good human being and tell the person you can see his cards. Link to post Share on other sites
JaysForLife 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Be a good human being and tell the person you can see his cards.Nah I think I'd much rather stack them. When I sit down at the table my goal is to win as much money as possible. If the player next to me is holding up their cards in plain sight im going use that information to my advantage. Link to post Share on other sites
HangukMiguk 8 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Hypothetically (just to add more fuel to this fire):Your usual online poker site develops a glitch (a la Tritz) where you can see other players' hole cards. You are not using a program to cause this, so you are not cheating, this is free information that the site is giving away because of the glitch. Do you tell support, or do you use the information?If you tell support, and the bug is not fixed, what then? Link to post Share on other sites
James D 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 If you tell support, and the bug is not fixed, what then?I'd win about $1 million, then cash out quick. Link to post Share on other sites
Don Giovanni 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 you sissies. if someone is showing you their cards you use that to make more money. end of story. Link to post Share on other sites
WhatArunAA 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I used to think that any information I could get at the poker table was fair game. The older I get the more I realize that this stuff will always come back to bite you. Call it karma, call it ethics, call it whatever you want, what ever you do at a poker table will be seen by someone. The thing is you are not just cheating Mr. Big Stack, you are cheating the rest of the table and that is collusion, you can get banned, and it theory go to jail. Even if you don't get caught, somebody sitting across the table from you may see what is going on and take offense. But based on his actions, the op already gets that, so the real question becomes how do you get him to protect his cards w/o pissing him off.lol.. wtf are you going to go to jail for? Link to post Share on other sites
timwakefield 68 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Or, in chess... If your opponent is going to make a move that leaves his Queen exposed and you know that you can take it in the next move, are you going to alert him of this? No, way.Don't do it, it's a setup. He'll have checkmate in 2. Link to post Share on other sites
DunkinDonuts 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Don't do it, it's a setup. He'll have checkmate in 2.I hate to break it to you, but if Roger Clemens decides it would be fun to go toe-to-toe with Andy Pettite in a Red Sox uni, we're going to have to stick you in the bullpen. Link to post Share on other sites
TheCinciKid 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Like other have said, this is totally not cheating. It's his responsibility to protect his hand. Take the free info and use it to your advantage. In answer to the question posed in the title of this thread....it's never ok to cheat at Poker. The OP's situatoin is not cheating though. Link to post Share on other sites
blueodum 0 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 Hypothetically (just to add more fuel to this fire):Your usual online poker site develops a glitch (a la Tritz) where you can see other players' hole cards. You are not using a program to cause this, so you are not cheating, this is free information that the site is giving away because of the glitch. Do you tell support, or do you use the information?If you tell support, and the bug is not fixed, what then?Ethically, I view this situation as akin to winning a giant prize in a lottery. You sat down to play, and very unexpectedly circumstances allowed you to make a lot of money.I would win the maximum I could and then donate half to charity. Link to post Share on other sites
IQCrash 1 Posted December 9, 2006 Share Posted December 9, 2006 I would win the maximum I could and then donate half to the stripper college fund.FYP Link to post Share on other sites
jburn812 0 Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 It is not proper to let a sucker keep his money. Link to post Share on other sites
psujohn 0 Posted December 10, 2006 Share Posted December 10, 2006 Hypothetically (just to add more fuel to this fire):Your usual online poker site develops a glitch (a la Tritz) where you can see other players' hole cards. You are not using a program to cause this, so you are not cheating, this is free information that the site is giving away because of the glitch. Do you tell support, or do you use the information?If you tell support, and the bug is not fixed, what then?You withdraw all your money from the site and never play there again. And tell people at FCP and 2+2 about it.No reasonable poker software can have a "glitch" that allows your opponents hole cards to be exposed. That's because no reasonable poker software sends the info about your opponents hole cards to your PC unless/until it's a showdown and the cards are exposed. If you can see your opponents hole cards before showdown the designers of the software have their heads up their asses.Besides any "glitch" that allowed you to see your opponents hole cards would most likely expose your hole cards to others as well. Link to post Share on other sites
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