If They Are That Stupid

[SAM_Hard8 50]

What options were available to him? I'm not saying he did a great job, but what resources did he have? It was a total and utter clusterfuck down there. Think about Giuliani after 9-11. Totally lionized by it. You'd probably say he did a great job. Why? What did he really do? Said a few words.

How about a simple plan? It seems that there was none at all, zero. Giuliani was lionized because he didn't whine and cry about who's fault it was, he rolled up his sleeves and provided leadership something that Nagin showed none of. He just bitched and tried to blame everyone but himself.He had three days of warning and he should have known that the people he was responsible for had to have help to evacuate but he did nothing but suggest they leave. Then after Katrina he spent all his time criticizing the federal response instead of trying to get the people of the city to rally around each other and respond to the crisis. Remember the great "I don't want to see anybody do anymore goddamn press conferences." What a great leader. He was more worried about covering his own azz than serving his people.Oh then there's the "I can see in your eyes, you want to know, 'How do I take advantage of this incredible opportunity? How do I make sure New Orleans is not overrun with Mexican workers?'" and we don't need to talk about the "Chocolate City" speech do we.

[mk 11]

Then after Katrina he spent all his time criticizing the federal response instead of trying to get the people of the city to rally around each other and respond to the crisis. Remember the great "I don't want to see anybody do anymore goddamn press conferences." What a great leader. He was more worried about covering his own azz than serving his people.Oh then there's the "I can see in your eyes, you want to know, 'How do I take advantage of this incredible opportunity? How do I make sure New Orleans is not overrun with Mexican workers?'" and we don't need to talk about the "Chocolate City" speech do we.

I think he was fairly justified in criticizing the federal and state response. He totally went a little crazy, but who wouldn't in his spot? Didn't it seem like he was very, very alone down there?

[SAM_Hard8 50]

I think he was fairly justified in criticizing the federal and state response. He totally went a little crazy, but who wouldn't in his spot? Didn't it seem like he was very, very alone down there?

Well the fed response sucked and the state response sucked. There was a lot of sucking to go around. But when your city is in crises, a leader needs to stay positive and lead. Save the complaining for later.That is what a leaders primary job is and he failed miserably!

[mk 11]

Well the fed response sucked and the state response sucked. There was a lot of sucking to go around. But when your city is in crises, a leader needs to stay positive and lead. Save the complaining for later.That is what a leaders primary job is and he failed miserably!

Shrug, I guess I just see it from the pov that Giuliani could be positive because the reponse was excellent and he really had nothing to whine about. I think it would've been worse for Nagin to just pretend like everything was fine down there.

[Balloon guy 158]

I think the most rasicit thing we can do is let the same people be responsible for the protection of the city after Katrina as before. They obviously didn't step up, so don't act surprised when they fail again. But the mayor job is not really big enough to be responsible for levees and city wide evacuation. More of a govenor and state congressional job. He's still a donk, but not really the guy that could pull the triggers that needed to be pulled. He had many people that could override him all throughout the crisis. The govenor should be in jail thoughThe definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result

[Dirtydutch 8]

I think the most rasicit thing we can do is let the same people be responsible for the protection of the city after Katrina as before. They obviously didn't step up, so don't act surprised when they fail again. But the mayor job is not really big enough to be responsible for levees and city wide evacuation. More of a govenor and state congressional job. He's still a donk, but not really the guy that could pull the triggers that needed to be pulled. He had many people that could override him all throughout the crisis. The govenor should be in jail thoughThe definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over and expect a different result

No.

[Balloon guy 158]

No.

Or not, I'm sure Jefferson's freezer would be lighter though

[....Ian.... 0]

Balloon guy, in case you dont know, you have no ****ing clue what you are talking aboutand you dont know one thing about Nagin other than what CNN has choosen to tell you

[SAM_Hard8 50]

Balloon guy, in case you dont know, you have no ****ing clue what you are talking aboutand you dont know one thing about Nagin other than what CNN has choosen to tell you

You need to find a new line.

[....Ian.... 0]

How about a simple plan? It seems that there was none at all, zero. Giuliani was lionized because he didn't whine and cry about who's fault it was, he rolled up his sleeves and provided leadership something that Nagin showed none of. He just bitched and tried to blame everyone but himself.He had three days of warning and he should have known that the people he was responsible for had to have help to evacuate but he did nothing but suggest they leave. Then after Katrina he spent all his time criticizing the federal response instead of trying to get the people of the city to rally around each other and respond to the crisis. Remember the great "I don't want to see anybody do anymore goddamn press conferences." What a great leader. He was more worried about covering his own azz than serving his people.Oh then there's the "I can see in your eyes, you want to know, 'How do I take advantage of this incredible opportunity? How do I make sure New Orleans is not overrun with Mexican workers?'" and we don't need to talk about the "Chocolate City" speech do we.

sam, you also have no idea what the **** you are talking about. the reason i woke my son up at 1am to drive on I-10, which 2 days b4 HAD CONTRAFLOW already set up, was because nagin was on TV and said "I can't legally at this time call for an evacuation, but i think we know what we all should do"this of course was never on CNN, but i'll never forget it cuz it was the last time i'd watch TV in new orleans for 3 monthsthe response time was ****ed up, partly held up but the feds but moreso by Blanco (governor). she's alchoholic and worthless.nagin has messed up with some of his public remarks (which in turn all you actually know about him) But no city has ever gone throughanything remotely close to this.why are we even comparing this to 9/11. 9/11= 3 square miles ruined? Katrina= large metropolis 80% destroyed, and whole gulfcoast damaged. of course I'm not downplaying 9/11, but guilliani didnt go through half the **** nagin had to.there, more actual REAL info on Katrina than you've ever had b4

[Balloon guy 158]

Balloon guy, in case you dont know, you have no ****ing clue what you are talking aboutand you dont know one thing about Nagin other than what CNN has choosen to tell you

That's funny, I haven't watched CNN since Rush told me not too.Your next post though you agree with me that the governor is the real person to blame. I guess you have no clue either?

[....Ian.... 0]

sorry man i did come off harsh.but, levees are a federal responsibility, period.and the city evactuation ran just fine. however, the aftermath (of the largest natural disaster in US history) of getting people out , who against the mayor's flat out warning, ran like ****. but with the condition the city was in during the aftermath, it became unarguably a federal responsibilityNagin "If you choose to stay, please write your social security number on your body, so we can identify you" (August 27th, 2005)

[DonkSlayer 1]

but, levees are a federal responsibility, period.

Why?Why do I have to pay for your city?

[....Ian.... 0]

Why?Why do I have to pay for your city?

cuz you do beeeatch!write your congressman if you dont like it. it's not my view i'm stating, it's fact

[DonkSlayer 1]

cuz you do beeeatch!write your congressman if you dont like it. it's not my view i'm stating, it's fact

It's not a fact. Where is it written in the law that "Levees are a federal responsibility"? Right next to: New Orleans can't pay for itself to be constructed in a bowl of water?I'd rather pay to have the area restored to wetlands.

[....Ian.... 0]

It's not a fact. Where is it written in the law that "Levees are a federal responsibility"? Right next to: New Orleans can't pay for itself to be constructed in a bowl of water?I'd rather pay to have the area restored to wetlands.

i understand that most people dont know what is going on, but you shouldnt try to pretend to know by posting hereour levees, maintained, created and the responsibility of the U.S. Army Corp of Engineerswhat does the US stand for? seriously, you, understandably, know very little of what "katrina" in it's entirety really consists of.

[DonkSlayer 1]

i understand that most people dont know what is going on, but you shouldnt try to pretend to know by posting hereour levees, maintained, created and the responsibility of the U.S. Army Corp of Engineerswhat does the US stand for? seriously, you, understandably, know very little of what "katrina" in it's entirety really consists of.

I understand perfectly what the current situation is, I'm challenging "why". You don't really like to get into that though, do you?Stop building your city under sea level right next to the Gulf of Mexico, dumbass.

[....Ian.... 0]

I understand perfectly what the current situation is, I'm challenging "why". You don't really like to get into that though, do you?Stop building your city under sea level right next to the Gulf of Mexico, dumbass.

i built new orleans, it wasnt formed from the HUGE US port. i also built the 2nd largest city in the US on a big *** faultlinei also built every small city in the midwest that gets hit by tornados

[DonkSlayer 1]

i built new orleans, it wasnt formed from the HUGE US port.

"Dude, it was the craziest thing. We built this port, and overnight, all these damn little houses sprung up. Then chicks started taking off their tops. I tried to spray something but they kept growing."

i also built the 2nd largest city in the US on a big *** faultline

Dumbass. They're prepared though.

i also built every small city in the midwest that gets hit by tornados

How dare you! Random acts of God that may travel 20 miles and cut a 1/8th swathe of destruction, and you put your little town in the midwest, which is appx. a bazillion acres? What an *******.

[BigDMcGee 3,352]

i built new orleans, it wasnt formed from the HUGE US port. i also built the 2nd largest city in the US on a big *** faultlinei also built every small city in the midwest that gets hit by tornados

Ian... let it go.. before you pop a vessel in your brain. You're arguing with a waste of skin.

[princeof56k 0]

Ian is right. People were told about the danger and to evacuate long before Katrina hit. Some people just didnt go (and I think most of them were poor people). And its practically impossible to evacuate an entire city that size (as Houston found out shortly thereafter).The Bush administration does share part of the blame for putting FEMA under the department of Homeland Security. Frontline on PBS had a very good show about this (Frontline does some of the best reporting out there IMO. If you've never seen it, I suggest you try giving it a look). You can see the episode i'm talking about online at this link.http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/storm/view/And are the levees a federal responsiblity? Sure, but that doesnt mean we have to like that fact. I live in Oklahoma now. I'm perfectly aware of the risk of tornadoes here. If I get hit by one, so be it. But I'm not gonna tell some guy in Oregon that he should bail me out because I decided to live here.

[brvheart 1,752]

the best man won the runoff (there were however better choices in the primary)OP, maybe you oughta turn off CNN, get down to new orleans and see whats REALLY going on here, before you start commenting on something where all you know is what they've choosen to tell youOP you seem just as uneducated as most on this topic. levee protection was a federal responsibility, which OUR federal government messed up and OUR federal government should fix

So in '93 when my city in Iowa completely flooded that was the federal governments fault? WHERE'S MY ****ING HAND OUT!!!?!?!? The thing is that New Orleans ignoring the problem for like 150 years is not my problem, and my tax dollars should NOT pay for that cities stupidity.

[BigDMcGee 3,352]

And are the levees a federal responsiblity? Sure, but that doesnt mean we have to like that fact. I live in Oklahoma now. I'm perfectly aware of the risk of tornadoes here. If I get hit by one, so be it. But I'm not gonna tell some guy in Oregon that he should bail me out because I decided to live here.

FIrst off, the nation as a whole does benefit greatly on the levee protection that is around New Oreleans. It's the second biggest commerical port in the nation, and basically all of our nations off shore crude oil makes it's way through NO. Any one think this has any impact on the nation? Also, I think we seem to philosophically differ on nation respondsiblity towrds acts of god. It seems to me to be a pretty good Idea to fund federal programs to help clean up and rebuild parts of the nation if they get ravaged by acts of god. I know it might burn someone's *** up in fargo, where there are relatively few AoG to worry about, to have to subsize the clean up of Katrina. But I think that's one of the proper fucntions of a federal government, is to provide for the general welfare of it's citizens, and having yoru town leveled by a hurricane tends to fall into that catagory, to me. You can agrue about the merits of HAVING a central, federal stlye gov. if you wish, but that's really a topic for another discussion.

[DonkSlayer 1]

FIrst off, the nation as a whole does benefit greatly on the levee protection that is around New Oreleans. It's the second biggest commerical port in the nation, and basically all of our nations off shore crude oil makes it's way through NO. Any one think this has any impact on the nation?

Erm, how much shipping comes into the 9th Ward?

Also, I think we seem to philosophically differ on nation respondsiblity towrds acts of god.

QFT

It seems to me to be a pretty good Idea to fund federal programs to help clean up and rebuild parts of the nation if they get ravaged by acts of god. I know it might burn someone's *** up in fargo, where there are relatively few AoG to worry about, to have to subsize the clean up of Katrina. But I think that's one of the proper fucntions of a federal government, is to provide for the general welfare of it's citizens, and having yoru town leveled by a hurricane tends to fall into that catagory, to me. You can agrue about the merits of HAVING a central, federal stlye gov. if you wish, but that's really a topic for another discussion.

"Federal" only means separation of powers, and separate from states...so "federal" really is anti-strong central government.That having been said, you're right, we do look at things differently. I lean toward an interstate road/military/environment/diplomacy role for the federal government, vs. taking an active role in the daily life of Americans. I don't hate you for feeling differently, though. I do get really pissed off when people have different opinions on this and then attack the opposite as being "wrong"; it's just a different philosophy.

[....Ian.... 0]

Erm, how much shipping comes into the 9th Ward?

or gentilly, or lakeview, or NO east, or half of uptown or all the other non-100% black areas that the national media never mentions, yet suffered the same fate.aand your logic is as expected . people that WORK in the port industry LIVE in all parts of the cityFed Gov "Hey you can live in this city"people "is it safe"Fed Gov "We're going to make it safe, we're sending in the army corp, you can live there"people "OK thanks, the US army corp? great"**katrina ensues**People "WTF? you said it was safe?!?"rest of country "fuk you guys, you should not have lived in a place the Feds said was safe"^^^^tone= humoroussituation= real