strong enough draw to push?

[Dubey 1,035]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (9 handed) converterButton (t1125)SB (t1650)BB (t2020)UTG (t980)UTG+1 (t170)MP1 (t2975)Hero (t1320)MP3 (t3080)CO (t6350)Preflop: Hero is MP2 with [Ks], [Qs]. UTG raises to t150, BB calls t140, UTG calls t20.Flop: (t865) [8d], [9s], [Js] (5 players)Final Pot: t865on the turn, the preflop raiser pushes all-in. easy push with 2 overs and gut shot straight flush draw + second nut flush draw?

[shortfuze 0]

What was your read on the player? Seems like he probably either has AA or 10-10, could be overplaying a-k but, perhaps a-10. if he is playing 10-10 that kills several of your outs. if you hit a q he makes a straight, plus he has two of your straight outs. my guess thouugh is that he has a-a with the spade and is pushing because this flop doesn't look too good for him. if so that takes away your q-k over outs. he could even have a set, the other all in probably has a few of your outs locked up too. normally i think i would wait for another time, usually don't like to call all ins with only a draw and likely several unclean outs but you're also a relatively short stack. is this a sng or mtt? the blinds are still pretty low, i would probably wait but that's just me.shortfuze

[Dubey 1,035]

from what I could gather, he was Loose aggressive, but hadn't raised many pots preflop. I had him on either a high pocket pair QQ-AA, or AK. TT is a possibility, but I doubt he'd raise that strongly PF with TT.thing is, even if I put him on KK, or AA with the A of spades, I think I still have odds to call here.from cardplayer:on the flop, against QQ - I am 55-45 favouriteagainst KK - I am 46.3-53.8 underdogagainst AxAs - I am 42.3-57.7 underdogagainst TxTs - I am 45.9-54.1 underdogagainst AsTx (highly doubtful) - 45-55 underdogthis was a mtt wsop freeroll qualifier. (part of their 25 wsop seat freeroll promotion for new players) 145 players remained and I needed to finish top 18 to qualify for the final.

[shortfuze 0]

given the situation, you need top 18, i would probably push em in. you're already shortstacked and you may have to do it later in a more marginal situation. you're going to have to win some races in a freeroll like that.what happened? i assume because you're asking that you pushed and didn't catch.-shortfuze

[Dubey 1,035]

yeah I pushed, turn and river were blanks, he won with QQ.

[shortfuze 0]

obviously this quote doesn't apply to all situations but someone (Amir Vahedi maybe?) said that if you're not ecstatic that someone pushed all in, you probably shouldn't call all in. wish i could remember that because lately i've been cruising along in tourneys only to make that one crucial mistake that i didn't need to make because i had a good size stack. -shortfuze

[BeanGW 0]

on the turn, the preflop raiser pushes all-in. easy push with 2 overs and gut shot straight flush draw + second nut flush draw?

Am I missing something? What was the turn card that he pushed on? Guessing it was a blank? I'm confuzed, but maybe cauz iz time for me to go home from work.************************Now, if what you mean is that on the FLOP the UTG guy with 980 pushed all in... then I'd fold. No reason to chance it by calling away most of your chips in now when you've got 1k left and low blinds. You will only be called by a very strong hand that you will have to draw out on to stay alive.I hate calling away my chips. You lose one of the most important reason you are pushing, ie fold equity. Also, if anything you want a lot of action staying in this pot, you don't want them to fold. And they are likely already folding to the first all-in. Now, if you were on the button and there was a lot of action already, maybe it's worth taking a shot to push yourself into the chip lead... but otherwise, you can pick a better spot to get your chips in there for sure.

[Dubey 1,035]

my apologies, that was a typo. on the flop, UTG pushed all-in.

[BeanGW 0]

my apologies, that was a typo. on the flop, UTG pushed all-in.

No prob. You should have folded this one though. If he wants to buy the pot, give it to him. Don't put all yr chips out there on a draw when you really aren't short stacked. In addition, you were on the second nutz flush draw, and an inside straight draw. Those aren't the strongest of draws. You fold, and you've got 1100 left with BB of 30. You're in fine shape.

[sam_abc777 0]

I think u fold. U have pot odds and this would b an easy call in a cash game. However this early in a tournament, u gotta fold. No need to gamble this early in a tournament.

[Nutcracker 0]

You have the guy covered, are getting better than 2:1 on your money, and at worst you're a 55/45 underdog. I call this.

[cdddc75 0]

fold preflopseriously

[Canada 0]

fold preflopseriously

[sam_abc777 0]

yeah, u have the pusher covered but the CO and BB r behind u and they might decide to push u all in. If u call the first bet and the CO or BB pushes u have no choice but to call. And also, while u do have the guy covered if u call and lose, yur down to only 340 in chips. Ud b severely crippled. Let the guys behind u take him out. And o yeah, I probably woulda have folded preflop. UTG raiser means likely holdings are A-K, A-Q, Q-Q, K-K, and A-A. All have u totally dominated.

[Nutcracker 0]

yeah, u have the pusher covered but the CO and BB r behind u and they might decide to push u all in.

Hell, that would be even better. Then you'd be getting about 3:1 on your money and your chances to win don't go down much.Would you call an all in preflop with AA if you were going to be against 3 opponents? Your chance to win is around 50%, but you're getting 3:1 on your money. Same thing as this situation really. You are getting sick odds considering your chance to win the hand. If I thought I was so vastly better than the rest of the players that I could just outplay them, I might pass up this deal. But I don't have a retardedly big ego that makes me play like a moron, so I call this.

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

on the flop, against QQ - I am 55-45 favourite  against KK - I am 46.3-53.8 underdog  against AxAs - I am 42.3-57.7 underdog  against TxTs - I am 45.9-54.1 underdog  against AsTx (highly doubtful) - 45-55 underdog

So the decision was push or fold... in a tournament... and you knew your odds would approximate this?Why are you bucking such a marginal edge (either way)?Just fold. Maybe even preflop.

[Dubey 1,035]

fold preflopseriously

I very, very nearly did.

[Diboss 0]

Didn't read through all the posts, but I seriously don't understand the fold option here. That's a very very sweet draw, and you'd be happier if others stayed as well.

[mk 11]

fold preflopseriously

seriously, wtf are you doing calling here? i wouldn't even open a pot with this hand this early in a tourney. you're calling 2 bets cold?

[shortfuze 0]

The more i look at this hand the easier it is to fold. You have two overs that probably aren't clean considering the amount of callers and you're not even drawing to the nut flush. Don't forget how much people love to play a-x suited for situations exactly like this where there are lots of callers and huge implied odds if you hit. you probably should have folded in the first place considering the two raises in front of you but you didn't. now you have the chance to let it go and still have a lot of chips relative to the blinds. believe me i like to gamble in small buy in tourneys when i think i have close to the best of it or am only a slight dog because they aren't worth the time unless you can accumulate a bunch of chips early but there are just too many ways you're completely dominated in this hand.If it were checked to me im much more a fan of pushing in this situation than calling an all-in. make someone else make the tough decision.-shortfuze

[TheIceman05 0]

1) Why would you open with KQs??2) Uh, do you realize the "second bet" that he's cold calling is 20 chip allin raise?I'm not saying this is an easy call. I'd probably fold it and let the other players duke it out, but more than likely you're going to get to see cards cheap in position with a player between you and the opener all-in. Ice

[Actuary 3]

did u just say "two bets cold" in a No Limti tourney.Me, I call and push or call push all in on flop.for me, its an easy call. And I do do well in SnG's, so I'd feel ok about my chances to place even if I did fold..its just that doubling/tripling up (or close..i didnt add it all up) is so sweet. Great draw.Late in tourney, if 4-5 left..I fold. If I'm a med/big stack. Let someone else bubbe off.

[screech 0]

Push.You have at least 13 outs, and probably no more than that.You're hand will come in about 50% of the time and you're getting about 2-1 on your money (if no one else calls).Also, if no one but you and the preflop raiser play this hand, you will still have about 10bb left to try and make something happen.