Flushgarden 0 Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 A lot of things happening today, on this first day of free agency.So far:Haynesworth signed with the Redskins.DeAngelo Hall signed wtih the Redskins.Kellen Winslow traded to Tampa Bay.Fred Taylor signed with New England.Also I'm hearing the Matt Cassel trade is very close to happening. Link to post Share on other sites
rocketpoker828 0 Posted February 27, 2009 Share Posted February 27, 2009 yay, gus frerotte is gone! Link to post Share on other sites
Flushgarden 0 Posted February 27, 2009 Author Share Posted February 27, 2009 Its just a rumor but I'm reading about a 3 way deal with New England, Kansas City and Carolina where in which Kansas City would get Cassel, New England would get Julius Peppers, and Carolina would get Kansas City's #3 pick in the draft.I doubt it will happen but I'd love it.One thing that has happened already is Mike Vrabel has been traded to KC today for an undisclosed draft pick. I don't think they'd let go of Vrabel unless they had plans for another lb to come in. Link to post Share on other sites
Flushgarden 0 Posted February 28, 2009 Author Share Posted February 28, 2009 Cassel + Vrabel to the Chiefs for their 2nd round pick, #34 overall. As a Patriots fan I'm definitely feeling a bit robbed. On the bright side, they do now have another 18 million in free cap space which will be put to very good use. An early 2nd round pick in this draft is not too bad because this is a very deep draft...but I can't help but feel they should have gotten a first for him. Link to post Share on other sites
brvheart 1,752 Posted February 28, 2009 Share Posted February 28, 2009 http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3942161Brian Dawkins to the Broncos. Link to post Share on other sites
mrpaddyx 13 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Cassel + Vrabel to the Chiefs for their 2nd round pick, #34 overall. As a Patriots fan I'm definitely feeling a bit robbed. On the bright side, they do now have another 18 million in free cap space which will be put to very good use. An early 2nd round pick in this draft is not too bad because this is a very deep draft...but I can't help but feel they should have gotten a first for him.Guess Pioli must have had some kind of inside dirt on Belicheck. I can't believe the Partiots couldn't get better value for Cassell than a rubbishy 2nd round pick. Link to post Share on other sites
WKTSWAY 0 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Guess Pioli must have had some kind of inside dirt on Belicheck. I can't believe the Partiots couldn't get better value for Cassell than a rubbishy 2nd round pick.NE didn't want to pay the money a first rounder would command....that's how they are... Link to post Share on other sites
mrpaddyx 13 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 NE didn't want to pay the money a first rounder would command....that's how they are...Its that type of penny pinching attitude that meant the Patriots didn't make the play-offs last season. Link to post Share on other sites
Flushgarden 0 Posted March 1, 2009 Author Share Posted March 1, 2009 Its that type of penny pinching attitude that meant the Patriots didn't make the play-offs last season.lolIf you're serious then you're retarded.Ok not retarded, but there is a thing called a "salary cap" in the NFL. Some people...like those in an organization that has won the Superbowl 3 times this decade, feel that there is more value in a high 2nd round pick because they get a good quality player without using up a large chunk of the salary cap. They can then use that extra salary cap room to go out and sign other quality players....that's how they are. It's not like they're trying to spend as little as possible. Every NFL teams basically spends the same amount. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 Guess Pioli must have had some kind of inside dirt on Belicheck. I can't believe the Partiots couldn't get better value for Cassell than a rubbishy 2nd round pick.Cassell's 1 yr, 14 mill contract helped move things along.In other news, Josh McDaniels is a ****ing moron. He tried to get Cassel......and failed. In the process, he has completely alienated his franchise QB (Cutler who is BETTER than Cassel). Nice start ****head. Link to post Share on other sites
mrpaddyx 13 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 lolIf you're serious then you're retarded.Ok not retarded, but there is a thing called a "salary cap" in the NFL. Some people...like those in an organization that has won the Superbowl 3 times this decade, feel that there is more value in a high 2nd round pick because they get a good quality player without using up a large chunk of the salary cap. They can then use that extra salary cap room to go out and sign other quality players....that's how they are. It's not like they're trying to spend as little as possible. Every NFL teams basically spends the same amount.I'm certainly not retarded just still a bit gutted that the Patriots didn't make the playoffs. Your post does make sense, I suppose I'm just from a country were the top sport teams don't worry about a salary cap and just spend as much as they want and to hell with the consequences. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 I'm certainly not retarded just still a bit gutted that the Patriots didn't make the playoffs. Your post does make sense, I suppose I'm just from a country were the top sport teams don't worry about a salary cap and just spend as much as they want and to hell with the consequences.you'd like baseball. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted March 1, 2009 Share Posted March 1, 2009 ..and the Green Bay Packers did absolutely nothing to fix that terrible defense.. Sigh. Cassel + Vrabel to the Chiefs for their 2nd round pick, #34 overall. As a Patriots fan I'm definitely feeling a bit robbed. On the bright side, they do now have another 18 million in free cap space which will be put to very good use. An early 2nd round pick in this draft is not too bad because this is a very deep draft...but I can't help but feel they should have gotten a first for him.Good work out of the Chiefs and Pioli, though I don't think Cassel is all that exciting. New England..eh..you'd like baseball.LOL. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 The report is that the Patriots were offered the #12 pick in the draft (Broncos 1st) for Cassel. Instead, they traded him AND Vrabel for the 34th. Two possibilities. One, Belichek colluded with Pioli and made him a sweet deal (and rewarded Cassel by sending him to Pioli). Not out of the question.Or, the Pats are hurting with the cap and 1) wanted a team to take Vrabel's contract off their hands as a condition of getting Cassel---plus 2) they did not want to have to pay 1st round money to two guys.I think either explanation could be right. I would be mad if my team left 22 spots in the draft on the table. Pats did pretty damn good with the 10th pick last year getting Mayo. Plus, they could have used the pick as trade bait for a team that wanted Mark Sanchez (who should go in the 10-20 range).Maybe Kraft is hurting for cash.... Link to post Share on other sites
rocketpoker828 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 Please TJ Whosyourdaddy to Minnesota one time? Link to post Share on other sites
flyingdonkey 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 The report is that the Patriots were offered the #12 pick in the draft (Broncos 1st) for Cassel. Instead, they traded him AND Vrabel for the 34th. Two possibilities. One, Belichek colluded with Pioli and made him a sweet deal (and rewarded Cassel by sending him to Pioli). Not out of the question.Or, the Pats are hurting with the cap and 1) wanted a team to take Vrabel's contract off their hands as a condition of getting Cassel---plus 2) they did not want to have to pay 1st round money to two guys.I think either explanation could be right. I would be mad if my team left 22 spots in the draft on the table. Pats did pretty damn good with the 10th pick last year getting Mayo. Plus, they could have used the pick as trade bait for a team that wanted Mark Sanchez (who should go in the 10-20 range).Maybe Kraft is hurting for cash....It's extremely foolish to think the BB would do this to help an old friend out... if that's really what some of you think then you have no clue as to how the Patriots run their organization. The Bucs and Broncos showed up too late to the party, the paperwork was already in when they decided to make a move for Cassel. I guess the Pats could have backed out of the deal with the Chiefs since nothing was signed, but not with Pioli there. The Broncos and Bucs are the real idiots in all of this, why wait so long to try and make a trade? It's not like they didn't know Cassel was available. The Bucs had been having discussions with the Pats about Cassel but I guess weren't all that interested, but then they show up with a 1st and 3rd round offer when it's too late?!?!? The Patriots had to trade Cassel right away if they wanted to be players early on in the FA period. Now they have around 19 million in cap space they can use to resign players like Wilfork, Mankins, Sanders... Not to mention they have 4 day 1 picks to mess around with! Link to post Share on other sites
flyingdonkey 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 NE didn't want to pay the money a first rounder would command....that's how they are...Then how do you explain them taking Seymour and Mayo really early in the draft? They aren't afraid to pick a player early on if they think he will be a difference maker. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 It's extremely foolish to think the BB would do this to help an old friend out... if that's really what some of you think then you have no clue as to how the Patriots run their organization. The Bucs and Broncos showed up too late to the party, the paperwork was already in when they decided to make a move for Cassel. I guess the Pats could have backed out of the deal with the Chiefs since nothing was signed, but not with Pioli there. The Broncos and Bucs are the real idiots in all of this, why wait so long to try and make a trade? It's not like they didn't know Cassel was available. The Bucs had been having discussions with the Pats about Cassel but I guess weren't all that interested, but then they show up with a 1st and 3rd round offer when it's too late?!?!? The Patriots had to trade Cassel right away if they wanted to be players early on in the FA period. Now they have around 19 million in cap space they can use to resign players like Wilfork, Mankins, Sanders... Not to mention they have 4 day 1 picks to mess around with!They had NOT signed the papers yet. It is confirmed that they got the Broncos offer in plenty of time. If you DONT back out of a tentative deal for another deal that gains you a 22 spot jump in the draft, then you helped an old friend out. (you said it yourself: "not with pioli there"----translation: if it was not pioli, Belicheck would have backed out and taken the better deal.)thanks for making my point. Link to post Share on other sites
flyingdonkey 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 They had NOT signed the papers yet. It is confirmed that they got the Broncos offer in plenty of time. If you DONT back out of a tentative deal for another deal that gains you a 22 spot jump in the draft, then you helped an old friend out. (you said it yourself: "not with pioli there"----translation: if it was not pioli, Belicheck would have backed out and taken the better deal.)thanks for making my point.Up until Friday not one team had made a serious offer for Cassel, at least not one that was better then the 34th pick. In order to be a player in FA early on AND re sign key players he decided he needed to take the best offer he could get right away, so he called K.C. and asked for the 34th pick. They agreed to a deal, got the paperwork done, Vrabel go his physical done... then the Broncos and Bucs came in and threw out some ideas of a 3 way trade. You seem to think there was a solid deal on the table for all three teams... there wasn't! Say the Patriots decided to try and work out a deal with the Broncos on a 3 team trade but couldn't get it done. Now the Chiefs are pissed and take back their offer because BB went back on his word. So the Patriots are left with about 2 million in cap space and two QB's making 14 million this season. Maybe BB could have waited and got a better deal, but considering the circumstances he did the right thing. I'm glad he stayed true to his word and went through with the trade, there was no need to ruin a 20 year relationship with one of his best friends over this. I guess BB is not as heartless as everyone thinks...Just curious as to what you would have done if you were the Patriots considering everything we know now? Link to post Share on other sites
WKTSWAY 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 Then how do you explain them taking Seymour and Mayo really early in the draft? They aren't afraid to pick a player early on if they think he will be a difference maker.They had those picks at that time and needed to...from what I read, KC wanted to give their 1st rounder, but NE wanted the 2nd....maybe as you said, they don't think there is a difference maker there at pick 3 and that would be a LOT of guaranteed money to an unproven player. Maybe they really like a guy who will be there at the start of the 2nd round and they get to pay less money for them.You are a NE fan, you know what I meant by saying "that's how they are." They are a team that gets good players that people don't know about as really good, and don't have to spend as much on them in the process. If the player is getting older and is going to sign a huge deal, they let them go to another team that wants to overpay. Link to post Share on other sites
flyingdonkey 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 They had those picks at that time and needed to...from what I read, KC wanted to give their 1st rounder, but NE wanted the 2nd....maybe as you said, they don't think there is a difference maker there at pick 3 and that would be a LOT of guaranteed money to an unproven player. Maybe they really like a guy who will be there at the start of the 2nd round and they get to pay less money for them.You are a NE fan, you know what I meant by saying "that's how they are." They are a team that gets good players that people don't know about as really good, and don't have to spend as much on them in the process. If the player is getting older and is going to sign a huge deal, they let them go to another team that wants to overpay. BB called the Chiefs and made the offer of Cassel and Vrabel for #34. I'm sure they talked about it before Friday, but he's the one that initiated the trade.It just doesn't make any sense that KC would offer the #3 pick and the Patriots would reject that... I don't know where you're reading that, not saying that you're lying... I have no life so I spend a lot of time reading anything I can Pats related and I never heard that.What I did read this morning is the Lions offered the #33 pick for Cassel straight up and they turned it down because Lions didn't want to take Vrabel. Vrabel was due a roster bonus on March 1st so I'm sure the Pats wanted to get rid of him before they had to pay it or have to cut one of the greatest Patriots of all time. Plus Cassel did a lot for the Pats this season, why reward him by sending him to the Lions!? Link to post Share on other sites
CindyLou 11 Posted March 2, 2009 Share Posted March 2, 2009 Once upon a time, not so long ago and not too far away, a young wanderer and sorcerer's apprentice from the East, Pioli, made his way West to find his fortune. At the confluence of the mighty rivers Kansas and Missouri, athwart that gateway to burnt-end sandwiches and the rolling yellow plains, Pioli did plant the flag of his ambitions. "Here shall I build my castle," he said. And he wished hard to the heavens that his dreams might come true. Upon hearing this, the distant spirit of the ancient wizard Belichick appeared to him from the clouds. "I have just the Cassel you need," said the sorcerer. "Hit me back when you get this."And they did conference several days and nights in utmost secret upon the matter until agreement was reached.To outward appearance, it was a deal too good to be true. As such, the younger magician was sore perturbed."But what of Goodell," said Pioli, "and his legion of cranky scribes and inky underlings? What of the Electronic Opiners and the Talking Haircuts? To hear these inquisitive henchmen tell it, they are the Guardians of the Game. Will we not rouse their suspicions of Old-Boyism and insider back-scratchery?""They are as trolls and garden gnomes to me, and too busy hoeing their own row. With my winning ways I have bewitched them all into indifference," said the hooded magus Belichick. "An .824 record in the playoffs these past nine seasons shuts a lot of mouths and eyes and ears. And also, we'll announce on a Saturday, when everyone's at the mall and no one's online.""However can I repay you?" asked the grateful apprentice."Someday, and that day may never come, I'll call upon you to do a service for me," whispered the aging necromancer, disappearing in a puff of sulfured smoke.So Pioli and the People of the Plains rejoiced at their new fortune and their gilded future, and downloaded photos of the Brady/Bundchen wedding in great numbers to augur what might lie ahead for them all.But in the midnight hours of his soul, Pioli sometimes grew restless, tossing and turning with worry at the devilish bargain he had made. Had the Hooded One gotten the better of him?And in those dark, not-so-happily-ever-after moments, the Great Howling Husky of the Old Skool, Calhoun, ran hunched and rabid through the moonlit forests to comfort him by roaring, "Not a dime back! Not a dime back!"link Link to post Share on other sites
Flushgarden 0 Posted March 2, 2009 Author Share Posted March 2, 2009 "apparently Bill Belichick became a non-competitive idiot overnight" Link to post Share on other sites
rocketpoker828 0 Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 Please TJ Whosyourdaddy to Minnesota one time?signed with Seattle, and considering how much for, kinda happy he didn't come to Minnesota. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 3, 2009 Share Posted March 3, 2009 I think the bottom line for the Pats is twofold.1) Belichek did not get full value for Cassel and Vrabel. That is clear. No one is perfect. He could have had more if he waited it seems. For whatever reason (and there are lots of possibilities), he was cool with just a high 2nd rounder.2) It does not matter. Vrabel is aging and Cassel is redundant and overpaid at 14 mill. Who knows how he will be without Moss and Welker and Co. They dont lose much with the trade. The Patriots were 11-5 last year and, yet, they once again have 4 picks in the top 60 of the draft. Its incredible. You can plug so many holes with that. 2nd rounders are usually great players. With their draft track record, you can count on them turning that haul into at least 3 starters. So not getting full value in this trade is not a big deal. Link to post Share on other sites
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