Off Season Discussion Thread

[tskillz187 0]

How is Duncan as best player in the game not arguable? He doesn't have most MVP's, doesn't have best numbers, and if we are talking about playoff success we have to look at the whole team, don't we? That has been your defense to my arguments.Yao will have trouble with smaller quicker Pf's and Centers. I'm not talking about pick and roll situations where he is on a PG, comparing how he covered Boozer to how Shaq would cover Boykins doesn't make sense. Boozer is a big man. Boozer plays bigger than Okur does, who was Yao supposed to cover? Luckily for Nowitzki there aren't a bunch of long strong athletic 6'8'' guys in the league, Golden State has about 5 of them. He will continue to struggle scoring against anyone of that mold, I doubt Nowitzki has another year as good as this past one ever again. Nelly exposed him and it wasn't a fluke it was flaws in his game.

[mcpickl 0]

How is Duncan as best player in the game not arguable? He doesn't have most MVP's, doesn't have best numbers, and if we are talking about playoff success we have to look at the whole team, don't we? That has been your defense to my arguments.Yao will have trouble with smaller quicker Pf's and Centers. I'm not talking about pick and roll situations where he is on a PG, comparing how he covered Boozer to how Shaq would cover Boykins doesn't make sense. Boozer is a big man. Boozer plays bigger than Okur does, who was Yao supposed to cover? Luckily for Nowitzki there aren't a bunch of long strong athletic 6'8'' guys in the league, Golden State has about 5 of them. He will continue to struggle scoring against anyone of that mold, I doubt Nowitzki has another year as good as this past one ever again. Nelly exposed him and it wasn't a fluke it was flaws in his game.

His success is not from being on the best team, the Spurs are the best team because he is on it. He dominates games on both ends of the floor. He covers up for his teammates deficiencies defensively by being the ultimate defender protecting the rim. Offensively he's so good that he must be doubled every time he touches the ball that he creates space for Parker and Ginobili, so much so that his presence has fooled people into thinking those guys are premier players. Parker is a complete liability on the defensive end of the floor. Ginobili is a good player, but not in the top 25 guys in the game. I hope at some point San Antonio lets someone else overpay these guys and see what they are elsewhere. They will be shells of what they are with the Spurs. Duncan is not just the best player in the NBA today, he's one of the best 20 players of all time.

[tskillz187 0]

As long as we can agree Parker is overrated and Ginobili is better than him that's fine with me. Ginobs stayed when he could have left for more money and he could easily avg 24ppg with other teams in the NBA. He plays like 26mpg and avgs 16, he has basically no plays run for him until the 4th quarter and he is depended on to close games (as well as Duncan). I doubt Ginobs will leave in his career, Parker is much younger so anything could happen as I doubt they commit to him as their franchise player.Also your first sentence is highly debateable, Horry, Barry, Finley, Bowen are not just chumps, they all have a role that they fit very well, Cleveland and Miami would like players like this to fit in right now.

[princeof56k 0]

I really like what the Rockets have done so far. The Francis signing was mentioned, but they also picked up Luis Scola to be the power forward. For those who don't know Scola, he's another player from the 2004 Argentina Team. He won the MVP in the Spanish league league twice. So the guy can play, and should be an upgrade. The Rockets also picked up Mike James, and drafted Aaron Brooks. Brooks was named the best rookie at the Summer league.Alston will surely be traded, and I think Luther Head might go as well.The starting lineup will likely beFrancisMcGradyBattierScolaYaoThe bench players should beMike JamesBonzi WellsChuck HaysMutombo (assuming they sign him)Aaron BrooksThat looks good on paper. Definitely an improvement on last years team. And with Adelman as the coach, that lineup should easily score over 100 points per game. The West is tough, but I think the Rockets might make some noise.

[Jadaki 0]

I really like what the Rockets have done so far. The Francis signing was mentioned, but they also picked up Luis Scola to be the power forward. For those who don't know Scola, he's another player from the 2004 Argentina Team. He won the MVP in the Spanish league league twice. So the guy can play, and should be an upgrade. The Rockets also picked up Mike James, and drafted Aaron Brooks. Brooks was named the best rookie at the Summer league.Alston will surely be traded, and I think Luther Head might go as well.The starting lineup will likely beFrancisMcGradyBattierScolaYaoThe bench players should beMike JamesBonzi WellsChuck HaysMutombo (assuming they sign him)Aaron BrooksThat looks good on paper. Definitely an improvement on last years team. And with Adelman as the coach, that lineup should easily score over 100 points per game. The West is tough, but I think the Rockets might make some noise.

A lot of that will depend on how well Francis merges with McGrady and if the guys coming off the bench who think they should be starters get enough minutes to keep them happy. Lots of mild head cases on that bench. They do look a lot better "on paper".

[tskillz187 0]

I think Head and Alston are both better than Francis, and possibly Brooks. I don't really get the Francis sign. He did cross the mess out of Derek Anderson here

at about 3:14 on that vid. That's about the worst I've seen someone look in a dribbling sequence.

[princeof56k 0]

I think Head and Alston are both better than Francis, and possibly Brooks. I don't really get the Francis sign. He did cross the mess out of Derek Anderson here

at about 3:14 on that vid. That's about the worst I've seen someone look in a dribbling sequence.

Are you serious? I dont think there's anyway thats true. I'm not saying Francis is the best player out there. He wasnt anwhere close to being worth that old contract. But as far as playing ability goes, he's way better than Alston and Head. I dont think its even close.I think the signing was a no brainer. First he came cheap at $2.4 million. With his ability, you have to sign him for that price. He wants to play in Houston, he's good friends with Yao, and realizes he's at best the 3rd option on offense. The Rockets needed more offensive threats. Just having McGrady wasnt enough to take the pressure off Yao. The Rockets should now be able to put at least 2 offensive threats on the floor with Yao at all times. And Francis was better than any other PG they could realisticly get right now. I think the signing is going to work out extremely well.Jadaki was right though, it only looks good on paper. There's a lot of "ifs" in the Rockets lineup.

[tskillz187 0]

I hate PGs that can't shoot or distribute. Francis needs to dominate the ball to be productive, or at least to this point in his career that is true. Alston and Head can both shoot the 3, Houston needs that. What the Rockets needed was a PF Scola might be the piece, obviously I know everything about Argentina because I'm obsessed with Ginobili. I like Scola's game but he's a bit unathletic and a bit undersized. He's tenacious though, just like Nocioni, it's a good pick up.

[mcpickl 0]

As long as we can agree Parker is overrated and Ginobili is better than him that's fine with me. Ginobs stayed when he could have left for more money and he could easily avg 24ppg with other teams in the NBA. He plays like 26mpg and avgs 16, he has basically no plays run for him until the 4th quarter and he is depended on to close games (as well as Duncan). I doubt Ginobs will leave in his career, Parker is much younger so anything could happen as I doubt they commit to him as their franchise player.Also your first sentence is highly debateable, Horry, Barry, Finley, Bowen are not just chumps, they all have a role that they fit very well, Cleveland and Miami would like players like this to fit in right now.

I agree to all of this.The spurs have been very smart in getting a bunch of guys that do one or two things well. A lot of good role players, which is basically all that's needed around Duncan. Guys who are worried about their touches need not apply in San Antonio.

[mcpickl 0]

I think Head and Alston are both better than Francis, and possibly Brooks. I don't really get the Francis sign. He did cross the mess out of Derek Anderson here

at about 3:14 on that vid. That's about the worst I've seen someone look in a dribbling sequence.

I think Francis is awful as well. A big time ME guy. I'd much rather have Alston. I suspect James ends up starting over Francis at some point during the season. I don't think Head is much of a point, but I'd rather have him as a combo guard off the bench than Francis as well. As for Scola, he will be dynamite in Houston. Having Scola, Battier, and James will give them three real good role players to put around TMac and Yao. But Bonzi Wells? Geez he already quit on this team, they should just release him. Not needed.

[princeof56k 0]

But Bonzi Wells? Geez he already quit on this team, they should just release him. Not needed.

I totally agree. I think Wells will likely be the biggest headache. His attitude last year was horrible.

[Cappy37 0]

uh, he signed with Houston, not Miami.

Sorry, after we paid the second best scorer on our team about 30 million dollars to wander off, I kinda lost focus... He's in Houston now then? Hmm.. Well, he's gotta be better then Alston.. Or was Alston on the Heat? Bah, too brain-dead right now. I predict Stevie Franchise and T-Mac suit up to start together no more than 40 games next season.. I'd imagine Vegas would lay the over under about 50, so I guess I pick under. If Houston could get some inside-out going with Tmac/Francis and Yao, they could be a complete headache to defend this year.

[Cappy37 0]

The starting lineup will likely beFrancisMcGradyBattierScolaYaoThe bench players should beMike JamesBonzi WellsChuck HaysMutombo (assuming they sign him)Aaron Brooks

Good lord, you folks weren't kidding when you said there was some slight holes at PF, were you? There's a MLE for a reason Rockets.. Use it!.

[Cappy37 0]

I think Head and Alston are both better than Francis, and possibly Brooks. I don't really get the Francis sign. He did cross the mess out of Derek Anderson here

at about 3:14 on that vid. That's about the worst I've seen someone look in a dribbling sequence.

Head and Alston aren't going to get any better, just older.. You have what you have. I'm an Oregon guy, so I can tell you to pay some close attention to Aaron Brooks.. Kid has a lot of that "drive" scouts talk about. The Dennis Rodman thing where a guy just wills himself to the basket/the loose ball/the pass deflection, etc.. Brooks has got it. He's a winner. And I hope he doesn't pick any bad habits up from Franchise.. He's pretty much a combo guard, but his ability and passion remind me a lot more of Luke Ridinour than Luke Jackson, and he'll be better than both of those guys, no question. Just trust me, he'll end up being far more than a roster slot. Maybe not this season, but definitely next. Hold me to it, bookmark this thread.

[princeof56k 0]

Good lord, you folks weren't kidding when you said there was some slight holes at PF, were you? There's a MLE for a reason Rockets.. Use it!.

Yep, and that's after ungrading the position with Scola. I really think Scola will work out though. He seems to be a good fit for Yao.And I think the Rockets MLE is gone. It went to both Scola and Francis.I'm high on Brooks too. Extremely quick and has great shooting range. I saw him in the Summer league shooting from several feet behind the 3point line. If he was taller, he wouldve been drafted much higher.Clarification on Luther Head. I would like to see him stay. He's a valuable asset. But the Rockets have to cut some salary and have too many guards. I think Head is going to get traded as a salary cutting measure becuase he's the only available asset other teams might want. The Rockets still have Bob Sura's expiring contract. I think you're likely to see a trade the Rockets give up Luther Head and wants the other team to take Sura's contract. Something along those lines. But I hope Luther stays with the Rockets.

[Jadaki 0]

Mike Connelly is now signed with the Grizzlies.

[Cappy37 0]

Mike Connelly is now signed with the Grizzlies.

<tumbleweeds>Hope people remember his name in 3 years when it comes time for him to get paid for his suffering.

[Jadaki 0]

Read a rumor that Reggie Miller is talking about a 1 year return... with the Celtics.

[Jadaki 0]

And the Heat just signed Penny...He is still in the League?

[Cappy37 0]

Read a rumor that Reggie Miller is talking about a 1 year return... with the Celtics.

LOL. Garnett gets the ball in the post... Miller, Pierce, and Allen all spread out on the 3 pt line...How the.. hell.. would you defend that? Do you really even need a PG at that point? Rondo could average 20 assists and 2 shot attempts a game.

[Poppy_Hillis 11]

LOL. Garnett gets the ball in the post... Miller, Pierce, and Allen all spread out on the 3 pt line...How the.. hell.. would you defend that? Do you really even need a PG at that point? Rondo could average 20 assists and 2 shot attempts a game.

You can bet come playoff time Rondo won't be their point guard. My guess is they end up with Sam Cassell.

[tskillz187 0]

You can bet come playoff time Rondo won't be their point guard. My guess is they end up with Sam Cassell.

I mean I'm a Spurs fan, but if I see Garnett, Pierce, Allen, Miller, and Cassell I'm rooting for them big time. That would just be awesome.

[Livaso 0]

I mean I'm a Spurs fan, but if I see Garnett, Pierce, Allen, Miller, and Cassell I'm rooting for them big time. That would just be awesome.

I hope for their sake they win SOMETHING. could you imagine KG, Pierce, Allen and Miller all (re-)retiring together without any rings? While Robert Horry retires with 16.

[CaneBrain 95]

now that his buyout is complete, shouldnt the celtics sign adonal foyle? He could be had for the vet minimum and he will play D and rebound and NOT shoot.

[Jadaki 0]

Eddie Griffin just died.