SabaAba 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 He has A10 suited............i'm telling you. he was censored about the re-raise, hence the quick call. he spiked the flop and went all in to get him off the AK and flush draw.I was thinking the same thing here. I bet he has AT hearts, for some reason, that's the prettiest hand other than suited AK that you can look down at. Agree? You can't fold AT hearts, you look down see all the love and must call. But if he has AT, this is an easy easy call. Yeah you are drawing, but you are about a coinflip to win double your call amount. Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Thanks Scott, I'm not the OP, but I learned a lot from you here, thanks again.No problem. It's nice to have some discussion on here without name calling for a change, isn't it? Link to post Share on other sites
AK33 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Maybe it's me but I can't see this guy calling $200 more with ATs, what could you possibly be looking for with this call? Any ace that flops you've gotta know you could be in deep sh!t.A ten high flop? I don't think you could think you're ahead in this case.The only thing you could pray for is two pair or trip tens and in my mind it's not worth $200 more for such a slim opportunity. Just my 2 cents. ~Slick~ Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 He has A10 suited............i'm telling you.he was censored about the re-raise, hence the quick call. he spiked the flop and went all in to get him off the AK and flush draw.Hmmmm. Taking down a reraise with ATs is a bad idea, but it's a possibility that I mentioned earlier. Again...a read of some sort would be nice. A slight scowl, a grimace...a lip curl. All of these things would help make AT a little more likely. What happened the previous few hands? Did this guy have a bad beat or a tough one within the last 5 hands? If this was the case, then I would seriously vote for the guy having ATs even over AK. The reason is that if he were on tilt, he would pop the PF reraise back again with AK. He might even push all in with big slick if he were tilting. A tilting player with ATs will fall in love with it and will often quick call when he shouldn't even see the flop. With that said, even if he has 2 pair, you're still a basic coinflip to win this hand. You're about 44-45% I think to win this one, so the pot odds are easily telling you to push. Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Maybe it's me but I can't see this guy calling $200 more with ATs, what could you possibly be looking for with this call?If the opponent is emotionally even-keeled (and not crazy), then you're absolutely right. I'd rule it out in that case. Link to post Share on other sites
AK33 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Ok, a tilting player would make the call with ATs I'll give you that Scott, but man that's gotta be the worst NL preflop call I've read in a while. ~Slick~ Link to post Share on other sites
tyf70 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Easy fold for me. But I don't think you would.Just look at the way you played.Preflop: raised to 25 times of BB with AKs at the button?Flop, he checked and you made pot-sized bet. He would either fold to you but when he went all-in, he had better cards than you did.Knowing you are the very aggressive type, I wouldn't mind going allin to have you called.And no, you don't have the pot odd to call. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 31, 2005 Author Share Posted March 31, 2005 all for the responses.....yes I do play aggressively for the most part but especially with AK....just the way I prefer to play that particular hand. Anyways....First off....this guy is a regular...plays where I was often (a club in new york city) and is a guy who is not afraid to bluff or gamble. So I figured he could have a wide range of hands. So I called.He flipped over ace ten offsuit.I was pissed.Then a king hit on the river and I was no longer pissed.Thoughts on this result???By the way to those who asked, this game is my normal game...my bankroll is more than sufficient to handle losing my whole buy-in let alone my profit margin on this hand. I also saw that one person said I played this hand a little too agressively preflop. Do others think that is true? Thanks to all.Andrew Link to post Share on other sites
Smasharoo 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 How is this a tough call in any game? Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Easy fold for me.You must be a buddhist who has decided to give up all material goods and wants to get rid of his 'evil money.' :-) Preflop: raised to 25 times of BB with AKs at the button?25X the BB is irrelevant here. The number to look at is the amount of the RERAISE....which is 5x. Not crazy or too aggressive at all.Flop, he checked and you made pot-sized bet. He would either fold to you but when he went all-in, he had better cards than you did.Would he c/r with AK as well? Sure. With AQ? Sure (but less likely). Just because he went all in, you think his cards were better? It's often true, but TPTK and the nut flush draw is pretty good. Not too many range of possible hands that the opponent could beat.And no, you don't have the pot odd to call.Want to show your math behind that? If he's up against a set of anything, he's only just a touch behind on pot odds..... about .2 off. (Read my earlier post on this). The amount of times you're not up against a set make this about as brainless a call as they come. Link to post Share on other sites
Swift_Psycho 1 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Thoughts on this result??? It was good. Link to post Share on other sites
KDawgCometh 2 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 all for the responses.....yes I do play aggressively for the most part but especially with AK....just the way I prefer to play that particular hand.  Anyways....First off....this guy is a regular...plays where I was often (a club in new york city) and is a guy who is not afraid to bluff or gamble.  So I figured he could have a wide range of hands.  So I called.He flipped over ace ten offsuit.I was censored.Then a king hit on the river  and I was no longer censored.Thoughts on this result???By the way to those who asked,  this game is my normal game...my bankroll is more than sufficient to handle losing my whole buy-in let alone my profit margin on this hand. I also saw that one person said I played this hand a little too agressively preflop.  Do others think that is true? Thanks to all.Andrewnope. against A10 you had 12 outs. At the higher levels you need to play more aggressive as your opponents are playing aggressive against you. If you start to play your hands passivly then your gonna get run over Link to post Share on other sites
Smasharoo 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 Want to show your math behind that? If he's up against a set of anything, he's only just a touch behind on pot odds..... about .2 off. (Read my earlier post on this). The amount of times you're not up against a set make this about as brainless a call as they come.Exactly.This call is automatic. Link to post Share on other sites
AK33 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I gotta give the guys that put him on AT credit, I really didn't think you could make that call (without being drunk) and think you're in decent shape. Anyway, nice hand Andrew. ~Slick~ Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 How is this a tough call in any game?I don't think it is, but a number of posters seem to be fearing the worst here. And to be honest, the worst isn't really that bad. Link to post Share on other sites
Fire- 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 How is this a tough call in any game?Oh how nice it is to have you back. :-) Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 31, 2005 Author Share Posted March 31, 2005 Can you explain why it is such an easy call? I am sure there is some math behind it....but even when I called I figured I had to be at least somewhat behind....thanks. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 31, 2005 Author Share Posted March 31, 2005 my post entitled smash...the pot odds justify calling unless I am against a set of aces....thanks for that explanation....I am glad I made the right call....but next time I will have a deeper understanding of why Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 First off....this guy is a regular...plays where I was often (a club in new york city) and is a guy who is not afraid to bluff or gamble. So I figured he could have a wide range of hands.It'd be good to know this during your first post. It would have made AT more of a real possibility (albeit an unlikely one). Good call (although honestly, an easy one) and nice river. Honestly, I wouldn't have been too upset when he flipped over AT, cause I'd know I was about a flip. Link to post Share on other sites
Scott31 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 he pot odds justify calling unless I am against a set of aces....That's the absolute worst situation (which you shouldn't fear) and even then, you're only 2.3-1 to lose that hand with 2.1-1 on your call. See why this was easy? Because the amount of times he doesn't have the worst possible hand for your TPTK and nut flush draw make this an easily profitable call. Link to post Share on other sites
benhoug 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I'm surprised to see so many people struggling with this one. I guess it depends on how you play, but I think this is an automatic call. Against anything but a set you're a prohibitive favorite, and against a set you're not a huge dog as you have a big re-draw. If you don't make this call, you probably shouldn't be playing in this-sized game 'cause that means the money means too much to you. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 31, 2005 Author Share Posted March 31, 2005 everyone seems to agree that when he raises all-in it is fairly obvious that I am probably behind in the hand....and no one likes calling when they are probably behind. However, I do agree that the pot odds makes this a situation where I should call and I am glad I did. And again, my bankroll is more than sufficient for these stakes...although I am fairly new to this level (I have been playing 5-10 NL regularly for about 2 months now) Link to post Share on other sites
commoncents 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I'm the man, A10 all the way!i knew it ! you can tell by the quick call, then the trap with the check raise he hit 2 pair. i dont think in that kind of game A10 is a bad hand. he raised to $50 testing the waters, got reraised but rolled with it. he probably put player 2 on a mid pocket pair with the $250 raise, hence the quick call. granted i thought he was suitednice hand, great catch! Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted March 31, 2005 Author Share Posted March 31, 2005 Ok I really enjoyed everyone's advice/opinions/(Smash's arrogant but truthful observations)......so here is another hand I had in the same game last night that is still troubling me....I will try to give better background this time....I play at an NYC club a la Rounders. The game is 5-10 NL seven handed with all regulars at the club....the guy I busted with the AK hand re-bought...him and 4 other players would have to be defined as at least pretty aggressive...I am a little tight...and then one guy is a rock and everyone knows he is a rock. I now have the largest stack (about 7200 when this hand came up) and everyone else is bunched between 1500 and 4000...with the rock having the small stack of 1500 and the most aggressive player in the game by far having just over 4000. I am in the small blind for this hand and I am dealt 10-8 suited in clubs.Now, the UTG guy who is the 2nd stack, super-aggresive, straddles the blinds for 20 bucks. The guys in 4th,5th, and 6th position all limp and call the 20. The button folds. I call and the rock who is the big blind and short stack calls the 20 and the straddler checks. So six in for 20 bucks...120 in the pot.Flop comes 9c 7h 2cI check. The Rock in the BB bets out 100. I am obviously concerned by this bet. UTG super aggressive man raises to 400. Next three guys all fold. Now it is 400 to me with about 620 in the pot total....what do I do? Again I will play it all out for you after I see some responses....thanks again to everyone for all your help! Link to post Share on other sites
benhoug 0 Posted March 31, 2005 Share Posted March 31, 2005 I find this hand to be more troubling. My first reaction is it's an easy call - you have a straight draw and a flush draw, so even though you're behind you've got a ton of outs... but the more I think about it I think you're flush draw is dead - the player who raised probably has a bigger one, so in reality you've only got 6 pure outs and you should probably fold. I'm not too worried about the rock player, but the guy raising is trouble. Link to post Share on other sites
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