Drbingogh 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Hello everyone. I have a friend who has been going to the Bike in L.A. and playing in their $40 NLHE cash game with 1/2 blinds. He's been maybe five times and according to him has either lost $120-200 or, lost it all then won "most of it back" everytime. He's decided that the game is "too loose" and says next time he's going to buy-in to the $200 table with 2/3 blinds so he can play some "real poker." He then wanted to know what I thought. I, along with every noted poker author I've read, think moving up in levels because you can't win is a huge mistake, but this guy insists that it's the right move. He has a couple of buddies who have won at these tables, according to them, that are encouraging him to join them. I've got to think that he's just not making proper adjustments to his game and should take a serious look at his game as oppossed to raising the stakes and trying to outplay better players. Of course when I told him this he replied that I am "jealous" because I don't have the money to play live (a little true) and my opinion has no merit because I've never played there. For my own ego and sanity I'd like your opinion because I know most of you have played at these levels. So what gives? Am I just a broke, jealous chicken with no nuts or is this guy unrealistic about his abilities as I suspect? Thanks! DrB Link to post Share on other sites
jayboogie 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 In my experience with these situations, I'd say it's pretty much useless to explain any sort of poker concecpts to your friend. He's obviously got his mind made up and nothing you say or do will change that. If more people didn't have this mentality, none of us would make any money at poker. I have a ton of friends who swear by hitting and running when they win a set amount, cashing out after big scores, online poker being rigged and etc etc. Being that I don't want to see them go broke, I've given them advise from bankroll to handling swings which in turn gets ignored. So I have to constantly hear about them building a 10k bankroll and then losing it all a couple weeks later, kind of gets old after a while really. What you do in this situation is sit back and don't say a thing. His results will show for themself and if he's a losing player, he's going to lose money. This is just 1 of those lessons that your friend will have to learn for himself. Link to post Share on other sites
ThatPkrGuy 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Let the guy move up and lose his BR and then just say hey...told ya so.If you can't beat a table full of donks because they are playing to loose...well then you shouldn't be moving up thats for sure. But he sounds like he already has his mind made up. So just let him go and give it a shot. Obv he isn't a very serious player so it doesn't matter to much. I'm sure the guys in the 200 game will appreciate him showing up Link to post Share on other sites
krup24 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Sometimes moving up a limit is in order. I mean don't go from 1/2 NL to 10/20 NL but moving up one limit or two provided you have a sufficient BR may help. Link to post Share on other sites
DDiabolical 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Moving up sometimes can help you win...I remember playing 0.25 limit on Pokerroom back in the day and couldn't take that shit seriously, constant loser. Moved to 1/2 where the wins and losses were actually noticeable and a winning player was born. Link to post Share on other sites
justblaze 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 the move up guys provide anecdotal evidence, and the 'your friend is an idiot' provide objective reasoning. you be the judge. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 the move up guys provide anecdotal evidence, and the 'your friend is an idiot' provide objective reasoning. you be the judge.Agreed. It's like Smash says.."If you can't beat bad players what on God's green earth makes you think you can beat good players?It's a valid point. Link to post Share on other sites
WhatArunAA 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I think this is the learning curve of many players... at first... everyone thinks they suck.. then they log a few hours.. and think they are the best... Me included.. I was completely oblivious and thought I was the best poker player ever.... this was after 3 weeks of playing it... well now after 3 years Ive finally realized... that I suck.. but in all honesty.... I think most players that aspire to be " great" have to learn this for themselves. Link to post Share on other sites
WhatArunAA 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Moving up sometimes can help you win...I remember playing 0.25 limit on Pokerroom back in the day and couldn't take that censored seriously, constant loser. Moved to 1/2 where the wins and losses were actually noticeable and a winning player was born.It appears that your problem seems to be with your mindset.. rather than the quality of others play... If i had 1 dollar in my account on a random site.. I would never sit down at 2-4 cent limit.. or whatever micro limits some of the sites offer... I would be completey bored and wouldnt get anything "financial" out of it... I feel what you are saying.. but its not going to help this guy and his argument. Link to post Share on other sites
Drbingogh 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 Thanks for your thoughts guys.I have to say I think my friend has some serious holes in his game. When and if he doesn move up, he's only going ot have one buy-in so he'll playing with his back against the wall. I personally think he needs to find out why his game isn't working at the lower level. I'm no DN, but to me, poker is about adjustments and I don't think he's making any nor is he willing too. Ah well, I warned the bonehead. For the record I hope I'm wrong. I do want good things for my friends, but can't encourage what I consider to be reckless behavior. Link to post Share on other sites
Abbaddabba 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Your friend sounds like he's a losing player anyways, at either of those stakes.By staying at the 1/2 game, he's just delaying the inevitable. Link to post Share on other sites
dms26 3 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 the move up guys provide anecdotal evidence, and the 'your friend is an idiot' provide objective reasoning. you be the judge.Agreed. It's like Smash says.."If you can't beat bad players what on God's green earth makes you think you can beat good players?It's a valid point.I agree, he probably won't win if he moves up, but 1/2 NL with a $40 buy in is pretty brutal. Link to post Share on other sites
Drbingogh 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 I realize the "brutaliness" of $40 with 1/2 blinds. I guess I'm steaming because he asked for my advice, I gave it and he told me I was ignorant cause I can't afford to play even at that low level. The way he talks the $40 game is unbeatable and I just find that hard to believe. I appreciate everyone's thoughts on the subject though so thanks again. Link to post Share on other sites
Hatchet 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I realize the "brutaliness" of $40 with 1/2 blinds. I guess I'm steaming because he asked for my advice, I gave it and he told me I was ignorant cause I can't afford to play even at that low level. The way he talks the $40 game is unbeatable and I just find that hard to believe. I appreciate everyone's thoughts on the subject though so thanks again.1/2 with only 40 dollars plus the high rake of B&M might actually warrant a move up. That game would be a bit of a crapshooot as the first raised pot you lose cripples your already small stack. Link to post Share on other sites
dead money 1 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 #1. Playing in a game where you can only sit with 20bb takes a completely different mind set then playing in a game where you get 65bb. The 1/2 game is loose because it has to be that way. The game dictates that you have to play loose. #2. Explain to your friend that when he asks your opinion and you give it to him, that he cant get upset about what you say. I hate when my friends ask for advice and I give them some, but its not what they wanted to hear, so they get mad. At this point just let him learn the hard way. You can let him know the dangers and thats all you can do. Bringing it up again will be a bad move.#3. Ive have tried to explain to alot of my friends what bankroll management is, but they dont listen. They feel that I am just afraid to take chances. They also feel that I am a tight/weak player because of this. Thats fine. I like that. I dont try and change their minds. I can then play like Dan Harrington and pick up pots on bluffs because of my image. I make more money then all of my friends who play, but I like that they think that I am just really tight and weak. Let your friends think you dont take chances. Let them peg you as the weak/tightie. You will make so much more off of them. I had one friend who judged how well he did by bringing up his big wins, but he never talked about his big loses. One night he won $3500 playing 2/5 nl. The next night he went back and took the whole $3500 and lost it all playing $20/40. He really thought he was good enough to play 20/40. He wasnt even good enough to play 2/5 nl. Now all he talks about is his big win. He constantly tells everybody how much better he is then all of us. He says that noone won more than $1000, but he won $3500. I then point out how he no longer has the $3500. They just dont get it. And they wont, so dont bother helping them. Let them do there thing. You just keep learning the correct way. I also agree with what whatarunna said. When I first started reading books, I thought I was really good. Nevermind that I was only playing for 3 months. It wasnt until about 5 months ago that I really started to understand the game. This is 2 1/2 years later. It was like having the cloud lift. The things in the books will make so much sense. You will see it all real clear. And the most important thing you learn is that you still have so much to learn. Im so far from where I want to be, but Im learning. Just keep up the good work, and dont bother helping your friends. If they want to really learn they will buy some books. Link to post Share on other sites
mb5322 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I agree w/ the OP, let him go broke, then laugh at him. Link to post Share on other sites
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