Brian Townsend (sbrugby) Vs Patrik Antonius

[fighter 4]

I found both players talking about this hand in their blogs so I thought I would combine them and share it with you guys.

The first hand occurred between Patrik Antonius and myself. I am going to be looking like a huge donkey on TV and everyone at the studio was totally befuddled by the call I made. The only person who thought it was reasonable was Patrik but he may have just been saying that to be kind to me. I know I do that to others when they play poorly but don't want to tell them. Anyways...Phil Ivey limped UTG followed by Patrik at 300/600 blinds with 100 ante. I had a little over 200K in front of me and Patrik covered. Phil will often limp re raise but he was sick/bored and not playing his A game on the show. So I raised with QJo to 3600. Everyone folded including Phil. Patrik called the 3600 and the two of us took the flop with about 8K in the pot. Patrik was playing well but very very loose preflop. he had previously defended a cutoff raise with 92s. So I figured his range was incredibly wide.The flop came down Q56 rainbow. He checked and I bet about the pot at 7500. He thought a bit and called. When he just called I figured he had a middle pair type of hand. He was making alot of loose flop calls in and out of position so I didn't give him to much credit for a monster hand. I felt that it was very likely I had the best hand.The turn came the king of hearts making two hearts with the Q and K. Again he checked. I often check in spots like these since its really tough to figure out what the correct decision is with stacks being this deep if raised. I would guess Patrik has some inkling of this so I opted to fire again to vary my play. I bet about 20K which he called. The pot now contained ~60K.The river brought a four which didn't complete the heart flush draw. Again he checked. I thought a bit and felt I had the best hand and opted to extract value from a six. Patrik likes to make calls and I felt there was value in the bet. I bet 40K and he thought for about 2 min. He then grabbed his 25K black chips and check raised me to 150K.I instantly cussed. I was so sick. Getting check raised on the river with second pair is never fun, especially from someone tricky like Patrik who you can't just fold against. After cussing I began thinking about the hand. First thought I had was does he have the nut straight. I thougth a bit and decided no he didn't. My logic is he would have raised the flop or tun since he wouldn't want to show down 78 out of position if I were bluffing with something as little as jack high. He would want to move me off those hands at some point. We were also very deep so he could put a lot of pressure on my by a flop or turn raise. Also the flop has a great texture for him to semi bluff since its very unlikely I will 3 bet a check raise since the flop is relatively dry. I would trap with three queens and with aces I wouldn't want to get it all in with us both having 200K effective stacks.Nest question does he have a set or KQ? The 78 logic took me about a minute to work through and I almost instantly dismissed a set or KQ as I felt he would have raised somewhere before the river. We had 200K stacks and with those hands he wants to get all the money into the middle. I felt he would want to build the pot at some point. One other possibility was he rivered a set of 4's but even Patrik as loose as he is probably would have dumped two 4's if not on the flop defiantly by the turn.So what did he have? I spend about a minute thinking about that as well. I felt a very likely hand was A6 type of hand as well as 67 of hearts or something along those lines. he may have thought he had the best hand on the flop and turn or had a lot of outs to improve if behind. Then on the river he could have correctly read me for being weak and decided to turn his six into a bluff to move me off a one pair hand.From this logic I couldn't think of a hand I was losing to so after a few minutes I decided to call. I put in the 6 25K black chips and I hear the worst words ever "I have a set". I was even sicker than when he had check raised me. I had completely mis analysed the hand and almost instantly dismissed the hand he had. I thought there was less than a 1% chance he had a set with how the hand played out. I think my call is a very weak one if he is check raising the river with KQ and set type of hands. What can I say, I made a decision based on my previous play with him and did the best I could in the situation. I think the most marginal decision in the hand came on the turn when I opted to bet 20K. I think I should have checked there and that is my standard line but I opted to fire instead. I have to give Patrik a lot of credit as he played the hand very well. He trapped me for the maximum. He extracted max value from me by playing a hand in a deceptive manner. All I can take from the hand is the experience and when playing with him in the future I will have a better estimation of his ranges. http://www.cardrunners.com/members/index.p...9&Itemid=29

Blinds are $300-600 with $100 ante. Phil Ivey limped UTG and I limped behind him. Brian Townsend (SBrugby) raised to $3,600, it was folded around to Ivey and he folded. I called with 66.It was a beautiful Q 5 6 flop for me, rainbow. I checked to Brian and he bet $7,300 and I took a few seconds and called.Brian and I have played quite a bit of NL Hold ‘em together, both online and live in the Bellagio ‘Big Game’. We know each other’s game inside and out. Brian is a very smart and deep-thinking player, which is why he is one of the best NL players in the world. He can probably remember every hand we have ever played together.The turn was a K of hearts which put two hearts out there. I checked and he bet $20,000. Normally I would raise my set here, but I decided to play it differently this time. I just called his $20,000 bet.The river brought a 4 for a board of Q 5 6 K 4 and I checked. Brian bet $40,000 and I check raised to $150,000 after thinking for a while. Brian was not happy about it, which was a good sign, because that eliminated him from having the nut straight.He finally called and Brian had QJ which he was value betting the whole way.This hand is very interesting for many reasons. Phil Ivey and I were playing props, and Brian knew that. When Brian raised pre-flop $3,600 and I was the only one to call, I looked at my prop score sheet just to see if Phil or me was on for a double or triple in props. Brian probably picked up on this and knew I might be playing a weaker hand than normal.I checked called the flop, which is standard, but check calling the turn was something I have never done against Brian in the hands where we were heading to a showdown. It was very hard for him to think I would play my set this way.When the river came 4, it was a great card for me. I would not call an 80 per cent of the pot bet on the turn with an open ender. So Brian knows I did not have 7 8 for the straight.I checked the river to give him a chance to bluff or bet for value. Luckily he took the bait and bet $40,000 on the river. Now, there was a small chance he had KK or QQ or even 78. But I decided to value raise to $150,000 with my set of sixes.I know Brian thinks very deep into each street and how the hand was played. By playing the hand the way I did, it was nearly impossible for him to put me on a set. He called with QJ, which would beat a bluff, but thankfully I had a hand this time. http://patrik-antonius.blogspot.com/

[gmanshade 0]

thanks for posting thisit's annoying cardrunning doesnt offer access to the blog for non-members any more

[cwik 0]

thanks for posting thisit's annoying cardrunning doesnt offer access to the blog for non-members any more

they still do, just gotta register.

[NonZeroPossibility 0]

hey thanks, interesting stuff. That is a weird spot to try and value bet. I'm checking that QJ down on the river for sure. As I was reading through the hand from BT's perspective, the call of 20k on the turn made me sick and it wasn't even my money.

[DanielNegreanu 141]

Brian's line of thinking on the turn and river got him into trouble there. I'm ok with the turn bet for sure, but that was an extremely thin value bet on the river with QJ, especially against a good, tricky player like Patrick. I talked to Patrick about this hand last night and he shared some other insights with me about it that I can't share with you all. Let's just say that when he was check calling the turn, he knew what he was doing and was totally playing the player.

[vbnautilus 48]

Brian's line of thinking on the turn and river got him into trouble there. I'm ok with the turn bet for sure, but that was an extremely thin value bet on the river with QJ, especially against a good, tricky player like Patrick. I talked to Patrick about this hand last night and he shared some other insights with me about it that I can't share with you all. Let's just say that when he was check calling the turn, he knew what he was doing and was totally playing the player.

What about his thinking on the turn do you not like if you are ok with the bet there? Please explain?

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

What about his thinking on the turn do you not like if you are ok with the bet there? Please explain?

My guess would be that if you bet the turn you're calling a bet, or checking behind on the river.. There's no need to value bet there..The turn bet was essentially a value bet..at least that's what I'd think.

[timwakefield 68]

I talked to Patrick about this hand last night and he shared some other insights with me about it that I can't share with you all.

You're just trying to tease us, eh?

My guess would be that if you bet the turn you're calling a bet, or checking behind on the river.. There's no need to value bet there..The turn bet was essentially a value bet..at least that's what I'd think.

Ya after betting the turn and getting called, his river bet is somewhat bizarre IMO. I can see value betting the river if the turn went check-check, but value betting twice with such a mediocre hand is a bit suspect. I guess he really thought PA would pay him off with a worse pair or a worse queen or something.

[DanielNegreanu 141]

My guess would be that if you bet the turn you're calling a bet, or checking behind on the river.. There's no need to value bet there..The turn bet was essentially a value bet..at least that's what I'd think.

Smart cookie :-)

[vbnautilus 48]

My guess would be that if you bet the turn you're calling a bet, or checking behind on the river.. There's no need to value bet there..The turn bet was essentially a value bet..at least that's what I'd think.

Sure, I just thought daniel was implying something else by saying his thinking got him in trouble on the turn. I guess not. The river bet was weird.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Sure, I just thought daniel was implying something else by saying his thinking got him in trouble on the turn. I guess not. The river bet was weird.

Though, I don't want to speak for him, I think all Daniel really meant was that betting the turn again is fine, but, firing a third barrel on the river is spewing.. Think of it from the most basic of 100NL strategy guides.. -Do you want to get raised on the end? What's your plan if you are raised? If it's to fold, then why bet? -Is he folding better hands or calling with worse hands often enough to make a river bet profitable? Though this game is dramatically different than the average 1/2 game, basics are basics. Thin value bets are one thing, Allowing yourself to get trapped is another. If he has the best hand, he got plenty of value on flop/turn. If not, he saves himself money on the end.

[vbnautilus 48]

Though, I don't want to speak for him, I think all Daniel really meant was that betting the turn again is fine, but, firing a third barrel on the river is spewing..

Totally, but all that is pretty standard, and part of what is interesting about this is that both players said they are trying not to play it in their standard way, and that they know each other very well. Reading between the lines of DN's post it seems there was more going on in the interplay between these two guys, and obv he doesn't want to say too much about what PA told him, but I was just hoping to get a little deeper into it... For example, If PA puts BT on a weaker holding we might not expect him to check the river b/c he wouldn't expect Brian to value bet twice....

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

Totally, but all that is pretty standard, and part of what is interesting about this is that both players said they are trying not to play it in their standard way, and that they know each other very well. Reading between the lines of DN's post it seems there was more going on in the interplay between these two guys, and obv he doesn't want to say too much about what PA told him, but I was just hoping to get a little deeper into it... For example, If PA puts BT on a weaker holding we might not expect him to check the river b/c he wouldn't expect Brian to value bet twice....

Yeah, there's obviously a great deal more, and a great number of hands at play here..

[loxo 0]

Totally, but all that is pretty standard, and part of what is interesting about this is that both players said they are trying not to play it in their standard way, and that they know each other very well. Reading between the lines of DN's post it seems there was more going on in the interplay between these two guys, and obv he doesn't want to say too much about what PA told him, but I was just hoping to get a little deeper into it... For example, If PA puts BT on a weaker holding we might not expect him to check the river b/c he wouldn't expect Brian to value bet twice....

I see what you mean here. PA's check raise on the river is pretty awesome if you ask me. Totally in control of the hand and his opponent.

[DrawingDeadInDM 0]

I see what you mean here. PA's check raise on the river is pretty awesome if you ask me. Totally in control of the hand and his opponent.

..and that's what DN's referring to when he says that Patrik was playing the player..he's sick if Townsend checks behind, but he's moderately certain that he won't check behind.

[loxo 0]

..and that's what DN's referring to when he says that Patrik was playing the player..he's sick if Townsend checks behind, but he's moderately certain that he won't check behind.

Yeah, I realise this. Just takes some silky skills and some sharp discipline to go through with it. Not hard to see why he's universally respected.