Kk Difficult Board

[BudBundy 0]

CryptologicLimit Holdem Ring gameLimit: $1/$28 playersConverterPre-flop: (8 players) Hero is BB with :) 6 folds, SB raises, Hero 3-bets, SB calls.Flop: :D (4SB, 2 players)SB bets, Hero raises, SB calls.Turn: (4BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero bets, SB calls.River: (6BB, 2 players)SB checks, Hero checks.Results:Final pot: 6BBAnyone play it different?I don't know why i checked the river tho.I should be ahead there cus wouldn't any Ax raise me on turn?

[Zach6668 513]

I like it.I think he has a T here a lot, and was setting you up for a c/r on the turn, but was scared off by that second ace.I don't mind the check behind on the river.

[Actuary 3]

Bet / fold rivernot close unless this cat can make very ballsy plays.

[Dirtydutch 8]

Bet / fold rivernot close unless this cat can make very ballsy plays.

Why?

[Actuary 3]

Why?

I think I'm wrong now.I had villain on QQ-JJ more than logical given out flop and turn play.

[roadhawg 0]

i like the check on the river because really whats going to call you? sure JJ or QQ might call you but those are the only hands you can beat that will call you. the hands that have you beat will probably raise you (a 10 might just call but either way you're beat) and everything else folds. i like the way you played it. i think he had a 10

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

I agree with Actuary, intially.I like bet/folding the river, unless this guy does trixy stuff occassionally.The pot is small, which is why a fold-to-a-c/r isn't horrible. I think a bet here has value more often than not.

[Actuary 3]

I agree with Actuary, intially.

i'm rusty.play the SnG's now.

[BudBundy 0]

i'm rusty.play the SnG's now.

What's the right bankroll for SnG's?I play 11$ limit and NL SnG's occasionally.

[Actuary 3]

What's the right bankroll for SnG's?I play 11$ limit and NL SnG's occasionally.

Limit SnG's..lolI read 30 Buyins as a minimum.More if losing 12 in a row will impact your play.Les if you can move down to a lower Buyin and you "know" it's just variance.Infinite if you are really not a winning player.For reference, I've played 710 since returning to them and have lost 10 in a row 3 times. Some of that was rust, little from being tired and playing loose, lots from luck.

[BudBundy 0]

Limit SnG's..lolI read 30 Buyins as a minimum.More if losing 12 in a row will impact your play.Les if you can move down to a lower Buyin and you "know" it's just variance.Infinite if you are really not a winning player.For reference, I've played 710 since returning to them and have lost 10 in a row 3 times. Some of that was rust, little from being tired and playing loose, lots from luck.

WHat?Limit SnG's are fun I will move to party in a few days then i have the right BR then.How do you calculate your winrate in SnG's?

[Actuary 3]

How do you calculate your winrate in SnG's?

Most Important: $$$ per hour played. That's alway the most important statisitic for Cash and Tourney, really.But as far as tracking how well you are doing in them:1. ROI = Return On Investment.It's Your Profits Divided by the sum of your buyins. say you play 3 $11 and win 1 and go out 5th twice.you won $50, you spent $33. your profit is $17. your ROI is 17/33 ~ 50%2. ITM%. In the Money Percent. Percent of times you make the cash. I did not keep track of any places except for 1-2-3-Out, so I'm not sure how often I bubble (got out right before cashing); but I think thats a good stat to keep

[roadhawg 0]

do you guys play omaha (PL or HL) SNG's? i am curious to know how those are. i havent played much omaha and i wasnt sure if that was a way to get better or if i should just go to the cash games.

[BudBundy 0]

do you guys play omaha (PL or HL) SNG's? i am curious to know how those are. i havent played much omaha and i wasnt sure if that was a way to get better or if i should just go to the cash games.

I think SnG's are complicated with the rising blinds and stuff for a beginner.I'd start with micro limit cash games.

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

Since we're hijacking this, let me get on my soapbox and tell you all why you're all wasting your time with sit n go's.Variance is quite high. You need 30 to 50 buyins, including juice. EVERYBODY always upswings their first 25-50 SNG's, and they think they're hot sh!t... and then when they catch the downswings it's all outdrawing donkeys and boring folds for hours until you lose a race.Your ITM% has to be somewhere around 50% just to beat the 10% juice. Party's 20% juice $5+$1's are effectively unbeatable. Trying to get good at sit n go's is particularly maddening, it'll stunt your growth as a player, and make you dumber in cash games. Why? Because you're playing mind-numbingly tight until like 5 people are knocked out... then you switch gears and play aggressively... and the difference between 1st and 5th will come down to between 1 and 3 coinflips. Until you have about 1,000 sit and go's under your belt for an appreciation of "the long run..." you'll drive yourself crazy with results based thinking. In actuality, all you did was you folded for an hour just to get in this one race, and if you lost, you'll become race-aversed and either be scared of racing next time, or blind out and not race when you should, like a weak-tight beyotch.I think it's catastrophically bad for novice players to waste an important part of their developmental poker learning curve trying to beat sit and go's. That first year or two of playing poker seriously are perhaps the most important to long-term growth, because if you love poker, you won't be able to stop thinking about it away from the game. And if you're wasting all that brainpower analyzing mindlessly simplistic and boring sit-n-go situations, I've seen a LOT of players get turned off to poker and jaded, and they burn out and fade away.[/soapbox]

[Actuary 3]

Holy Cow!good stuff.But imo, SnG's have no more variance than LHE.But they don't help your Cash Games.But either does Chess.

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

Holy Cow!good stuff.But imo, SnG's have no more variance than LHE.But they don't help your Cash Games.But either does Chess.

Well, LHE has high variance too, especially as compared to NLH and all forms of omaha in all structures.I've actually been playing more chess lately... I'm finally nudging 1400 on yahoo! You start at 1200.How've you been, ol buddy? Long time! I been workin and drinkin a lot, haha. Two closings this month!!!!

[GrindingAway 0]

Since we're hijacking this, let me get on my soapbox and tell you all why you're all wasting your time with sit n go's.[/soapbox]

O.K. hijacker - what do you think about sng's at higher levels / +100 buy in ?

[TJ_Eckleburg 0]

I should preface all this by saying I'm biased, because (obviously, lol) I personally hate sit 'n go's.The crux of my point is that low limit sit and go's are not helpful or very profitable for the developmental player.I know lots of people who make money at the higher level sit and go's, though, so evidently some people do well with it. I'm not rolled for the hundreds and up, so I don't have a lot of personal experience with them.

[Actuary 3]

TJ,actually, they are one of the easiet, lower var ways to build a BR for a new player.more so than grinding micro limitwe both agree though, that they don't teach poker as well.. in a traditional sense of the wordthey are profitable with some fairly simple startegies.at least at the lower buyinsno idea about 100+ either.. Iggy says those are easy for aggressive players because so many are too tightI"m trying to get a down payment for another car thru SnG's, so I need to stay pummped!!

[ChrisRichey 1]

I too have been fairly successful playing the $5.50 sng's on FT and Stars, but have recently wanted to start playing nl cash games again. I haven't really played that much in cash games, so I am wondering what kind of adjustments I need to make when switching from sng's. Most of my poker knowledge consists of HoH I and II and SSHE, so I am relatively ignorant as to the intricacies of nl cash games. Any advice or books I should get?OP: Sorry to support the hijacking of this thread, just figured this is easier than making a new thread.

[Actuary 3]

, so I am wondering what kind of adjustments I need to make when switching from sng's.

with Cash games every play (aside from setting image up, which won't be a big deal in lower limits) is based solely on expected value for the hand. Whereas in SnG's, you are looking at Tournament Equity. So what does that mean?It means semi-bluffing with big draws makes more sense in cash games.It means you need to make bigger bets because other players are willing to chase more since they can reload. lots of styles can work.Bet your made hands and big draws very aggressively and don't pay off large bets with marginal hands. Some players like to see lots of flops in position and play postflop, others will nut peddle and go crazy when they hit sets and nut flushes or AA/KK. As long as you can laydown the TPTK hands on coordinated boards and when someone moves in for $34 into a $10 pot, you should be able to hold on to the profits.I don't play much NL cash..but you can post lots of hands in that forum.

[ChrisRichey 1]

^^^ Extremely helpful advice, thank you very much.

[Jimbobway 0]

Ive got 1300 sitngos under my belt.. my results are about 119% of initial buyin ammount. You dont have to get into coinflips to win a sit and go atall. I think my raise percentage after the 50/100 level is more then 25%. Steel lots of blinds, show strength until somebody tells you there winning. People at the lower levels are so locked into there cards that they wont play against you until they get the AK. A lose aggressive style can be very profitable. I dont get into any coinflips unless ive got the major stack..