who is online for a living?

[custom36 5]

On top of that $200,000.00 is low end in today real estate market and $20,000.00 buys you a used SUV if you are lucky. Living young and single is cheap; trust me I have been there.

Jopke? I hope so. 200k may be low in Cali, but here in Wisconsin, that's a good sized house. You could get a good one around here for 75k-ish.And you can get a very good new Saturn for about 10k. If you're spending more than 20k on a car and you don't have a lot of money, you have some problems.

[akoff 0]

I guess it is all about your goals and life expectations. If you are happy grinding out a few bucks to pay your rent. Have at it...

[MisterB 2]

You are not giving enough credit for your daily costs of living. If you get married and have kids your projections aren’t even close. If you want to join a club, travel, take the family away on VAC…the list never ends. Private school, retirement, repairs to cars and homes…I am telling you your head will spin.On top of that $200,000.00 is low end in today real estate market and $20,000.00 buys you a used SUV if you are lucky. Living young and single is cheap; trust me I have been there.Here is a thought get a job and establish a career. Use that for all your daily living expenses and future expenses that will be coming. Take your bankroll and never touch it. You don’t withdraw or spend…EVER. All you do is build yourself up to the next highest level.In 5 or 10 years if you are a winning player you will have a huge roll to go big with and a fall back position for real life. If you are really good at what you do you may not be able to play poker full time….It is possible to make so much money in your job that you don’t want to play full time. It is possible that you will play 10/20 no limit or higher for the hell of it and the competition….I had a conversation with Howard Letterer last spring in Vegas and he told me that he may well be making less as poker player then he would have in the tech fields where he was heading before turning pro.Good Luck

Ok so here we go with the rebuttals... in order so you can refute at any time...* If I get married and have kids I will have a wife that will also have a job that will support all of the above... she can make 30k a year as a waitress for all I care... take that 30k (very minimum for a FT job) and add to the $20k plus we have left over we get 50k to spend on "join a club, travel, take the family away on VAC…the list never ends"*Future expenses are covered in our "future" earnings... we cannot pay for what we dont know is going to happen... but we can prepare.. and I dont know what could happen that will cost more than the extra earnings we can save....* In 5-10 years if we are still playing poker online then it would be very unadvisable to keep our entire bankroll online for that entire time, moreover I would contend that during that time period certain points would be reached where that money would be better off invested somewhere else so it is earning interest on top of interest. * I am very assured you had said conversation with Howard Lederer and I absolutely agree he might have made more in the tech fields instead of going pro... but would you rememeber that conversation with Howard Lederer if he wasn't a poker player? He might have made more then, but his Public Relations capital on top of his earnings as a pro far outweigh the monetary value of writing code in a cubicle somewhere in hell with flourescent lighting... Which brings me to my final point about HL... do you see him playing much poker now as opposed to last spring? No, why you might ask? because he is using the aforementioned PR capital to diversify and make more $ away from the poker table then he would sitting at it

[MisterB 2]

I guess it is all about your goals and life expectations. If you are happy grinding out a few bucks to pay your rent. Have at it...

This all stems from a conversation about making 1k a week... So if I make 1k a week... im just "grinding out a few bucks to pay my rent" Very Very well said.... please continue bringing your intellectual responses to an otherwises drab and unhelpful poker forum...

[akoff 0]

The 1k a week figure was for a poker PRO not as guy or girl picking up some extra money.Look I am just telling you the facts. I wish you good luck in your endevors. Just remember it always cost more then you think. I have learned that many times over. It is a major part of what I do for a living but we all have to learn in our own way....If you set a goal to high and don't reach it you still did good.

[MisterB 2]

The 1k a week figure was for a poker PRO not as guy or girl picking up some extra money.Look I am just telling you the facts. I wish you good luck in your endevors. Just remember it always cost more then you think. I have learned that many times over. It is a major part of what I do for a living but we all have to learn in our own way....If you set a goal to high and don't reach it you still did good.

This is as an online poker "pro" I never said that it was extra money and all my figures were based on that 1k a week figure...will you stop skating around the comment you made earlier about having to make 5k a week to live a certain lifestyle... PWWWN up... Im going to leave the second bold alone...

[akoff 0]

* If I get married and have kids I will have a wife that will also have a job that will support all of the above... she can make 30k a year as a waitress for all I care... take that 30k (very minimum for a FT job) and add to the $20k plus we have left over we get 50k to spend on "join a club, travel, take the family away on VAC…the list never ends" YOU ARE FORGETING TAXES AND ASSUMING YOUR WIFE WORKS*Future expenses are covered in our "future" earnings... we cannot pay for what we dont know is going to happen... but we can prepare.. and I dont know what could happen that will cost more than the extra earnings we can save.... I DON'T UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT BUT WHATEVER* In 5-10 years if we are still playing poker online then it would be very unadvisable to keep our entire bankroll online for that entire time, moreover I would contend that during that time period certain points would be reached where that money would be better off invested somewhere else so it is earning interest on top of interest. YOU BANKROLL IS YOUR WORKING CAPITAL. YOU DON'T INVERST IT YOU NEED IT DAILY TO MAKE A LIVING. THAT IS BUSINESS 101 AND IF YOU ARE GOING TO BE A PRO YOU HAD BETTER LEARN IT. AS SOON AS YOU HAVE THE PROPER ROLL YOU GO UP SO YOU DON'T ANY EXTRA MONEY......* I am very assured you had said conversation with Howard Lederer and I absolutely agree he might have made more in the tech fields instead of going pro... but would you rememeber that conversation with Howard Lederer if he wasn't a poker player? He might have made more then, but his Public Relations capital on top of his earnings as a pro far outweigh the monetary value of writing code in a cubicle somewhere in hell with flourescent lighting... Which brings me to my final point about HL... do you see him playing much poker now as opposed to last spring? No, why you might ask? because he is using the aforementioned PR capital to diversify and make more $ away from the poker table then he would sitting at itHL IS VERY NICE GUY. I MET WITH HIM FOR 20 MINUTES IN A LIMO WHILE RIDING TO PRIVATE GAME THAT HE WAS THE CELEB. HOST FOR. THINK WHAT YOU WANT IT DOESN'T MUCH MATTER TO ME. IT WAS FOR A TRADE SHOW EVENT WITH CLIENTS...THAT MAKE REAL MONEY...SEE MY POINT....

[bmwmcoupe 0]

i been playing for a living for a year and half around, make around 15k a month worst month this year has been +10, i 8-9 table 2-4nl and 5-10nl ive had a incredible time doing it, good luck .Poker is setting up my future with all the money ive made i have been able to put enough aside so when the poker wave ends i will be able to open a franchise or whatever else i feel like doing. the worst downswing ive had all year was 8 buy ins, and i still finished the month +. It really hasent felt like a grind, dont let people discourage you just cause they cant do it.

[custom36 5]

Guys, there's no point in arguing with someone that's illogical. Those that are capable of making it playing online for a living will see that he's wrong.Btw, I technically do play online for a living, though I'm a FT college student. It pays tuition and all of my expenses at the moment.

[MisterB 2]

Guys, there's no point in arguing with someone that's illogical. Those that are capable of making it playing online for a living will see that he's wrong.Btw, I technically do play online for a living, though I'm a FT college student. It pays tuition and all of my expenses at the moment.

I couldnt agree more....But comeon... his rebuttals are screaming FLAME... I can barely help myself at the absolute lack of quality in his responses...and want to call him out.... but youre right... just not worth it...

[Balloon guy 158]

You're both wrong, Don't worry about school, waste of time.You want to be financially secure, start your own business. Nobody really gets rich working for someone else.Find something other people don't want to do and become good at it.I blow up balloons for special events and have turned that into a good career.I have done 2 Superbowl half time shows, the rebublican and democrat conventions, MTV video music awards in Miami. I own my own building, paid for my son to go through college, youngest in private school..etc.etc. All because people hate to blow up their own balloons. People look down at me on the job..I'm just the balloon guy, but hey..my car is paid for and I have a great wife.My buddy poured street valves and man hole covers, another job people hate. He is a millionaire now with 65+ employees.Another friend supplies portable heaters to hotel for outside functions, he charges $65 a night for $8 worth of propane and rents 20-80 of them most weekends. Paid off the heaters years ago. He goes to the beach alot during the summer.Somewhere there is a job people hate that you can do better than anyone. Find it and invest in yourself. Pay your dues and always be honest and fair. You'll sleep at night and people will respect you.And $200,000 in my part of California will get you a 900 sq ft condo with $250 a month HOA fees.4 years ago a decent 1800 sq ft house.Poker is for cigar money, and I smoke 2 a day so I have to keep on my game. Currently switching between la Gloria Cubana series R#6 and CAO Italia, but some times I play bad and have to smoke Helix.But if I was young today I would be seriously looking at making a go at poker for a living...Although I would wonder why people like Phill Helmuth and Howard are all spending more time promoting themselves and other things and less at the game...they must know something.

[PatchesOhoulihan 0]

ive successfully turned my initial deposit of $50 in to $475 playing sng's on party poker in the last 2 weeks . I started out playing 5 dollar sngs (two tables per session) and moved up to 10 dollar sngs when i hit 250. But since they changed the structure recently, ive had to adjust my play and have not won as much as i used to. Anybody else have had the same problems or is it just me? I know its not as much as money as some of guys make but i appreciate the feedback

[custom36 5]

ive successfully turned my initial deposit of $50 in to $475 playing sng's on party poker in the last 2 weeks . I started out playing 5 dollar sngs (two tables per session) and moved up to 10 dollar sngs when i hit 250. But since they changed the structure recently, ive had to adjust my play and have not won as much as i used to. Anybody else have had the same problems or is it just me? I know its not as much as money as some of guys make but i appreciate the feedback

I'm not sure how much your strategy should change yet. It's too soon to tell.

[PatchesOhoulihan 0]

ive successfully turned my initial deposit of $50 in to $475 playing sng's on party poker in the last 2 weeks . I started out playing 5 dollar sngs (two tables per session) and moved up to 10 dollar sngs when i hit 250. But since they changed the structure recently, ive had to adjust my play and have not won as much as i used to. Anybody else have had the same problems or is it just me? I know its not as much as money as some of guys make but i appreciate the feedback

I'm not sure how much your strategy should change yet. It's too soon to tell.

yeah you're probably right , but ive definitely noticed that the higher chip count has caused a lot of them to be a lot braver and call their gut shots and runner runners

[JacKingOff_suit 0]

I am not playing for a living, but since last July I've played PLO8 ( and a little bit LO8 and PLO) seriously, I've grinded out about 6k last year (could have been much more if I didn't tilt and dumped some money at the online blackjack). This mid January I've cashed out most of them with only $50 left, I am grinding it out again at the PLO8 and LO8 tables, now it's up to about $700 (I am planning to write something about it like Smash's turning 50 to 1k at lhe, but I am too lazy to post each session everytime).I play about 12 hour a week. I almost forgot what holdem is (I post mostly at the omaha and o8 forums).Good luck.

[akoff 0]

Balloon Guy You summed it up very well. I guess I didn't do a very good job with how I was putting that out there. I didn't go to school either but I wish I would have that would be about the only part I differ with you on.

[mrdannyg 274]

ive successfully turned my initial deposit of $50 in to $475 playing sng's on party poker in the last 2 weeks . I started out playing 5 dollar sngs (two tables per session) and moved up to 10 dollar sngs when i hit 250. But since they changed the structure recently, ive had to adjust my play and have not won as much as i used to. Anybody else have had the same problems or is it just me? I know its not as much as money as some of guys make but i appreciate the feedback

I'm not sure how much your strategy should change yet. It's too soon to tell.

yeah you're probably right , but ive definitely noticed that the higher chip count has caused a lot of them to be a lot braver and call their gut shots and runner runners

i agree - i think people are more likely to call off draws without the odds, since having more chips will make them think they have more leeway, even though with higher blinds they actually have a little less.i think its too small a difference to significantly adjust your strategy, maybe just increase your bet amounts slightly since people might be willing to make bigger mistakes.cheers

[CrackofmyACE 1]

I play online 20-25 hrs per week on top of a 9-5 office job.Last year I brought in a little over 13k playing .5/1 and 1/2 NL with some scattered MTT's. I used my winnings as a down payment on the condo I bought back in November and I live comfortably. I've decided that if I ever take down a large MTT for over say 30k I would quit my 9-5 job and attempt to grind at 2/4 NL online for a living and see how it goes. That hasn't happened yet though.

[Smokestack 0]

I play online 20-25 hrs per week on top of a 9-5 office job.Last year I brought in a little over 13k playing .5/1 and 1/2 NL with some scattered MTT's.  I used my winnings as a down payment on the condo I bought back in November and I live comfortably.  I've decided that if I ever take down a large MTT for over say 30k I would quit my 9-5 job and attempt to grind at 2/4 NL online for a living and see how it goes.  That hasn't happened yet though.

Im in a similar boat although I have some big exceptions. Im 25, I have a decent job Id say although I would not be able to afford a house here on it. I have a been a break even player for a little over a year now. I have a good amount of money saved so I could leave the area and put a good down payment on a house most likely. I really think that if I got some results oriented encouragement either an "instant bankroll" or the $30k tournament win, I would move and rather than automatically get a minimum wage or slightly better job in the town I would live in I would probably choose to give the "grind" a try. I curenttly have a girlfriend and we have shared money for the past 5 years. She has a job that she could transfer with and hopefully I could supplement it with poke rincome (although Id hope her income would be supplemental to the poker income, its just not likely). Id say I would be torn between trying that life and maybe just taking the hypothetical win money mentioned above to continue to live in our current living situation(we are both unhappy with) and cut my back my hours at work in attempt to get back to college. Although Balloon man's post has really got me thinking. Or i suppose I could just be completely and utterly selfish right now...Quit my job, Dump my GF, and go live on a frineds couch in vegas until I can make 1k a week... although it sounds fun and under the right circumstances could happen, it seems the least likely.

[ChuckSty 0]

if i don't make 100k this year in online poker i'll hang myself.edit: scratch that make it 150K

[TheCinciKid 0]

The 1k a week figure was for a poker PRO not as guy or girl picking up some extra money.Look I am just telling you the facts. I wish you good luck in your endevors. Just remember it always cost more then you think. I have learned that many times over. It is a major part of what I do for a living but we all have to learn in our own way....If you set a goal to high and don't reach it you still did good.

I have a college degree and a year of law school under my belt. I just got a full-time job grossing $1500 a month, after searching for about a month. I'm young and single and I will find a way to get by on that until I can make more. I don't live in a high cost of living area so maybe it's a little bit different, but I would kill for $1k a week. That's $50k a year. That's more than enough for a small family to live off of in the midwest. And if I get married one day and my wife has a job also and I make $1k a week, we'd be living very well. You sir, are flat out wrong.

[TheCinciKid 0]

I also want to add this. The job that I'm working right now is...I hope...somewhat temporary. I could have grinded out another year and a half of law school and tried to find a job as a lawyer. I maybe could have even worked really hard and found a job as a lawyer making $100k a year or more. I could have spent the remainder of my twenties (I'd have graduated right before my 25th birthday) and some of my thirties working my freakin butt off 60-80 hours a week. I could have then maybe gotten my debts paid off and saved enough money to where I'd only have to be a lawyer 40 hours a week or so. In all of this, I could have maybe found someone who wanted to marry me for my money and have my kids (who I would never see because I'd be working so much). Like Tommyhawkers said in his post about being a doctor, I could very easily have ended up as a divorced alcoholic with most of my money going to child support, alimony, etc. But, at least my law degree would get me respect from my fellow man.That's not the life I want though. I'd be happy to make enough money to live off without having to work ridiculous hours at something I don't really care all that much for (the law). I'd love to be able to make $500-$1k a week playing online poker and quit my day job. Maybe someday I'll be able to. I think the bottom line and what life is really all about, is finding something that you can tolerate (and hopefully even enjoy) to make you enough money to live comfortbly. Along the way if you can find a great spouse and maybe have kids, that's tremendous. But, anyone who thinks that you couldn't make a fairly comfortable living making $1k a week online in the midwest, with a spouse who also brings in a little money is just flat out full of shit.

[Suited_Up 2]

I also want to add this. The job that I'm working right now is...I hope...somewhat temporary. I could have grinded out another year and a half of law school and tried to find a job as a lawyer. I maybe could have even worked really hard and found a job as a lawyer making $100k a year or more. I could have spent the remainder of my twenties (I'd have graduated right before my 25th birthday) and some of my thirties working my freakin butt off 60-80 hours a week. I could have then maybe gotten my debts paid off and saved enough money to where I'd only have to be a lawyer 40 hours a week or so. In all of this, I could have maybe found someone who wanted to marry me for my money and have my kids (who I would never see because I'd be working so much). Like Tommyhawkers said in his post about being a doctor, I could very easily have ended up as a divorced alcoholic with most of my money going to child support, alimony, etc. But, at least my law degree would get me respect from my fellow man.That's not the life I want though. I'd be happy to make enough money to live off without having to work ridiculous hours at something I don't really care all that much for (the law). I'd love to be able to make $500-$1k a week playing online poker and quit my day job. Maybe someday I'll be able to. I think the bottom line and what life is really all about, is finding something that you can tolerate (and hopefully even enjoy) to make you enough money to live comfortbly. Along the way if you can find a great spouse and maybe have kids, that's tremendous. But, anyone who thinks that you couldn't make a fairly comfortable living making $1k a week online in the midwest, with a spouse who also brings in a little money is just flat out full of shit.

That last part isn't even neccesary.You could live pretty decent on your own with 50k a year.You might need to shop around and find a good rent or mortgage, and not spend your ass off, but my mom raised 2 kids without ever making anywhere near that.

[TheCinciKid 0]

That last part isn't even neccesary.You could live pretty decent on your own with 50k a year.You might need to shop around and find a good rent or mortgage, and not spend your ass off, but my mom raised 2 kids without ever making anywhere near that.

Good point, and if you grew up in the Chicago area, did it in one of the most expensive cities in the Midwest.

[Suited_Up 2]

That last part isn't even neccesary.You could live pretty decent on your own with 50k a year.You might need to shop around and find a good rent or mortgage, and not spend your ass off, but my mom raised 2 kids without ever making anywhere near that.

Good point, and if you grew up in the Chicago area, did it in one of the most expensive cities in the Midwest.

Exactomundo!!Lived on the outskirts and the burbs for awhile, but regardless, it's not cheap.Really not sure how she did it though. Granted, my dad helped out, child support and just random money here and there, but still.$50k aint bad.