Shaq's Suns Debut

[keith crime 8]

Fun game much better than Spurs 75 Pistons 73The lakers getting Gasol is sick - reason 8000 why the NBA is fixedIt's actually shocking that Shaq's free throw shooting could actually get worse and hasShaq might pay off for the Suns but right now he looks like he might be most useful falling on other teams stars and putting them out of commission

[GWCGWC 83]

That was one of the best games I've seen all season and surprisingly, it had very little to do with Shaq.

[Loismustdie 0]

Fun game much better than Spurs 75 Pistons 73The lakers getting Gasol is sick - reason 8000 why the NBA is fixedIt's actually shocking that Shaq's free throw shooting could actually get worse and hasShaq might pay off for the Suns but right now he looks like he might be most useful falling on other teams stars and putting them out of commission

15 points, 9 boards and opened up the floor for Amare to get what was it, 19 or so? Also showed a bit of actual hustle and speed. Yeah, he was a total stiff.

[SuitedAces21 2,722]

Lakers are the best team in the NBA when Bynum gets back.

[bigkg 0]

Lakers are the best team in the NBA when Bynum gets back.

If the Lakers ever get completely healthy, I completely agree they are the best team. Fisher, Bryant, Odom, Gasol, and Bynum starting 5 is nasty. Then Fisher, Walton, Vujacic, Radmonovic, Turiaf, Ariza, and Mihm coming off bench, yikes that's a deep bench.

[kobe2odom8 14]

If the Lakers ever get completely healthy, I completely agree they are the best team. Fisher, Bryant, Odom, Gasol, and Bynum starting 5 is nasty. Then Fisher, Walton, Vujacic, Radmonovic, Turiaf, Ariza, and Mihm coming off bench, yikes that's a deep bench.

fisher cant start and come off the bench... but ne ways, whether or not bynum comes back strong( which im still iffy on) they can still win the championship with this team... this team is sick, cant put it into wordsgo lakers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bigkg 0]

fisher cant start and come off the bench... but ne ways, whether or not bynum comes back strong( which im still iffy on) they can still win the championship with this team... this team is sick, cant put it into wordsgo lakers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

oops, I meant Farmar.

[CaneBrain 95]

15 points, 9 boards and opened up the floor for Amare to get what was it, 19 or so? Also showed a bit of actual hustle and speed. Yeah, he was a total stiff.

sure shored up that defense too. and he almost knocked Raja Bell unconcious. lets call it a mixed debut.

[Loismustdie 0]

sure shored up that defense too. and he almost knocked Raja Bell unconcious. lets call it a mixed debut.

That's just stupid.(Sorry, but it is.) Raja Bell fell backwards into his elbow. If Bell fell backwards into the goal post, would you blame the goal post? No. As far as defense goes, Kobe put up 40+- again. Last time Shaq covered Kobe was...never. The difference was Grant Hill vanished in the second half on the defensive end, and Bell was knocked out of the game. Possible different ending if those two things don't happen. To blame it on Shaq- who did more in his first game than anyone had hoped for-tells me you probably didn't even watch the game. As far as mixed debut- lolaments x1million. He was more than we could have even hoped for. Lost in all of this is the fact that the Lakers had to have there big 3 play out of there minds to even have a chance, and the Suns shot the ball poorly- I don't think Bell even attempted a shot that I can think of. The Suns were out of sync for most of the game, and still kept it close. Alot of missed 10-12 foot jumpers that Suns players usually make. One thing I would like to see is for the Boris Diaw experiment to either come to fruition now or just get rid of him. His refusal to finish a play like he has got a pair is starting to get old, has been for awhile. He gets good looks, and either passes on the shot deferring to teammates or shoots like he is afraid he will miss, and then regret not giving the ball up. When he is in the game he has GOT to finish plays, he is usually in as a 2nd or 3rd offensive option, and he plays with the mindset of a fourth.

[CaneBrain 95]

That's just stupid.(Sorry, but it is.) Raja Bell fell backwards into his elbow. If Bell fell backwards into the goal post, would you blame the goal post? No. As far as defense goes, Kobe put up 40+- again. Last time Shaq covered Kobe was...never. The difference was Grant Hill vanished in the second half on the defensive end, and Bell was knocked out of the game. Possible different ending if those two things don't happen. To blame it on Shaq- who did more in his first game than anyone had hoped for-tells me you probably didn't even watch the game. As far as mixed debut- lolaments x1million. He was more than we could have even hoped for. Lost in all of this is the fact that the Lakers had to have there big 3 play out of there minds to even have a chance, and the Suns shot the ball poorly- I don't think Bell even attempted a shot that I can think of. The Suns were out of sync for most of the game, and still kept it close. Alot of missed 10-12 foot jumpers that Suns players usually make. One thing I would like to see is for the Boris Diaw experiment to either come to fruition now or just get rid of him. His refusal to finish a play like he has got a pair is starting to get old, has been for awhile. He gets good looks, and either passes on the shot deferring to teammates or shoots like he is afraid he will miss, and then regret not giving the ball up. When he is in the game he has GOT to finish plays, he is usually in as a 2nd or 3rd offensive option, and he plays with the mindset of a fourth.

it was....a joke. and yes the lakers big 3 played well but it was a) in phoenix and B) it is really the lakers big 1,2,4. Bynum is #3 which is spooky. agree completely about Diaw.do i think shaq is going to be bad in Phoenix. Nah. Do they win a title? Nah. Lakers got the best of the trade season (assist to Memphis). And if 15 pts, 9 boards, bad free throw shooting, ok D is "more than you could have hoped for" then you have low expectations sir. Marion gave you a lot more than that.

[Loismustdie 0]

it was....a joke. and yes the lakers big 3 played well but it was a) in phoenix and B) it is really the lakers big 1,2,4. Bynum is #3 which is spooky. agree completely about Diaw.do i think shaq is going to be bad in Phoenix. Nah. Do they win a title? Nah. Lakers got the best of the trade season (assist to Memphis). And if 15 pts, 9 boards, bad free throw shooting, ok D is "more than you could have hoped for" then you have low expectations sir. Marion gave you a lot more than that.

So Stoudamire going off has nothing to do with Shaqs presence? As far as what I expect, I expected very little of Shaq coming off of injury, playing on a new team with a whole new style. If you think the Suns not winning a title is some sort of gimme you would be incorrect. As far as if the Lakers got the better deal...maybe. We will see how fast Shaq fits in. Prediction? Without any hesitation I say the Sun, just based off of what I saw last night. Shaq is still a force, and only has upside.

[CaneBrain 95]

So Stoudamire going off has nothing to do with Shaqs presence? As far as what I expect, I expected very little of Shaq coming off of injury, playing on a new team with a whole new style. If you think the Suns not winning a title is some sort of gimme you would be incorrect. As far as if the Lakers got the better deal...maybe. We will see how fast Shaq fits in. Prediction? Without any hesitation I say the Sun, just based off of what I saw last night. Shaq is still a force, and only has upside.

Amare Stoudamire has been great for years. I really dont think it was Shaq that made him explode last night.Also, MAYBE the Lakers got a better deal? Maybe???? They got Pau Gasol, a better, younger player than Shaq, and they gave up NOTHING. The Suns gave up an allstar to get an old guy. It is really not an issue who got the better deal.....the Lakers got a better deal period. That is really not up for debate.I DO think the Suns not winning a title is a gimme.let me let John Hollinger step in for a minute:Feb. 6: Phoenix acquires Shaquille O'Neal from Miami in exchange for Shawn Marion and Marcus BanksFor Miami: Are you kidding me? This was like having a bag of money drop in your lap, except that the bag contained $40 million. Effectively, that's how much Miami saves in this deal, by dropping its obligation to the dead-weight last final two seasons on O'Neal's contract.Marion can opt out of his contract after the season, but he will help them whether he stays or goes. He either gives them beaucoup cap space or one of the best two-way forwards in the game.And don't sleep on Banks. Although he didn't fit in Phoenix, his ability to pressure the ball and attack off the dribble could make a Banks-Wade-Marion perimeter trio a true terror with ball pressure and transition offense. Grade: A+For Phoenix: As I've written, I hated this trade and nothing that happened Wednesday night changed my mind. Shaq was supposed to improve Phoenix's defense; in his first game the Suns gave up 130 points.I'll admit O'Neal looked better than I thought he would; on the other hand, Pau Gasol beat him down court by 30 feet twice in the final five minutes, which is pretty discouraging considering the court is only 94 feet long. Grade: D-For Seattle: And now, for the big winner ... everyone remember that Kurt Thomas trade back in the fall? Phoenix sent Seattle two first-rounders in that deal.What you might not remember is that the 2010 pick is completely unprotected. Didn't seem like a big deal with Phoenix's roster at the time, but now look at the Suns. In the 2009-10 season, Shaq will be 37, Steve Nash will be 35, Grant Hill will be 37, and Raja Bell will be 33. With this trade, the value of that pick just went through the roof. Grade: A

[SuperJon 175]

So Stoudamire going off has nothing to do with Shaqs presence? As far as what I expect, I expected very little of Shaq coming off of injury, playing on a new team with a whole new style. If you think the Suns not winning a title is some sort of gimme you would be incorrect. As far as if the Lakers got the better deal...maybe. We will see how fast Shaq fits in. Prediction? Without any hesitation I say the Sun, just based off of what I saw last night. Shaq is still a force, and only has upside.

LOL at Shaq still being a force.His numbers have been steadily going down the past few years. As is the case with most players when they get older. Unless your name is Brett Favre, there is no upside. Shaq should've retired after winning the championship in Miami.Oh, and Phoenix doesn't win the championship. I guarantee it.

[keith crime 8]

LOL at Shaq still being a force.His numbers have been steadily going down the past few years. As is the case with most players when they get older. Unless your name is Brett Favre, there is no upside. Shaq should've retired after winning the championship in Miami.Oh, and Phoenix doesn't win the championship. I guarantee it.

he can still pass a little and if he gets single covered he'll start to score - but that team is seriously going to be f-ed in two yearsi'd gladly take 4-1 on them to win the west

[Loismustdie 0]

LOL at Shaq still being a force.His numbers have been steadily going down the past few years. As is the case with most players when they get older. Unless your name is Brett Favre, there is no upside. Shaq should've retired after winning the championship in Miami.Oh, and Phoenix doesn't win the championship. I guarantee it.

Watch and see.

[Loismustdie 0]

he can still pass a little and if he gets single covered he'll start to score - but that team is seriously going to be f-ed in two yearsi'd gladly take 4-1 on them to win the west

Thats what people seem to forget. Marion never commanded a double team in his life. Shaq and Stoudamire both do, only Stoudamire is better, so, what will happen? It's easy to see- one less guy on Shaq part of the time, less banging, more points. Teams will have to pick there poison. Suns win the title this year. Unless I am wrong. His performance last game was a good sign of things to come.

[Jadaki 0]

Oh, and Phoenix doesn't win the championship. I guarantee it.

I wouldn't count them out. As much as everyone here seems to be worried about who the Suns can stop, I haven't seen anyone come close to shutting them down and if Amare keeps getting getting to face off with PF's in the west one on one it's going to get really ugly for opposing defenses. In that respect the Spurs adding Kurt Thomas is huge.

[Loismustdie 0]

I wouldn't count them out. As much as everyone here seems to be worried about who the Suns can stop, I haven't seen anyone come close to shutting them down and if Amare keeps getting getting to face off with PF's in the west one on one it's going to get really ugly for opposing defenses. In that respect the Spurs adding Kurt Thomas is huge.

I agree with that 100%. The Kurt Thomas trade is the first one that made me say,"Shit, that is bad for the Suns. This could hurt there chances."

[Jadaki 0]

Watching this Celtics game I'm seeing Shaq do a ton of stuff that I haven't seen him do in years, he is having a real solid impact without commanding the ball. I have no idea what Davis was doing sitting under the basket when Shaq came off that pick and roll and dove to the basket. This game has been playoff physical.

[CaneBrain 95]

Shaq is going to score some, appear motivated, and rebound well.Problem is he cant guard the pick and roll at all. Lakers just pick and rolled them to death.....and somehow I think the spurs will see that and they run the pick and roll really well. (ditto Jazz)it is going to be sad watching the a team run the same offensive set every time and beat the suns.

[ChrisRichey 1]

Thats what people seem to forget. Marion never commanded a double team in his life. Shaq and Stoudamire both do, only Stoudamire is better, so, what will happen? It's easy to see- one less guy on Shaq part of the time, less banging, more points. Teams will have to pick there poison. Suns win the title this year. Unless I am wrong. His performance last game was a good sign of things to come.

4 years ago Shaq demanded a double, not anymore. The Lakers had plenty of success playing Gasol 1-1 on Shaq this week. I think Shaq's point production will stay around 10-12, but Shaq has always been a good passing center which will help Amare and Nash. Care to make a wager? $20 says that Lakers make it farther in the playoffs than the Suns.

[Jadaki 0]

Shaq is going to score some, appear motivated, and rebound well.Problem is he cant guard the pick and roll at all. Lakers just pick and rolled them to death.....and somehow I think the spurs will see that and they run the pick and roll really well. (ditto Jazz)it is going to be sad watching the a team run the same offensive set every time and beat the suns.

You can't really pick and roll against a zone. Do you guys think the coach is an idiot? If he notices a weakness over a few games he will do something to correct it. They just held the Celtics to their lowest point output of the season. Granted KG is still coming back and isn't 100% yet but he still looked pretty solid. They shut down Allen and Pierce completely.

[Jadaki 0]

4 years ago Shaq demanded a double, not anymore. The Lakers had plenty of success playing Gasol 1-1 on Shaq this week. I think Shaq's point production will stay around 10-12, but Shaq has always been a good passing center which will help Amare and Nash. Care to make a wager? $20 says that Lakers make it farther in the playoffs than the Suns.

I saw Boston double team him a few times last night.

[Loismustdie 0]

You can't really pick and roll against a zone. Do you guys think the coach is an idiot? If he notices a weakness over a few games he will do something to correct it. They just held the Celtics to their lowest point output of the season. Granted KG is still coming back and isn't 100% yet but he still looked pretty solid. They shut down Allen and Pierce completely.

I was going to point out the beating they gave the Celtics last night WITHOUT the fast break. You pretty much did that for me. Shaq equaled his season high for rebounds, Hill had his second double double in a row- the thing is, Shaq doesn't need to score. Everyone else will. It would be foolish to think that he doesn't still command a double down low, and the Celtics did have to a few times last night. Also, look at how the Suns are absolutely owning the offensive boards since they got Shaq. There is so much upside to this trade it's insane. And, I hated this trade at first, then I saw how it energized the Suns, the town, radio stations, etc. Nobody wants to own a Marion jersey, nobody buys tickets to see Marion, or very few did. Shaq sells, and so far has produced.

[CaneBrain 95]

You can't really pick and roll against a zone. Do you guys think the coach is an idiot? If he notices a weakness over a few games he will do something to correct it. They just held the Celtics to their lowest point output of the season. Granted KG is still coming back and isn't 100% yet but he still looked pretty solid. They shut down Allen and Pierce completely.

I mean I guess you could say they shut them down completely. I watched the whole game....it was more like Ray Allen missed a lot of open jumpers.You cannot win the Western Conference playing a zone. I dont care how smart Dantoni is (and for the record, I think he is damn smart) the Suns still have glaring defensive issues that got WORSE not better with the Shaq trade.