how to play with a massive stack in nl

[ahosang 0]

Maybe a little loose pre-flop in terms of starters, but not in terms of dearness - I would generally suggest a conservative, limit-hold'em starting requirement(in terms of dearness of different hands) pre-flop, with the uber-aggressive, no-limit hold'em betting tactics post-flop.

Dearness? That must be a British term, I've never heard of it, what does it mean?

The flaming in this thread means I don't know if this is a genuine question or some attack on me. This forum is becoming a bit silly after the good start. If it's a genuine question, then 'dearness' means expensiveness, costliness. Here's an American website:http://www.wordreference.com/definition/dearness

[JFarrell20 1]

Maybe a little loose pre-flop in terms of starters, but not in terms of dearness - I would generally suggest a conservative, limit-hold'em starting requirement(in terms of dearness of different hands) pre-flop, with the uber-aggressive, no-limit hold'em betting tactics post-flop.

Dearness? That must be a British term, I've never heard of it, what does it mean?

The flaming in this thread means I don't know if this is a genuine question or some attack on me. This forum is becoming a bit silly after the good start. If it's a genuine question, then 'dearness' means expensiveness, costliness. Here's an American website:http://www.wordreference.com/definition/dearness

LOL. No, I'm serious. i've never heard the term. I have no beef with you. Smasharoo is the one who comes on here and picks fights to prove himself.This was a genuine question and thanks for a genuine answer.

[Smasharoo 0]

Sure, do that. That way I can hang it in the bathroom so it will inspire me to take a big dump while I look at your "I'm-better-than-you" face.Considering the astounding improbabliity of you ever besting me at anything poker related, I think it's good you have some kind of outlet for that frustration.

[jayboogie 0]

Sure, do that. That way I can hang it in the bathroom so it will inspire me to take a big dump while I look at your "I'm-better-than-you" face.Considering the astounding improbabliity of you ever besting me at anything poker related, I think it's good you have some kind of outlet for that frustration.

Smasharoo, your probably a little too overconfident for your own good. Remember being overconfident in your abilities is a downfall of many players. Sure, you may be successful, but that doesn't mean theres other players that couldn't clean you out on this board. Also, exchanging insults and comments such as this just show you as classless. If you disagree with something, just be straight forward about it, no need to needle somebody and pick at them. You never know what some of these people on this board could become 1 day. That's something I've learned, never be too quick to judge.

[Smasharoo 0]

Smasharoo, your probably a little too overconfident for your own good. Remember being overconfident in your abilities is a downfall of many players. Sure, you may be successful, but that doesn't mean theres other players that couldn't clean you out on this board. Also, exchanging insults and comments such as this just show you as classless. If you disagree with something, just be straight forward about it, no need to needle somebody and pick at them. You never know what some of these people on this board could become 1 day. That's something I've learned, never be too quick to judge.Your ageless wisdom has changed my life.I'll take it to hear and live every day attempting to be more like you so that some day I can be self righetous overly concerned message board morality cop.Oh, it is to dream.

[jayboogie 0]

Smasharoo, your probably a little too overconfident for your own good. Remember being overconfident in your abilities is a downfall of many players. Sure, you may be successful, but that doesn't mean theres other players that couldn't clean you out on this board. Also, exchanging insults and comments such as this just show you as classless. If you disagree with something, just be straight forward about it, no need to needle somebody and pick at them. You never know what some of these people on this board could become 1 day. That's something I've learned, never be too quick to judge.Your ageless wisdom has changed my life.I'll take it to hear and live every day attempting to be more like you so that some day I can be self righetous overly concerned message board morality cop.Oh, it is to dream.

I could care less how you present yourself on here. Just thought I would mention it once, so take it for what it's worth. You won't be hearing about it anymore.

[Smasharoo 0]

I could care less how you present yourself on here. Just thought I would mention it once, so take it for what it's worth. You won't be hearing about it anymore.I just find it puzzling that people feel compelled to point out TO ME that I'm arrogant and a pain in the ass.I know!It's a message board, lighten up! In person I'm quaint and charming and mannered. This is poker mesage board. People read it to learn and occasionally laugh. I try to live up to the standard. It'd be an awefully boring read if everyone was overly polite, don't you think?

[jayboogie 0]

I could care less how you present yourself on here. Just thought I would mention it once, so take it for what it's worth. You won't be hearing about it anymore.I just find it puzzling that people feel compelled to point out TO ME that I'm arrogant and a pain in the ass.I know!It's a message board, lighten up!  In person I'm quaint and charming and mannered.  This is poker mesage board.  People read it to learn and occasionally laugh.  I try to live up to the standard.  It'd be an awefully boring read if everyone was overly polite, don't you think?

Hey I sure don't mind, but I think some ppl get offended that's all. Just pointing it out incase you haven't noticed. I do find it entertaining tho

[theKAbag 0]

im with you Smash. people these days dont know how to take things with a grain of salt. thanks for being the a$$ everyone needs to hear from.everyone needs to learn not to give a crap,paul

[JFarrell20 1]

Smasharoo, your probably a little too overconfident for your own good. Remember being overconfident in your abilities is a downfall of many players. Sure, you may be successful, but that doesn't mean theres other players that couldn't clean you out on this board. Also, exchanging insults and comments such as this just show you as classless. If you disagree with something, just be straight forward about it, no need to needle somebody and pick at them. You never know what some of these people on this board could become 1 day. That's something I've learned, never be too quick to judge.Your ageless wisdom has changed my life.I'll take it to hear and live every day attempting to be more like you so that some day I can be self righetous overly concerned message board morality cop.Oh, it is to dream.

Smash, you say he is the message board cop, meanwhile you are the one with almost 600 posts on here in less than 2 months. For someone who claims to play poker for real money so much, you sure have a lot of free time. Everything you say is inconsitent with a previous statement. Give it a rest.

[Smasharoo 0]

Smash, you say he is the message board cop, meanwhile you are the one with almost 600 posts on here in less than 2 months. For someone who claims to play poker for real money so much, you sure have a lot of free time. Everything you say is inconsitent with a previous statement. Give it a rest.I'm a little fuzzy on how having a lot of posts would conflict with playing online....Logic is hard for some people, though.

[JFarrell20 1]

Smash, you say he is the message board cop, meanwhile you are the one with almost 600 posts on here in less than 2 months. For someone who claims to play poker for real money so much, you sure have a lot of free time. Everything you say is inconsitent with a previous statement. Give it a rest.I'm a little fuzzy on how having a lot of posts would conflict with playing online....Logic is hard for some people, though.

Posting while you play is not very smart. I think you do more posting than playing. No wonder why you are ranked as the 1,240,024th best player in the city of Boston, right behind Kevin Millar and Cam "Sea Bass" Neely.

[Smasharoo 0]

Posting while you play is not very smart. I think you do more posting than playing. No wonder why you are ranked as the 1,240,024th best player in the city of Boston, right behind Kevin Millar and Cam "Sea Bass" Neely.It's a shame there's not a net shorthand for "patronizing fake laughter" I think I'll start calling it a JFarrell20.Man, your post made me JFarrell20.You're right, though. I don't play at all. In point of fact I just make stuff up randomly as I go along hoping no one notices that I have no idea what I'm talking about.For a while I wasn't sure how to make it random enough untill I designed a big wheel ala "Mad Max Beyond Thunderdome". Now when I'm going to reply to a post I spin the wheel and either agree with a play or say it sucks or whatever the wheel tells me.Hang on, let me give it a spin.Your play sucks.

[ahosang 0]

Back to the topic, the thinking behind what I said was that you specifically mentioned this is online play where people come and go very quicky perhaps. So rather than trying to build table image and so on, just play tight and someone may think that you're just a big bluffer when you have a hand. If you play too loose, then you bring yourself to the level of others and may lose that REAL money back.By the way, this feud is just like any other I've seen in surfing the web since 1994(anyone else here used to browse with Mosaic or Netscape 1?). It's quite amusing as long as you're both enjoying yourselves. After hundreds(yes hundreds) of forums, chatrooms etc from soccer to IT/programming to chess to horseracing to poker, I have got bored of the dissing, but sometimes funny to hear some good old fashioned flaming. You two will probably become cult figures on this forum. :-)

[Smasharoo 0]

You two will probably become cult figures on this forum.Nah, probably just me. I can write.

[JFarrell20 1]

You two will probably become cult figures on this forum.Nah, probably just me.  I can write.

Maybe, but "until" only has one "L". Sorry, dude.

[randomization 0]

I'm not sure if posting real advice on this thread is worth it anymore, since it's mostly a flame war, but here are my thoughts. I don't think your stack size matters especially much unless there are other big stacks at the table. If everyone else has $25 stacks, your having a $270 stack is about the same as your having a $26 stack. You have them covered, and the maximum that you can win or lose from/to any one player is $25 per hand. Of course, this will quickly change if someone doubles up against you. Nevertheless, looking at things from a technical perspective, having an enourmous stack is no different from having the biggest stack by just a little bit. So applying tournament strategy is going to hurt you, because a lot of aspects of tournament strategy only make sense when people cannot rebuy, have high blinds, and are forced to play short stacks. $25 is probably 50 or 100 BB, which is huge in comparison to what people usually have in a tourney. If there are other people at the table with big stacks, then you'll have to make adjustments based on that fact. Against other players with tall stacks, big unsuited cards go down in value because they have poor implied odds, while pocket pairs, suited connectors, suited aces and the like go up. You'll have to observe whether other players are varying their play against you. If you notice that someone is playing a lot of speculative hands against you, make them pay to be in the pot to cut down on those odds. On the other hand, if you notice that another play is continuing to be tight (especially tight-passive) play hands with high implied odds against him. The one thing that will change is that people will play you a bit differently because they'll notice that you've won a ton of money. Probably the most likely thing is that they'll start gunning for you, trying to take a shot at your money. Bad players may just start playing more hands regardless of quality. However this will depend on the player and the circumstances. Sometimes people will back off of you, and you'll have to give them more credit when they play you. Alan Schoonmaker has a few articles on "Playing the Rush" in the Cardplayer magazine archives that have some useful information about the psychology involved when someone is getting incredible cards. It's more oriented to limit, but if you keep that in mind, it might be useful. Also, pay attention to how well you play with a big stack. The one time it does make sense to hit and run is if you are liable to lose money when playing a big stack. If you know that you are not good at playing a big stack, you should get the money off of the table. In the long run, it's best to patch that hole in your play, but that doesn't mean you should always keep playing with a big stack.

[Smasharoo 0]

Maybe, but "until" only has one "L". Sorry, dude.Forunately for me spell-check is common and simple.Unfortunately for you no one's come out with "idiotcheck" just yet.Hope springs eternal, though.

[Smasharoo 0]

I don't think your stack size matters especially much unless there are other big stacks at the table. If everyone else has $25 stacks, your having a $270 stack is about the same as your having a $26 stack. You have them covered, and the maximum that you can win or lose from/to any one player is $25 per hand. Of course, this will quickly change if someone doubles up against you.Or each other. It's only like having a $26 stack if you're playing heads up.You're missing the point entirely if you think having $26 when all other players have $25 is the same as having $270.

[randomization 0]

Informative reply. Care to explain?

[Smasharoo 0]

Informative reply. Care to explain?Not sure what's unclear.Let me offer you a simple case.Let's assume I'm the best player at the table at all times.All other players start with $25 and I start with $26.First hand, I fold before the flop, and someone else doubles up. He now has $50. I no longer have a weaker players covered and thus can't maximize my skill advantage by taking his whole stack.That's the unique advantage of having a very large stack in restricted buy in NL games. If all nine of the other players go all in and I fold, I can still take the whole stack of the one player that wins in one hand.Can you not see the importance of that?

[JFarrell20 1]

You both make good points, actually. That one guy is saying that a $1 chip advantage is similar to a $1million dollar chip advantage. It's still just a temporary "advantage", you cannot possibly go out on the next hand. But it is true that others can double up and become a factor. But it's also not like people are going to be doubling-up left and right. I think the huge stack does help in the sense that others will be less likely to raise when they know someones got them covered 10-fold. example: If the table is full of 9 players each with $25, nobody is going to feel timid about raising w/ a good hand.But when 8 players have 25 and one has 270, each of the 8 players will be hesitant to raise much if that 270 stack keeps coming over the top of them.Smash, if you have to use spell-check, does that mean you have to use a poker "pot-odds" calculator at the table? If so, I will say a little prayer for you.

[Slayre 0]

I don't think he uses it, I think he just has access to it.I was going to comment on his spelling, but he did it himself...which was cool and I got a chuckle out of it....I still don't believe his story in the first place...... but, that is me....

[JFarrell20 1]

Hey I was out in Austin for the first time last August on a business trip. I loved it. Nice vacation from Houston. :)I played in a play money tournament at Fado Irish Bar on 4th street both nights I was there. I had a real good time, good people there.

[randomization 0]

The original question (that you asked) was about how to play a big stack, Smasharoo. While the point you made does show a difference in what happens at the table while you have a big stack, it doesn't in any way imply a difference in how you should play. When people have $25 at the table, play it like you've got $26. If someone doubles up, against you or anyone else, the right way to play changes, but until then, the big stack doesn't make a big difference, I think.