BeaverStyle 1 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 Pokertracker isn't working for me right now, but villain was pretty tight. PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $10+$1 Tournament, 125/250 Blinds 25 Ante (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.comSB (t4735)Hero (BB) (t9340)UTG (t3185)UTG+1 (t14145)MP1 (t540)MP2 (t7180)CO (t7198)Button (t10898)Preflop: Hero is BB with , Hero raises to t750, UTG calls t750, 1 fold, MP1 calls t515 (All-In), 5 foldsFlop: (t2615) , , (3 players, 1 all-in)Hero ????????Stack sizes make this awkward to play, imo. Check/fold? If I lead I commit myself to UTG+1's shove (if he shoves).BTW, converter is being borderline retarded, I raised UTG< was called by UTG+1. Link to post Share on other sites
mk 11 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 such an odd stack size for utg+1 to be flatting an utg raise. i think c/f is probably best. Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 a stack like that just calling a pf raise is almost always a middle pair. With all of your outs you are probably calling a donk bet if you check it, so make a donk bet into him and fold to a raise. Youve got fold equity against anything but TPGK and monsters, and you have a draw to the nuts. Bet 750, I think you easily get a fold >33% of the time. And then you can enjoy him cursing you out for not "cooperating". Link to post Share on other sites
Aces Rule 0 Posted September 16, 2008 Share Posted September 16, 2008 a stack like that just calling a pf raise is almost always a middle pair. With all of your outs you are probably calling a donk bet if you check it, so make a donk bet into him and fold to a raise. Youve got fold equity against anything but TPGK and monsters, and you have a draw to the nuts. Bet 750, I think you easily get a fold >33% of the time. And then you can enjoy him cursing you out for not "cooperating".What Cops saids plus with a UTG+1's stack being that big he can afford to play a very wide range including connectors - suited or not! Unless you're known to ck-raise a lot I think you've got to c-bet this at least once as played.However, preflop you had only 12xbb in your stack so should have been looking to dbl up or steal the blinds with a hand that good from UTG and you have to figure shortie (MP1) would be pushing damn soon too so you could have gone for a open shove or ck-raise all-in pre-flop and got to see all 5 cards instead of being put to a tuf decision post flop which you know will happen 2/3 of the time. Link to post Share on other sites
MovingIn 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I'm thinking villain shoves here almost every time if we check or probe bet, regardless of what he's holding. It's his only play at this point, and if we show any weakness at all, he's going to try and fold us with a shove. Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I'm thinking villain shoves here almost every time if we check or probe bet, regardless of what he's holding. It's his only play at this point, and if we show any weakness at all, he's going to try and fold us with a shove.but what hes holding is critical to our hand equity. If weve got 7 outs then cb/call a push is +EV. Im also not any where near as sure as you are that he pushes. Hes got 25% of his stack in, and a bluff only wins him your bet, not the main pot, so he really has to believe hes ahead of both of you to push. Link to post Share on other sites
MovingIn 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Im also not any where near as sure as you are that he pushes. Hes got 25% of his stack in, and a bluff only wins him your bet, not the main pot, so he really has to believe hes ahead of both of you to push.If we check, that's a pretty good sign to him that he's ahead, and he'll have the side pot to himself if we fold. Your line makes it pretty easy to get pushed off this hand.OP, has this villain been aggressive postflop? Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 If we check, that's a pretty good sign to him that he's ahead, and he'll have the side pot to himself if we fold. Your line makes it pretty easy to get pushed off this hand.OP, has this villain been aggressive postflop??? I didnt say check. Link to post Share on other sites
MovingIn 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 Yeah, that should have been 'check or bet'... 'bet' in this case being a standard bet. Link to post Share on other sites
simo_8ball 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 What is our stack and what is villain's stack? If either of us have the ~$3k stack then it's an easy bet/call (or just open shove). Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 What is our stack and what is villain's stack? If either of us have the ~$3k stack then it's an easy bet/call (or just open shove).villain is the 3k stack. Link to post Share on other sites
simo_8ball 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I think bet/folding for $750 is pretty horrible when he has $2435 left.I'd either shove or I'd bet/call for ~$1600ish. Link to post Share on other sites
Aces Rule 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 villain is the 3k stack.So hero actually had 9340? - if so disreguard my first post re: pust preflop! Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 So hero actually had 9340? - if so disreguard my first post re: pust preflop!???? Push preflop from UTG? with 35bb and stacks behind you that cover or cripple you? Link to post Share on other sites
Poker Addict 0 Posted September 17, 2008 Share Posted September 17, 2008 I am very confused by the hand. I think its a converter error? Hero is first to act preflop and is called by UTG and MP1? And then hero is first to act on the flop? So this is what it looks like to me:Hero is UTG (t9340)UTG+1 (t3185)MP2 (t540)I am assuming that hero is actually UTG with a stack of 9340. I raise the same pre. And if I assume that the only other person left in this hand besides shorty who is all in is the 3185 stack. I go ahead and push against this guy. He has like ~2400 left so that is what we are risking in total to win this pot. If he does call we have two overs and a gutshot - and left with 6k if we lose. If he folds, we are hu against the shorty which is fine and we pick up the side pot.Please let me know if I am reading this right. Link to post Share on other sites
Aces Rule 0 Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 ???? Push preflop from UTG? with 35bb and stacks behind you that cover or cripple you?I read/thought hero was UTG w/3185 but now you're saying the villian was the one with 3185 and hero had 35bb (9340). If that is correct then disreguard my first post about pushing preflop b/c at that time I was under the impression hero had only 12bb. The HH is sorta screwed up.. Link to post Share on other sites
BeaverStyle 1 Posted September 18, 2008 Author Share Posted September 18, 2008 Villain was playing rather passively. I had 9,340, he had the 3k stack. So, lead/call a push is best play here? Link to post Share on other sites
simo_8ball 0 Posted September 18, 2008 Share Posted September 18, 2008 Villain was playing rather passively. I had 9,340, he had the 3k stack. So, lead/call a push is best play here?If you bet, you can't fold to a shove. If you check, you give up a lot of equity in the pot.I think bet/call is a LOT better. Getting it in (potentially) against an underpair is ok because you have 10 outs, and even if he has AQ/KQ you aren't in a lot of trouble. Link to post Share on other sites
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