I Have Aces

[SCS 0]

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (6 handed) Full Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FCP)BB ($118.95)UTG ($12.65)MP ($98.80)CO ($49.25)Hero ($84.50)SB ($48)Preflop: Hero is Button with A , A . UTG calls $0.50, 2 folds, Hero raises to $2.25, 1 fold, BB calls $1.75, UTG calls $1.75.Flop: ($7) 2 , 9 , J (3 players)BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $4, BB calls $4, UTG folds.Turn: ($15) 8 (2 players)BB bets $10, Hero calls $10.River: ($35) 5 (2 players)BB checks, Hero bets $18Villain is a semi-competent slag 30.63/14.79/2.65 over 284 hands. Postflop I haven't seen villain do anything too tricky or out of the ordinary. Wasn't sure if I should raise the turn donkbet. I didn't want to get shoved on here and have to fold maybe the best hand or call and be up against a set. Plan on the river was to call most bets by villain, or make a value bet if checked to, which is what happened here. What does everyone else think?

[simo_8ball 0]

Bet moar on flop.Rest is good, although I doubt you bet $18 with busted AhXh on the river. You would either check or bet about $23ish.If I'm villain I know I can pretty easily fold KJ there.

[pokerinc 0]

more on flop raise his turn bet.just looked at stacks, that deep I guess you could flat turn. But the line's weird to me of calling his turn and firing weird on the river.Nah, I'd still raise turn. Ok, nvmnd

[SCS 0]

more on flop raise his turn bet.just looked at stacks, that deep I guess you could flat turn. But the line's weird to me of calling his turn and firing weird on the river.Nah, I'd still raise turn. Ok, nvmnd

If I raise turn, do you think villian will call with hands like KJ or QJ?

[SCS 0]

Bet moar on flop.Rest is good, although I doubt you bet $18 with busted AhXh on the river. You would either check or bet about $23ish.

Yeah, I definitely lost some value by not betting a little more.

If I'm villain I know I can pretty easily fold KJ there.

Where is "there"? Are you talking about the river?

[simo_8ball 0]

Where is "there"? Are you talking about the river?

Yeah, sorry if that wasn't clear.The $18 looks like a value bet. Against a decent opponent you probably aren't getting paid off. I can't see you betting $18 with busted hearts or something.(This is where you get into levelling problems)

[SCS 0]

Yeah, sorry if that wasn't clear.The $18 looks like a value bet. Against a decent opponent you probably aren't getting paid off. I can't see you betting $18 with busted hearts or something.(This is where you get into levelling problems)

Yeah, villain is definitely one of the better players that I have seen at this level, but he's definitely no poker wiz by any means. I do think I should have bet more on the river, but not necessarily for the reasons you stated. I don't think villain will think the same way you do.If villain will call $18 he's probably calling $23.

[mtdesmoines 3]

One pair, four people flopping. Bet more than 70% of the pot on the flop.

[SCS 0]

One pair, four people flopping. Bet more than 70% of the pot on the flop.

What if it's 3 people to the flop?

[mtdesmoines 3]

What if it's 3 people to the flop?

6 handed, that's half the table. Anyway, yeah. Stylistically, I play AA hard. I think it's the only way to win consistently with them as well as using them to their full advantage. Add to that the fact that I play a lot of hands strong, it only means my AA pays off that much more.

[IAGTTAYM 0]

I would bet more on the flop, maybe $5.5 or $6The "standard" play on the turn would be to call, but I actually think making it ~$29 against your normal non tricky 50nl villain is the superior play.As played you have to v-bet the river, maybe $24 or so.

[krup24 0]

i hate letting villian own you on the turn by donking into u and u just smooth calling. can easily be a hand like TJ or JQh which is completely taking control of the pot.

[SCS 0]

I would bet more on the flop, maybe $5.5 or $6The "standard" play on the turn would be to call, but I actually think making it ~$29 against your normal non tricky 50nl villain is the superior play.As played you have to v-bet the river, maybe $24 or so.

What exactly does raising the turn accomplish? If I raise here villain is most likely dumping any J, so the raise would have no value and he's not folding better hands. I have a hand that I'm perfectly happy going to showdown with. Raising the turn is a little spewy, imo.

[IAGTTAYM 0]

What exactly does raising the turn accomplish? If I raise here villain is most likely dumping any J, so the raise would have no value and he's not folding better hands. I have a hand that I'm perfectly happy going to showdown with. Raising the turn is a little spewy, imo.

Well, in a nutshell I think it's easier to extract value on the turn opposed to the river. I think it also defines his hand a ton and it makes your range much tougher to play against.

[tskillz187 0]

I raise that turn to $35. I think him donking into you on the turn means that he picked up a draw on the turn, the hand that I see as most likely would be JThh. I'm not going to play passively just because we are so deep, I'd raise that turn up and if he shoved on me I'd note that he donks with made hands, something like QT, or set isn't unlikely. I think it's very difficult for him to 3bet all in on the turn w/o a hand that is ahead of AA but we still get to extract value from the combo draws and tptk.I also think raising the turn gets us to showdown on the river. We can just check behind on the river or fold if he leads at us.

[simo_8ball 0]

I raise that turn to $35. I think him donking into you on the turn means that he picked up a draw on the turn, the hand that I see as most likely would be JThh. I'm not going to play passively just because we are so deep, I'd raise that turn up and if he shoved on me I'd note that he donks with made hands, something like QT, or set isn't unlikely. I think it's very difficult for him to 3bet all in on the turn w/o a hand that is ahead of AA but we still get to extract value from the combo draws and tptk.I also think raising the turn gets us to showdown on the river. We can just check behind on the river or fold if he leads at us.

Actually, yeah. I like this a lot.

[Sheiky 0]

I think raising the turn is overplaying your hand a bit in this spot, but given the board I guess you can value raise against Pair+draws too and not just against two-pairs/sets/straights.

[simo_8ball 0]

I think raising the turn is overplaying your hand a bit in this spot

If we are planning on calling the river we may as well get more value from his drawing hands, and I don't think he's shoving the turn with a worse hand.It's pretty close, but raising keeps us in control and will usually allow us to make a river check/bet decision rather than a call/fold decision.

[tskillz187 0]

I don't understand what the deal is with getting to showdown. We want to maximize value against his range, not get to showdown as cheaply as possible. Sure it feels a lot better when he has a set and we kept the pot small on these streets and get to actually see his hole cards to verify that it is indeed a set.But raising to get value from hands that we are ahead of is winning poker. You need to extract money from hands that you beat. Instead of paying off two streets of him value betting and seeing the cards, we can actually charge hands we beat. We don't need to see his hole cards if he 3bet shoves, he had the set/straight/two pair, I think we are putting way too much emphasis on getting to showdown.If we had a hand like QJ it would be something we'd want to get to showdown cheap with, it had showdown value but worse hands aren't calling bets from it (unless they are TJ). You turn it into a bluff catcher or check it down hoping to be good. AA is much too strong to do that in this case. AA is not essentially QJ here, since Villain could easily have KJ, AJ. I could see not raising with QJ (though I still might do it cuz I'm very aggro and want to merge my ranges a bit and think I could get FE from KJ and AJ while still charging draws I'm ahead of).I don't really understand how we're overrepping our hand. No one at $50 max bets/3bets all in on the turn with a draw, it's too tricky a play.If we call $10, then call $20-25 we are risking the same amount as if we raise to $35 on the turn. The difference being that we get to charge draws and have villain possibly make a mistake, instead of hoping he bets a weaker hand twice. The trade off is we get to showdown less often, which I think is unimportant.

[Sheiky 0]

Well you've convinced me

[SCS 0]

I actually like the raise turn line as well now.

[fckthis 0]

If you raise the turn, and get shoved on...do you fold?

[SCS 0]

If you raise the turn, and get shoved on...do you fold?

Yes.If we were less than 100BB deep though I'd happily get it all in.

[rdtedm 0]

I don't understand what the deal is with getting to showdown. We want to maximize value against his range, not get to showdown as cheaply as possible. Sure it feels a lot better when he has a set and we kept the pot small on these streets and get to actually see his hole cards to verify that it is indeed a set.But raising to get value from hands that we are ahead of is winning poker. You need to extract money from hands that you beat. Instead of paying off two streets of him value betting and seeing the cards, we can actually charge hands we beat. We don't need to see his hole cards if he 3bet shoves, he had the set/straight/two pair, I think we are putting way too much emphasis on getting to showdown.If we had a hand like QJ it would be something we'd want to get to showdown cheap with, it had showdown value but worse hands aren't calling bets from it (unless they are TJ). You turn it into a bluff catcher or check it down hoping to be good. AA is much too strong to do that in this case. AA is not essentially QJ here, since Villain could easily have KJ, AJ. I could see not raising with QJ (though I still might do it cuz I'm very aggro and want to merge my ranges a bit and think I could get FE from KJ and AJ while still charging draws I'm ahead of).I don't really understand how we're overrepping our hand. No one at $50 max bets/3bets all in on the turn with a draw, it's too tricky a play.If we call $10, then call $20-25 we are risking the same amount as if we raise to $35 on the turn. The difference being that we get to charge draws and have villain possibly make a mistake, instead of hoping he bets a weaker hand twice. The trade off is we get to showdown less often, which I think is unimportant.