Getting Maximum Value

[JCG 0]

Hi there,It seems that a big step towards becoming a very good player is getting maximum value from a hand. So, once you are ahead after the flop and you realise that in all likelihood your hand will hold up to the river, how do you get maximum value? Quite simply this is my question. Now I know that this depends on the hands involved and the players etc but I would like to hear some general tips from any experienced players out there who can get a handle on my question and create some kind of unified advice for a general situation.More specifically, if you flop top pair, two pair or a set, and there is a flush (or straight) draw out there and the person on the draw (heads up) makes a big bet on the flop it seems a nice idea to me to just call. Is this standard strategy for getting maximum value or would you not agree?Thirdly, assuming that after a few months of playing, everyone knows the basic strategy about position and value betting and randomizing your play and changing pace and game style during a game, does the game then just become a game of reading people? In other words, is that the one thing that will separate the players? So, take the final table at a WS event. Luck aside, everyone knows the same strategy so is it the people reading skills that determine the best player? I ask this because I am good at learning strategy and doing the math etc but I find it difficult to trust a read so I play safe. The only way I read a hand is by betting patterns and this works well for me but I never get a read from a tell or anything like that. Do pro's /semi pro's really read people that way? If any of you have any comments on my questions, please get back, I would love to hear your replies.JCG

[Zach6668 513]

OP, this section is reserved for posts picked out of the strategy forums by DN. Please don't post your own questions/hands here. Moving this to the NL section.

[jmbreslin 0]

I'm a newbie myself so I'm not the best person to be responding but my understanding of getting maximum value is that you basically want to get as much money into the pot when you are a statistical favorite while at the same time minimizing your potential losses when you are behind. For example, a set on the flop is a big favorite over a flush draw (something like 75%) so you want to get as much money into the pot as you can whenever that situation arises. Statistically, you'll lose 25% of the time; but you'll make money in the long run because you'll win 75% of the time.Does that make sense, experienced guys?

[tskillz187 0]

The question is too general. Experience.

[ChrisRichey 1]

The question is too general. Experience.

Yeah, and read HoH II.

[JCG 0]

Nice one. So, what is the HoH II? Also in reply to the newbie. Thanks for your reply I appreciate it. Whilst reading the messages on the forums though, I keep hearing of people choosing between pushing it all in and value betting the hand out. This seems to conflict with your advice of getting as much money in the pot as possible. I don't know either as I am a fellow newbie. I guess I should read books and just go to some casinos and learn the right way. Experience! Good luck with your tournaments guys.........

[caribstv 0]

http://www.amazon.com/No-Limit-Hold-Theory...e/dp/188068537X

[ChrisRichey 1]

JCG, HoH was referring to Harrington on Hold 'em, which is a series of tournament no limit hold 'em books written by Dan Harrington. They are a must read for any tournament player. There are three volumes, though the last one is more of a workbook. Vol. IVol. IIVol. IIIAlso, if there are certain hands that you may be wondering what the right play is, feel free to come here and ask for advice. If it's an online tournament, make sure you save the hand history and use a converter (in the stickied thread at the top of tournament strategy). If it's a live tournament, try to give as much information as possible. Also, be sure to post in your online or live hands any reads that you may have on your opponents. Good luck, and welcome!

[Zach6668 513]

lol, I'm retarded. I was going to move this to the NL section, but somehow moved it here. Worked out anyways, lol.

[shpaget 0]

It's all a matter of finding the balance.You want to bet an amount that he will call, but it will be a mistake to call.For example, let's say he is 4:1 to draw ahead of you on the turn (eg. you have a set, and you fear a flush draw)...make him call a bet that only offers him 3:1.After that, it is all dependent on your opponent.Some will call down with ace high with no draws.Some see minbets as strength and overbets as weakness...others see minbets as weak.Others will call literally any bet with any flush or open-ended straight draw....in those cases, I will typically give him a free card on the turn (because going all-in will give him a correct price for two cards)...and then terribly overbet with only one card to come.There's not much more to it...make your opponents make mistakes...and bet according to their skills and habits.

[ChrisRichey 1]

Excellent post shpaget, good job.

[JCG 0]

Thanks guys. Some excellent posts. I will definitely buy HoH II maybe all 3 volumes. I have been scouring the internet for strategy advice. Also, shpaget, I like your answer it basically sums up what I wanted to know."Bet the maximum amount that you still think the opponent will call when it would be a mistake for him/her to call". Nice very nice. Clearly this amount depends on reads and lots of other factors but that is the basic idea I wanted to know.