Ricer98 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 This hand occured early in hour 3 of the tourney. Down to about 160 out of the 1300 that started. Avg chip stack is around 11k and my stack of 29k is in the top 10. PokerStars Game #7133435057: Tournament #36191617, $1.00+$0.10 Hold'em No Limit - Level IX (300/600) - 2006/11/22 - 20:17:29 (ET)Table '36191617 26' 9-max Seat #1 is the buttonSeat 1: AA.Mitch.AA (3340 in chips) Seat 2: vactorman (17271 in chips) Seat 3: HPayis (4250 in chips) Seat 4: Sausager (12250 in chips) Seat 5: hbeers (4070 in chips) Seat 6: LimitGrinder (29053 in chips) Seat 7: jaysurbuddy (18685 in chips) Seat 8: chazdfouts (5896 in chips) Seat 9: LittleHoya (2229 in chips) *** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to LimitGrinder [Qc Qd]Sausager: folds hbeers: folds LimitGrinder: raises 1200 to 1800jaysurbuddy: calls 1800chazdfouts: folds LittleHoya: raises 379 to 2179 and is all-inAA.Mitch.AA: folds vactorman: raises 15042 to 17221 and is all-inHPayis: folds LimitGrinder: ????Vactorman has been at the table for most of the tourney and been playing a pretty solid game. This is the first out of line play hes made and confuses the hell out of me. The huge raise almost seems like an isolation play. Trying to get heads up with the short stack while at the same time picking up the extra money from my raise and jays call. If thats the case I think we can put his range of hands as probably a smaller pair or AK hoping he's in a race with the short stack. Odds are he doesn't raise this much with AA or KK. Knowing his probable range of hands and that I'd still have an average stack if I lost lead me towards calling at first. But if he does have a hand like AK do I wanna flip a coin for 60% of stack, not really. What do you guys do in this spot? Link to post Share on other sites
grannysmith 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I'd prob fold, you haven't invested much, and i hate getting my whole stack on the line preflop w/o aces and kings. you still have plenty of chips to play/chop away with. best case scenerio he has ak and do you really want to race 22k chips when blinds are only 300/600. I doubt people are doing this w/ jj-99.oh i see now its a dollar tounry, heh, well i'd prob call that in this tounry. take above advice for what its worht Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 with no other reads i think its an easy fold. I dont think you can eliminate AA, KK. Remember hes seen two big stacks raise and call that raise. There isnt enough dead money for a push without a monster. Link to post Share on other sites
Briguy 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 A reraise all-in from vactorman is not out of line if he has AA or KK. Your raise and the limper behind you make it optimal. It's also not horrible if he has AK, QQ, JJ. Against a range of JJ+, AKo, AKs, QQ is 47%. You have to call 15,000 for a pot of 21,000. This is really only a -cEV call if you put his range on exactly AA, KK, AKs. Throw AKo in there and it becomes marginally +cEV.If he could do this with TT+, AQs+, then it's a clear call, obviously Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 A reraise all-in from vactorman is not out of line if he has AA or KK. Your raise and the limper behind you make it optimal. It's also not horrible if he has AK, QQ, JJ. Against a range of JJ+, AKo, AKs, QQ is 47%. You have to call 15,000 for a pot of 21,000. This is really only a -cEV call if you put his range on exactly AA, KK, AKs. Throw AKo in there and it becomes marginally +cEV.If he could do this with TT+, AQs+, then it's a clear call, obviouslyI dont think JJ is in his range. It would be an awful play given the action. At best he's looking at racing. Link to post Share on other sites
Briguy 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I dont think JJ is in his range. It would be an awful play given the action. At best he's looking at racing.I'm just telling him what range he can put his opponent on to make this a call. It is a $1 tourney, after all. He's noted that villain is tight/solid/rockish, so maybe he's one of the few people in a $1 against whom calling would be wrong. Link to post Share on other sites
copernicus 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I'm just telling him what range he can put his opponent on to make this a call. It is a $1 tourney, after all. He's noted that villain is tight/solid/rockish, so maybe he's one of the few people in a $1 against whom calling would be wrong.I was talking about his opponents range as well. My answers always assume typical players across a broad range of buyins...talking strategy from the perspective of playing against all awful players is a waste of time, and its not reality from what ive seen. there are always some decent players even in a $1 Link to post Share on other sites
rayovac 0 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Easy fold. No question. You are sitting on an M of roughly 20. Why put 80% of that at risk on a best guess situation. Gotta play small ball poker.One of my tenets of online play is:NEVER GET YOUR STACK IN PF OVER 20BB UNLESS YOU HAVE AA.In reality, that doesn't mean im folding KK here. Im probably playing it. But it generally helps me stay away from resteals or fps. Link to post Share on other sites
Ricer98 0 Posted November 24, 2006 Author Share Posted November 24, 2006 Thanks for the insight guys. I was pretty sure folding was the correct play and the action I chose but just wanted to bounce it off a few others. I seem to have the same problem in every tourney I play where I can only make it so deep and wasn't sure if I had made too tight of a fold where I should be going after a larger stack. I did get away from KK vs QQ unfortunetly the small stack had KK. The villian made a total maniac play with A7s which I think lead me to be suspicious of the big bet after the fact. Good to know I made the right play. Link to post Share on other sites
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