Are Fish Sometimes Tougher Opponents?

[PsiZGuy 0]

I realize the fish are supposed to make you more money because they are making decisions with negative EV and all. And I also understand that is one of the main reasons that sites like PartyPoker are very popular and generally considered more profitable than, say, Full Tilt Poker. However, I think that very same feature makes PartyPoker more difficult for me. You're supposed to try and read a player's hand based on their betting patterns. Well, when I play on PartyPoker, I find that I can't rely on that anymore. If I raised preflop 3-4xBB with AK and someone in late position calls my raise and we see a flop like A75 rainbow and he keeps calling my pot-sized bets, I can't tell if he is just calling me down with AT, if he actually called my preflop raise with A7 or A5 and has me beat, or if he called with something like 86s. This is just an example but I've seen each of the three different types of plays happen with regularity. This isn't a "bad beat" story but I was just curious if anyone else has felt the same "fish are tough" sentiments as I have. Is the answer just to swallow your lumps and rest assured that you will come out ahead in the end? (I'm sure that's the answer I'll get)

[ROGUE06 0]

Sometimes they are since they're unpredictable and some of their moves just don't add up causing you to play bad or misread. Also bluffing is much harder and sometimes out of the question since some fish will call any raise with a middle pair.

[Abbaddabba 0]

No. They're never tough.If they were, they wouldnt be fish.Unpredictable and 'tough' arent the same. I could go all in every hand and you wouldnt be able to predict what i have, but if you couldnt figure out how to beat me, you'd be a moron. If they call you down with anything, you cant predict what they have. But if you cant figure out how to completely rape people who do that, you suck at poker

[ROGUE06 0]

Ok, you're definetly right about everything you said and yes I agree they're never tougher. However, they can be tough or frustrating.

[PsiZGuy 0]

Alright, I agree with what Abbaddabba stated. I do make money off these players so I concur that I should have said that they were tough to read, rather than tough players. However, I also lay down the best hand more often against them and/or continue to bet when I don't realize that I'm beat. I think that because I play frequent short sessions online, even though I come out ahead in the grand scheme, I have more losing sessions dealing with this.

[squirrel barefoot 0]

the only thing that you can predict about fish is that they make mistakes. But they sure are unpredictable in how they play, largely cuz they hardly have a well-planned strategy... What is there to predict then?

[econ_tim 0]

good question.you might also ask:are tougher opponents sometimes fish?are tacos sometimes burritos?

[mrdannyg 274]

i do think the existence of fish can sometimes make tougher games, if you cannot identify them.for instance, if you are playing in two games - in one the opponents are all tough and you know they are all tough.in game two, there is a fish, and you don't know who is who.since you have to play the second game as if the players could be a fish, you may not be able to beat it for as good a rate as the first one.but it shouldn't be too long until you can identify the fish, so then the fish game is better