Dubey 1,035 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 I'd be shocked if they weren't involved. (And I don't think that's a bad thing, standard political maneuvering) The Democratic party has been very silent on this issue so far, and you know it interests them a great deal. Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 i don't think there's any arguing that there is a spike in racist incidents that contain the invocation of trumps name on the side of the racists. For sure! What's typically been "**** you ******" and not been reported is now typically "**** you ******. Go Trump" and being reported. Link to post Share on other sites
Dubey 1,035 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Yeah, Dale, that looks like pure speculation to me. Should we ignore the issue because we don't have "proof" that there's a spike? Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 I'd be shocked if they weren't involved. (And I don't think that's a bad thing, standard political maneuvering) The Democratic party has been very silent on this issue so far, and you know it interests them a great deal. i agree. In fact, it's brilliant politics. Trump was outspoken about rigged elections. Now a third party steps up and says 'us too'. If Hillary does it, he would quickly brand her a sore loser. He can't denounce them.Well. I guess I shouldn't say can't. He can. Probably will. But it looks bad under this circumstance. Link to post Share on other sites
FCP Bob 1,312 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Yeah she has the right. Only candidates can ask for it to happen. Wonder if the dems put her up to it. don't underestimate the fact that Jill Stein is a massive attention seeker and she knows that Obama and the current administration don't want to rock the boat. Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Yeah, Dale, that looks like pure speculation to me. Should we ignore the issue because we don't have "proof" that there's a spike? Pure speculation on your part too. I'm not suggesting we should ignore any issue. Link to post Share on other sites
Dubey 1,035 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Pure speculation on your part too. I'm not suggesting we should ignore any issue. *8 years in the future* Scenario 1: Hmm, looking back, Maybe we were wrong about the increase in racism and hatred. The USA is actually a really peaceful place now. Oh well, glad we were wrong. Scenario 2: Hmm, Looking back, maybe we should have seen the warning signs that were popping up. It all seems so clear in hindsight, a lot of this could have been avoided. If society is going to be "wrong" about this, I know which side we should be wrong on. Skepticism for the sake of skepticism does not do any good. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 *8 years in the future* Scenario 1: Hmm, looking back, Maybe we were wrong about the increase in racism and hatred. The USA is actually a really peaceful place now. Oh well, glad we were wrong. Scenario 2: Hmm, Looking back, maybe we should have seen the warning signs that were popping up. It all seems so clear in hindsight, a lot of this could have been avoided. If society is going to be "wrong" about this, I know which side we should be wrong on. Skepticism for the sake of skepticism does not do any good. Lol Let's go with scenario 2 right now...what warning signs are you referring to? And what can be done about it? It seems like you think there's more racism now than ever before. Link to post Share on other sites
Dubey 1,035 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 No, I think there has been a spike in racism since the election. I think some people feel safer and more emboldened to exhibit racist behaviour as a result of the election. Will it continue, or is it just a temporary spike? I don't know. What can be "done"? Well, we can actively reject and condemn it as a society rather than question whether t really exists for starters. Sure, that's idealistic and not a neat and tidy answer with a checklist of action items to complete, but the more we accept the behaviour as normal or deny that the behaviour exists, the more it will continue to exist and thrive. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 *8 years in the future* Scenario 1: Hmm, looking back, Maybe we were wrong about the increase in racism and hatred. The USA is actually a really peaceful place now. Oh well, glad we were wrong. Scenario 2: Hmm, Looking back, maybe we should have seen the warning signs that were popping up. It all seems so clear in hindsight, a lot of this could have been avoided. If society is going to be "wrong" about this, I know which side we should be wrong on. Skepticism for the sake of skepticism does not do any good. Reminds me of this: 1 Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 No, I think there has been a spike in racism since the election. I think some people feel safer and more emboldened to exhibit racist behaviour as a result of the election. Will it continue, or is it just a temporary spike? I don't know. What can be "done"? Well, we can actively reject and condemn it as a society rather than question whether t really exists for starters. Sure, that's idealistic and not a neat and tidy answer with a checklist of action items to complete, but the more we accept the behaviour as normal or deny that the behaviour exists, the more it will continue to exist and thrive. Who is questioning if racism exists? Sure, the majority of white people think racism is less of a problem than the majority of black people, but there are people who think it doesn't exist? <insert cartoon of people talking about the problem instead of the solution while the problem gets bigger> Link to post Share on other sites
Dubey 1,035 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Dale, I'm not going to get into semantics. I wasn't suggesting that people think racism doesn't exist, but I think you know that and are just being difficult. I understand you pride yourself on being impartial and playing the Devil's advocate, but what point are you trying to prove right now, other than just being contrarian and skeptical for its own sake? Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 Dale, I'm not going to get into semantics. I wasn't suggesting that people think racism doesn't exist, but I think you know that and are just being difficult. I understand you pride yourself on being impartial and playing the Devil's advocate, but what point are you trying to prove right now, other than just being contrarian and skeptical for its own sake? I'm not trying to be difficult at all. My point is... - this election didn't create racists overnight. They've always been there. - I'm not sure if the number of racist incidents has spiked or if it's just because it's getting more coverage. Someone painted swastikas and Trump's name at a park and it's all over the news. Do you think swastikas haven't shown up at parks before this? - you minimize the possible impact of people voting for Obama based solely on his skin colour because it wasn't a significant number in your opinion yet 200 neo-nazis have a meeting and it's a problem for you. Newsflash: these people have been holding these meetings long before this election in all 50 states. Bonus "conspiracy theory" point... - "They" like that racism exists because it divides people and people are easier to control and less of a threat when they are divided. Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 I'm not trying to be difficult at all. My point is... - this election didn't create racists overnight. They've always been there. - I'm not sure if the number of racist incidents has spiked or if it's just because it's getting more coverage. Someone painted swastikas and Trump's name at a park and it's all over the news. Do you think swastikas haven't shown up at parks before this? - you minimize the possible impact of people voting for Obama based solely on his skin colour because it wasn't a significant number in your opinion yet 200 neo-nazis have a meeting and it's a problem for you. Newsflash: these people have been holding these meetings long before this election in all 50 states. Bonus "conspiracy theory" point... - "They" like that racism exists because it divides people and people are easier to control and less of a threat when they are divided. I'm not trying to be difficult at all. My point is... - this election didn't create racists overnight. They've always been there. - I'm not sure if the number of racist incidents has spiked or if it's just because it's getting more coverage. Someone painted swastikas and Trump's name at a park and it's all over the news. Do you think swastikas haven't shown up at parks before this? - you minimize the possible impact of people voting for Obama based solely on his skin colour because it wasn't a significant number in your opinion yet 200 neo-nazis have a meeting and it's a problem for you. Newsflash: these people have been holding these meetings long before this election in all 50 states. Bonus "conspiracy theory" point... - "They" like that racism exists because it divides people and people are easier to control and less of a threat when they are divided. are the people voting for Obama strictly because of his skin colour holding rallies to propogate hatred? One of those two things is newsworthy. Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 23, 2016 Share Posted November 23, 2016 are the people voting for Obama strictly because of his skin colour holding rallies to propogate hatred? One of those two things is newsworthy. Depends...are any of them members of The Israelite Church of God in Jesus Christ or The Nation of Yahweh or The United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors or any other group that believes black people are superior to white people? In 2015, 180 black separatist hate groups were identified. "Black separatism is a movement which historically sought to create separate institutions for black people, mostly of African descent, in societies historically dominated by whites. Some also have traditionally sought out a separate homeland. Some black nationalist groups, most notably the Nation of Islam and the New Black Panther Party, seek less to create their own land than to co-opt existing power structures, they have preached hatred of white people and support or condone violent actions by its core constituencies." Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_organizations_designated_by_the_Southern_Poverty_Law_Center_as_hate_groups Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Depends...are any of them members of The Israelite Church of God in Jesus Christ or The Nation of Yahweh or The United Nuwaubian Nation of Moors or any other group that believes black people are superior to white people? In 2015, 180 black separatist hate groups were identified. "Black separatism is a movement which historically sought to create separate institutions for black people, mostly of African descent, in societies historically dominated by whites. Some also have traditionally sought out a separate homeland. Some black nationalist groups, most notably the Nation of Islam and the New Black Panther Party, seek less to create their own land than to co-opt existing power structures, they have preached hatred of white people and support or condone violent actions by its core constituencies." Source: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_organizations_designated_by_the_Southern_Poverty_Law_Center_as_hate_groups yup, oppress a people and enslave them and you'll create hate for sure. What's the nazi excuse? Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 yup, oppress a people and enslave them and you'll create hate for sure. What's the nazi excuse? You realize black people don't hold exclusive rights to oppression and slavery, right? Also...something you don't see or hear about very often...there were a significant number of black people who owned slaves. Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 You realize black people don't hold exclusive rights to oppression and slavery, right? Also...something you don't see or hear about very often...there were a significant number of black people who owned slaves. in the United States they do. That's what we were talking about, wasn't it? Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Hate on the Rise After Trump’s Election http://www.newyorker...trumps-election Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 in the United States they do. That's what we were talking about, wasn't it? In the United States 1.4% of white people owned slaves. If you do the research you'll discover the statistics show that free black people disproportionately became slave masters. Link to post Share on other sites
MapleLeafpoker 1,462 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 In the United States 1.4% of white people owned slaves. If you do the research you'll discover the statistics show that free black people disproportionately became slave masters. You realize black people don't hold exclusive rights to oppression and slavery, right? Also...something you don't see or hear about very often...there were a significant number of black people who owned slaves. I'm confused, whats your point here? so who else was oppressed and were forced into slavery in the US? Link to post Share on other sites
gruven 530 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 In the United States 1.4% of white people owned slaves. If you do the research you'll discover the statistics show that free black people disproportionately became slave masters. and why was that? Because power and wealth was symbolized by owning slaves and plantation work? So any slave who was emancipated would have what other option to pursue? Especially considering that, if you do some research, emancipation was often accompanied by a deed of land and some slaves to work it. I appreciate your debates, dale, but sometimes they're very disengenious. Which, of course, you'll respond to by asking why. Lol Link to post Share on other sites
Dubey 1,035 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Oh Dale. What are you trying to do here.... Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 There are 420 reasons why I should probably wait before responding but **** it... There were white slaves in the US. Mostly Irish, but some European (and homeless/poor) white people were enslaved before the Transatlantic/African slave trade. This was preTwitter so you don't hear much about it. These slaves were cheaper than the African slaves. They weren't endentured. They were slaves. Every so-called race has been enslaved at one time or another. Anyway... Races don't exist. We are all the same species, Homo sapiens...the human race. "Pure races, in the sense of genetically homogenous populations, do not exist in the human species today, nor is there any evidence that they have ever existed in the past. There are obvious physical differences between populations living in different geographic areas of the world." Source Today's basic concept of race goes back to the 1600s when some French guy came up with Europeans, Far Easterners, Negroes, and Lapps. Things evolved from there. Race is just another tool to create division. It is advantageous to the powers that be to have people fighting amongst themselves about something that doesn't exist rather than banding together and focusing on the real problem. Genetics says we all share a common descent...yet some people with one colour skin think they're superior to the people with a different colour skin? It's ****ing ridiculous. Slavery wasn't about race. It was about economics. Just like it is today. I'm checking scores and going to bed. Link to post Share on other sites
digitalmonkey 929 Posted November 24, 2016 Share Posted November 24, 2016 Oh I meant to add... Everything I said could be bullshit. Could all be true though. Who's to say, really? Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now