Rake Vs. Low Stakes

[JoeyFinngars 0]

In a thread earlier this week FCPBob mentioned the lower stakes are not usually profitable due to the high rake and I was wondering at which point do the lower stakes become profitable.How would I calculate which stakes are worth playing and which are best to avoid based on the rake?

[Suited_Up 2]

I wouldn't say unprofitable, but it also depends on the game.If you're playing HU, 25 and 50nl is just brutal rake wise. But 6m or FR, I think you're ok at those levels. I think the 5nl games on FTP are pretty bad rake wise. He plays limit though, so he could've meant limit games, which I don't know as much about.

[JoeyFinngars 0]

I wouldn't say unprofitable, but it also depends on the game.If you're playing HU, 25 and 50nl is just brutal rake wise. But 6m or FR, I think you're ok at those levels. I think the 5nl games on FTP are pretty bad rake wise. He plays limit though, so he could've meant limit games, which I don't know as much about.

I primarily play $10 Full Ring and some 6 max at the moment and was just curious about the rake.

[FARGOpokerND 22]

I primarily play $10 Full Ring and some 6 max at the moment and was just curious about the rake.

Generally what I hear is 10nl is just bad for rake. 25nl is where it gets better. I don't know the exact rates, but I believe this is generally what people say.

[FCP Bob 1,312]

This might be a good place for people to post the amount of rake that they've paid.For limit holdem the amount of rake can vary greatly from site to site. Below I've posted the rake that I've experienced for 4 to 6 handed play for Limit Holdem.The more hands that the rake is maximized and you win extra money without the house getting some of it the better.Poker Stars5/10 - 24 cents per hand = 2.4 BB/10010/20 - 33.2 cents per hand = 1.66 BB/100Party Poker5/10 - 32.3 cents per hand = 3.23 BB/10010/20 - 36 cents per hand = 1.8 BB/100On Game5/10 - 36.6 cents per hand = 3.66 BB/10010/20 - 41 cents per hand = 2.05 BB/10025/50 - 41.6 cents per hand = 0.83 BB/100

[FARGOpokerND 22]

Rake paid for FTP(All NL)$0.1/$0.25 (25nl) - 2.34 cents/hand (4.68BB/100)$0.25/$0.50 (50nl) - 4.65 cents/hand (4.65BB/100)$0.50/$1 (100nl) - 7.35 cents/hand (3.67BB/100)

[FCP Bob 1,312]

Please nobody else make any posts in this thread like the one that I just deleted that are requesting people click on your rakeback links.Yes having rakeback or being part of a VIP program is a very good thing for a player.

[Suited_Up 2]

Please nobody else make any posts in this thread like the one that I just deleted that are requesting people click on your rakeback links.Yes having rakeback or being part of a VIP program is a very good thing for a player.

It never saw the post, but I just want to clarify it wasn't me, cause I know that's what everyone is thinking.

[CrookedLink 0]

It never saw the post, but I just want to clarify it wasn't me, cause I know that's what everyone is thinking.

I sure was.

[fighter 4]

This might be a good place for people to post the amount of rake that they've paid.For limit holdem the amount of rake can vary greatly from site to site. Below I've posted the rake that I've experienced for 4 to 6 handed play for Limit Holdem.The more hands that the rake is maximized and you win extra money without the house getting some of it the better.Poker Stars5/10 - 24 cents per hand = 2.4 BB/10010/20 - 33.2 cents per hand = 1.66 BB/100Party Poker5/10 - 32.3 cents per hand = 3.23 BB/10010/20 - 36 cents per hand = 1.8 BB/100On Game5/10 - 36.6 cents per hand = 3.66 BB/10010/20 - 41 cents per hand = 2.05 BB/10025/50 - 41.6 cents per hand = 0.83 BB/100

now if you consider how good of a player you need( or bad your opponents have to be) to be to constantly be clearing 5BB/100 you will see bob's point

[Merby 3]

Here's my rake stats all at HU NL on Tilt:NL($0.50) HU: ... $5.83/100 hands = 11.66 bb per 100 hands over 25k handsNL($1) HU: ...... $7.02/100 hands = 7.02 bb per 100 hands over 31k handsSo yeah... Rake is a killer at the lowest levels of HU NL.

[noflukeluke 0]

According to PT3, for PokerStars full ring limit:All rake taken off of the table:Limit........Hands.....Rake...........$ of Rake / 100 Hands$3/6........2,383......$1884.50.....$79.08$2/4.........23,099....$12,057.50.$52.20$1/2.........30,386....$9,809.25...$32.28$0.50/1.....8,815.....$1,913.80....$21.71$.25/.50....4,551.....$590.00......$12.96The default buy-in is 20xBB when you sit at full ring, so they are basically raking off 65-75% of a buy in every 100 hands at $1/2 - $3/6 and 100%+ at lower than $1/2 (assuming my calculations are correct).Rake I have paid:Limit.......Hands.....Rake..........$ of Rake / 100 Hands...% of 20xBB buy in$3/6........2,383.......$271.00....$11.37.........................9.5%$2/4........23,099.....$1,293.00..$5.60..........................7.0%$1/2 .......30,386.....$1,134.00..$3.73..........................9.3%$0.50/1....8,815......$214.30.....$2.43..........................12.1%$.25/.50...4,551......$65.20.......$1.43..........................14.3%It is sad to see when the amount of rake I have paid to pokerstars is 3x what I have won at the tables. Those asses at full tilt won't give me rakeback either or maybe I would move to make up the difference.Is there any magical value to tell if you are beating a game and the rake? I hear everyone throw around BB/100, is that the best way to find out? I went 4.64 BB/100 in .25/.50, 2.59 in .5/1, 1.24 in 1/2, -.49 in 2/4 because of a recent horrid downswing, and 2.89 in 3/6. I just use standard bankroll management to figure out when to move up, and I grind each limit until I build enough. This recent $2/4 trouble has got me down.The guy who said you had to make 5 BB / 100 has me scared.....