nutschamp 0 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 --------------------------------------------------------------------------------Have only been at the table for 12 hands but have seen MP1 raise a few times with no challengers. The SB just calling was obv weird considering its almost half his stack (maybe about to attempt stop n go despite it probably being a bad spot for him given stacks). Is shoving an option here given that we have FE vs. the original raiser and could likely be racing vs the SB? Any thoughts?Full Tilt Poker, NL Hold'em Tournament, 120/240 Blinds, 25 Ante, 8 PlayersLeggoPoker.com - Hand History ConverterBTN: 3,340SB: 2,932Hero (BB): 6,795UTG: 5,877UTG+1: 8,060MP1: 9,019MP2: 4,595CO: 14,725Pre-Flop: (560) 8 8 dealt to Hero (BB)2 folds, MP1 raises to 1,040, 3 folds, SB calls 920, Hero...? Link to post Share on other sites
craiger 0 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Against a raise and a call, this is a clear fold IMO...SB is almost committed, and MP1 has you covered which puts you at risk. You have a marginal hand in this situation. Find a better spot. Link to post Share on other sites
HighwayStar 8 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Fold. You know the SB is going in, and you are almost certainly at best racing with him. Not worth the risk with the possibility that MP1 also has a hand. Considering he raised 4+x (Which for the record is a terrible raise) he could well. If you shove you will often end up with in showdown against 4 overcards, which is not a good spot. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Apparently, a flat call is a waste of chips and shoving will get you called by a better hand. SB is almost certainly shoving the flop and I'll bet MP1 has TT, JJ or AK, if not better, and is lying in wait. But what if you do flat call and fold to a bad flop? 4 to 1 to see 3 more cards, you still have about 6K left even if you fold and you are last to act preflop? Call me stupid, but I gamble on seeing a flop and hitting big. A flatcall may confuse the big stack and you will probably get the isolation you want when SB shoves the flop and you come over the top. Hell, if you're beat because MP1 really does have a premium pair, then boohoo. If no A or K on the flop, I'm coming over top of the SB push. Link to post Share on other sites
Sheiky 0 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Apparently, a flat call is a waste of chips and shoving will get you called by a better hand. SB is almost certainly shoving the flop and I'll bet MP1 has TT, JJ or AK, if not better, and is lying in wait. But what if you do flat call and fold to a bad flop? 4 to 1 to see 3 more cards, you still have about 6K left even if you fold and you are last to act preflop? Call me stupid, but I gamble on seeing a flop and hitting big. A flatcall may confuse the big stack and you will probably get the isolation you want when SB shoves the flop and you come over the top. Hell, if you're beat because MP1 really does have a premium pair, then boohoo. If no A or K on the flop, I'm coming over top of the SB push.The chances of you hitting anything on the flop are 1 in 8, there's no gambling about it, we know exactly how often we will hit and how often we won't, we're not playing roulette here. Link to post Share on other sites
TravisG 0 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Apparently, a flat call is a waste of chips and shoving will get you called by a better hand. SB is almost certainly shoving the flop and I'll bet MP1 has TT, JJ or AK, if not better, and is lying in wait. But what if you do flat call and fold to a bad flop? 4 to 1 to see 3 more cards, you still have about 6K left even if you fold and you are last to act preflop? Call me stupid, but I gamble on seeing a flop and hitting big. A flatcall may confuse the big stack and you will probably get the isolation you want when SB shoves the flop and you come over the top. Hell, if you're beat because MP1 really does have a premium pair, then boohoo. If no A or K on the flop, I'm coming over top of the SB push.i bet not. he's stealing most of the time here. op already labeled him as agressive (raising a few times within 12 hands = big rush of hands or most of the times just agressive chips accumulation). you see that very often, esp in low stakes tournaments, that people just raise big from mp+ to get the blinds and antes. i do it alot too sometimes, esp. if i built up a tight table image. just because if you're at a weak table, you will win more chips than you lose. with a raise of roughly 4.5bb you only have to win the blinds an antes 2 times before getting a call to break even. on a tight (probably weak too, considering nobodys challenging him) table, that should work quite well. i know with an m of about 17, he is in no need to steal with air yet, but he saw that nobody fights him if he wants to steal so why give up on free chips? but all in all, i could just assume too much with too less information.its a fold anyways, the sb caller should worry you. wait for better spots. Link to post Share on other sites
Mercury69 3 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 The chances of you hitting anything on the flop are 1 in 8, there's no gambling about it, we know exactly how often we will hit and how often we won't, we're not playing roulette here.Well, what if you've folded your last 7 PP's? What then???j/kThanks, Sheiky and Travis, for your comments. I am a better player for it. Link to post Share on other sites
Sheiky 0 Posted January 9, 2008 Share Posted January 9, 2008 Well, what if you've folded your last 7 PP's? What then???j/kThanks, Sheiky and Travis, for your comments. I am a better player for it.Hahaha, that made me lol. Link to post Share on other sites
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