do proven players ever intenionally give bad advice?

[TGUNS42 0]

Hey guys, Avid follower of all the forums especially DN's and wptfan.com. Just wondering if anyone ever wondered if the big guns ever mislead the general poker public as to how to play. Obviously not our boy DN b/c he shares everything from the genuinely embarrassing to the prideful and excuses, without really putting on a PR filter, which we are all very thankful for. I don't think any pro would ever reveal EVERY specific advantage they exploit, but isn't it naiive to believe that all the top pros advice is as wholehearted and genuine as DN's? Sure they might not be bashed by some of their peers, but if they have the household name/reputation they can probably throw off their potential opponents/readers by misdirecting them. I am not saying that this is my sweeping generalization, just thinking through my laptop lol. Perhaps, if the author/player writes a book taht the masses follow(ed) like a Super System I they will already have developed a counter strategy for revealing their own strategy? Where does the level of abstraction end lol?Tom M.

[TGUNS42 0]

whoops, i meant "sure they might BE bashed by some of their peers"

[Boothy 0]

I recall hearing Doyle Brunson saying (can't think where) he had to amend his playing style after SS came out because he had given his game away. So it can definately be a serious problem for players.Kinda like a comedian having to come up with a whole new show after their live DVD has topped the charts for Months.

[JimmyWellington 1]

The cynic in me would not be surprised. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if people on here tried to mislead other people to gain an advantage in the Negreanu Open. :naughty: Of course like I said. I'm very cynical.

[JeremyG 0]

I think it would be too risky to mislead. FIrst of all there's the person's reputation. Secondly there's SOOO much communication in the poker community now (online, etc.) that if it was an unsound piece of advice, they'd be ridiculed.I'm interested on how DN's play changes after he releases this book and DVD series that he's promising...

[KenP 0]

Come on people...get real...We all lie to a degree almost every time we speak. You aren't going to say to me "Hey, dumbasz" anywhere but in someplace like an anonymous poker forum. Especially, if you noticed that I'm 6'5" and about 250. We all conceal information--even when it isn't our intent. We also do things to be courteous or because we think the guy can punch our lights out if we say what we are thinking.And, if someone thinks that TJ changed his game that much or that DN will have to because we can all play like him after reading his book--share your brand of firewater with me.We'll all probably rush to buy his book. And most of us will improve our game as a result. But, we'll still make most of the same mistakes and stay pretty much at the same level we are at. Today, every hand we see him play on TV shows us the cards he's playing. How much more can he "give away" to us or his competition?

[KDawgCometh 2]

I think that it goes without saying that a pro won't give away every trick that they have in a book, and even if they do do you really think that it would be any eaiser playing against them. This is my one beef with Seidel whining about the hole card cams

[CardKillah 0]

I think the advantages/disadvantages of giving advice are always two fold. In giving "good" advice, i.e. to suggest to the player ways on to improve their game can come back in the form of learning from that persons playing. Even "bad," players have certain qualities that embody them that another player may not. He maybe better at bluffing,but, when it comes to calculating odds or making certain calls, he could be lacking. Their's always that possibility helping others can come back to you..Of course, on the flip side, in giving them information, you're increasing the competition against you. In a game where virtually the only important thing is winning and/or coming into the money, improving others play could definitely come back to haunt you. Their have been many times when I've strongly encouraged bad plays, without being generally sarcastic; e.g. "That was an interesting call, I hadn't thought of a play like that. It definitely seems to work for you." or, something along that lines. I firmly believe that if a player is interested in improving their play and consistently improving leaks in their game, all advice they get from other players should be taken with a grain of salt, and they should thoroughly analyzing everything. It would definitely be interesting to hear from certain players if they do this on a consistent basis, or not....

[TeeDot 0]

All the TV viewers and readers of poker columns are getting a lot of free lessons on how key hands get played out. Books can make you a better player but it will never teach you to play the author's game.Too many situations are "it depends" that can not be captured into a paragraph or a chapter. You get a general guidline to play but the real core of your game is developed through experience. You might learn some lessons faster or avoid mistakes altogether because the author gave you the answer before the situation came up.No WCP is going to be 'figured out' because you've read his poker strategies and philosophies in a book.

[rog 0]

Just because someone explains how to do what they do doesn't mean just anyone can pick it up and run with it. I would expect when Daniel's book comes out, that: A) He'll make a lot of money off of it. B) The secrets he reveals are things he does better than pretty much everybody else (and that's not going to change just because they're published).C) The people with the talent to exploit Daniel's secrets have probably played against him for years now. They've seen how he plays, and have exploited that to largest extent they are capable of already.These books are not targeted at the elite poker player. Sure it may help someone develop into a WSOP quality player, only if that person already has enough talent and/or committment. Mostly I see them asbeing targeted at someone who wants to find an edge in a mid-level game. Can Daniel teach me how to read like he does? Of course not. I dont have his judgement. In time I may develop it, but right now, he can give me all his secrets, I can read and understand them, but I wont be able to play like him.Rog

[Spidurman 0]

When I try to give advice, I try to couch it in theoretical terms and what I learned from books - the 'basics'. I won't give out the good stuff - the plays I've developed the hard way.Most books tend to do the same - with the notable exception of doyle in SS1. All a book should do is teach the technical play of the game - the adaptive feel is only learned the old fashioned way - thousands of hands.

[Pokerghost2 0]

Ok i hope my post doesnt ruffle any feathers cuz im new here. The biggest advantage the pro has in any tourn over the avg guy or novice aside from the fact that hes better, lol, is the intimidation factor. Believe me u wont read this in any poker book, but those guys realise that u know who they r. They realise that the price of admission prolly hurt u worse than them, and they realise that u want to last awhile. The advantage here is huge early on. They run u over again and again holding nothing and build monstrous stacks holding nothing. All u will see in most tourn books is be conservative, dont take any risks, survive. Does that remind u of how negreanu plays? I think not . My advice is if u think u have the best hand against a name player and u fold it then why did u enter the tourn to begin with? Just my 2 cents.

[JistTheFist 0]

well... the things that some of these pros are trying to give away take a little bit of hard work... and a LOT of natural talent... I mean seriously. I have NEVER in my life seen anyone play 4 7 better than danny... and I don't care how many chapters you write... how many hours on a dvd he tries teaching you... you WILL NOT be able to make the kinds of plays that he does with cards like those without a natural ability... that's why I don't there's really anything to give away... he might teach you some great basic strategy for limit hold 'em or some great basic knowledge for any poker game... but it takes a person's natural skill and aptitude to blend that with their own style of play to become truly great. you can't copy another person's technique and be greatly succesful. you have to have your own unique spin on everything... that's what makes players like danny, gus hansen, men nyugen, and sammy farha so intimidating... they all have a VAST knowledge of the game and how it is played... but they have a VERY different style that makes them harder to play against. that's just my view on it... you can inform the masses about poker, but don't teach them how to play.

[Scott31 0]

If you don't think pros would intentionally give bad poker advice, then how do you explain Hellmuth's "Play Poker Like the Pros." :-) That piece of crap proves a conspiracy.