running into tough marginal calls in nl...

[PhishForChips 0]

I have been running into a ton of marginal situations lately where I am getting outkicked or a higher flush is beating me.Its affecting my confidence to call re-raises. For example, a hand will see everyone limp. I'll have K/J and the flop will come4 J 9 and I'll raise it and get re-raised only to lose to K/Q.Or I'll hit a flush J high and get beat by the Q high. any advice here?

[custom36 4]

Advice: If this is really bothering you, stop playing poker.

[pokernoobie 0]

didnt realize people played KJ in NL.....

[justin 0]

if you don't limp with KJ you're probably playing too tight ;[edit: however, i certainly reraise a smallish bet with TPTK if i have position, but would never call a check raise or a reraise from late position with the same hand. that hand is not something you simply call with, it's either raise bet or fold, imo.

[pokernoobie 0]

if u play KJo in NL cash games then your probably an idiot and i highly suggest you stop it :)Edit: btw phish do u mean the board is 4 K X? cuz if 4 j X then losing to KQ is just bad luck

[custom36 4]

if u play KJo in NL cash games then your probably an idiot and i highly suggest you stop it

Uhh....no. KJ is fine to play in CO or later. Only limp with it, but you can play it. NL hold'em is the game I'm best at and I've made considerable amounts of money with KJ. You're definately not stupid for playing it.

[rwood 0]

there's nothing wrong with playing KJ if you play it correctly, just dont get married to your pairs...my impression is if you want to be great, you have to be able to play every hand optimally, ovbiously not calling big raises with KJ and AJ and such, but just saying that, if you're not playing KJ, then you are handicapping yourself, because you are not able to learn from that certain situation. remember something from a hand years ago sometimes helps you when you are facing a huge bet or decision for all your chips. phish, for your situations, thats poker, but also, although some of the outcomes arent happy ones, and if you are trying to get better at your game, you're learning from every one of those situations, watching how the other players played, and taking away something positive and new from every hand, no matter what happens. just my outlook...

[pokernoobie 0]

my view is KJ is a hard hand to get away from and it ends up losing u money like phish has experienced, and if u do get away from it u start to think about it like "did i make the right lay down?" and it just drives you insane and the next time u get it u call. so i just lay it down on anything but button dont think ive said that b4.

[flyingmoose 0]

You could probably fold KJo every time you got it in a deep stacked, 10-handed cash game and not be much worse off for it. You will almost never see a flop where you're comfortable getting all the chips in with it. If you're an experience player then you're losing equity by putting any hand on your "don't play" list. To OP: If you're often getting outkicked, you have a serious leak in your no limit cash game play. Top pair top kicker should be at the very bottom of the hands you're willing to go all-in with. If you have >70BB in your stack, it shouldn't even be on the list unless you have a strong read on your opponent. Top pair middle-weak kicker is not a hand you should be going in with unless you have shallow stacks -- a situation that should only come up in tournament play..

[Guest]

I have been running into a ton of marginal situations lately where I am getting outkicked or a higher flush is beating me.Its affecting my confidence to call re-raises.  For example, a hand will see everyone limp.  I'll have  K/J and the flop will come4  J  9  and I'll raise it and get re-raised only to lose to K/Q.Or I'll hit a flush J high and get beat by the Q high.  any advice here?

Quick questtion, if the flop comes 4J9 and you hold KJ, how do you lose? If a Queen falls, you might want to slow down, because a lot of people do limp with KQ, QJ, so there's no point to keep betting if someone is calling. Unless you have fish who think J2 is a great hand and don't believe they are beat. You have to look at what your opponent is calling with. Sometimes you just have to realize you are beat.Just because you have Jx suited or Qx suited doesn't mean you have to play them (thats what the fold button is for). If you can limp from the button with one of these hands, I say go for it (in the right situations), but definately don't be calling raises with it. Also, if hit your flush, you are always worried about someone having a higher flush or trying to draw to the nut flush if they have Ax. So, in a nutshell, if you hit the flush bet but if you get meet with resistance, you might want to try and check it down for a showdown.As for playing KJ, don't do it. Unless you can limp from the CO or button, this hand is dominated to easily. If you feel you have to play it, try and come in for a raise with it but only from MP and even then be leary of a flop that hits you. IMO, this hand is a money loser. Looks nice, but needs the perfect flop to be profitable.I don't know what NL level(s) you play, but I've been fairly successful at the .25/.50 level playing like this. I see to many times people betting hard with KJ, only to get slapped with someone else holding KQ (another hand I'm not that big a fan of, but don't get me started on that).Take a look at your EV with KJ at a full table :

                  KJ              KJsSB           -0.08           0.17BB           -0.16           0.123             -0.02           0.154             -0.02           0.285             -0.03           0.326             -0.04           0.227              0.05           0.238              0.01           0.289              0.08           0.28D              0.06           0.40

or just check out http://teamfu.freeshell.org/poker_hands/ev...v_position.html