DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Hey.How's it going?I'd like to get some more higher limit NL hand histories in the Strat Forum. I don't think we've seen a whole lot higher than 2/5 NL lately, and I think it'd make for some interesting discussion and comparisons. Basically, I'm getting tired of going back and forth from 2+2 to here. We've got a good foundation in the NLHE Strat forum and I'd really like to start expanding. So, help me out.I know there's a few of you out there who play 5/10 NL or better. I have on a several times, but not enough to make for any exceptionally interesting hands. I know that Mr. Jones plays higher stakes NL on PR, Alf may, the guy who plays high limit at Commerce whose name I'm forgetting does, I believe. I know Allinbluff was playing 1k NL for awhile, not sure if he still does. Steve, do you? I asked Daniel to post some from his 50/100 NL on FCP today, but I'm still waiting.Anything from 5/10, to 10/20, to 25/50 to 50/100 would be outstanding. I know there's some of you out there. Please just post hand histories, thoughts, reads whatever. If anyone happens to watch the higher stakes games on UB or Stars or whatever, and can capture hand histories they find interesting, that'd be neat too. We're not just looking for big pots, but odd, interesting, solid, and wild plays. It's getting a bit stale and I think we could learn a lot from the play at higher levels. So, please, help me out. Don't worry about people knowing your screen name or whatever, just change it, or use the hand converter. I know that most of you aren't going to learn anything from the analysis, but, it'd be more than helpful to those of us who were discussing it. Thanks again.--Erik**And don't move this thread to NLHE Strat, please. I'm trying to bring more people in, not talk to the people I see post every day. Link to post Share on other sites
sirphatticus 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 so you're not leaving?haha i love this forum... Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 so you're not leaving?haha i love this forum...Apparently, you missed the part where I said I was leaving the forum to go to the gas station. Don't post in this thread if you're not going to offer anything helpful, chucklefuck. Link to post Share on other sites
KDawgCometh 2 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 i support this thread and give it my seal of approval Link to post Share on other sites
Jelly-Filled Ace 1 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 so you're not leaving?haha i love this forum...Apparently, you missed the part where I said I was leaving the forum to go to the gas station. Don't post in this thread if you're not going to offer anything helpful, chucklefuck.lol chucklefuck. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 i support this thread and give it my seal of approvalThanks KDawg.I know you're in pretty well with a lot of the 2+2ers. You think any of them would be willing to post some hands over here for us Pleebs? I know Kane posts over there, and FoxwoodsFiend, and I dig their advice and thoughts. Just wondering if you might know any you could get to swing by our little corner. Link to post Share on other sites
KTW 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Not sure exactly what you want posted so you can't complain but I have a few and will post in a few. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 Not sure exactly what you want posted so you can't complain but I have a few and will post in a few.Any hands, really. Just post them and tell us your thought process.That'd be awesome, man. Much appreciated--seriously. Link to post Share on other sites
steve7stud 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I wish that I could help you out. I've played online nlhe a few times and really didn't like it. 25-50 on UB, and Party's 2k. I managed to book small wins in each session. But I certainly wasn't comfortable playing no limit online. For better or worse, I'm not a math guy. A lot of my no limit game is based on tells. When I'm sitting at the table with a player, I can get a much better "feel" for the situation. Limit poker I find translates much better online.Here is a perfect example. Often times when I played in a no limit game at Commerce with a deep stack, the following would happen. Another player and I would get all the money into the middle on the flop or the turn. To reduce variance, we would "run it, once, twice, or three times". This isn't something that you can do online. If you look in the strat section, I did talk about sessions of no limit that I've played with Daniel and Phil Laak. I've also played with a ton of other players like Allen Cunningham, Stan Goldstein, Billy Duarte, "Booby" Bellande, etc (the list would be fairly extensive.)If you haven't read the thread already, don't ever try and play Jacks against Daniel when he has q7. It's an easy way to go bust, lol.Sorry I couldn't be of more help. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 I wish that I could help you out. I've played online nlhe a few times and really didn't like it. 25-50 on UB, and Party's 2k. I managed to book small wins in each session. But I certainly wasn't comfortable playing no limit online. For better or worse, I'm not a math guy. A lot of my no limit game is based on tells. When I'm sitting at the table with a player, I can get a much better "feel" for the situation. Limit poker I find translates much better online.Here is a perfect example. Often times when I played in a no limit game at Commerce with a deep stack, the following would happen. Another player and I would get all the money into the middle on the flop or the turn. To reduce variance, we would "run it, once, twice, or three times". This isn't something that you can do online. If you look in the strat section, I did talk about sessions of no limit that I've played with Daniel and Phil Laak. I've also played with a ton of other players like Allen Cunningham, Stan Goldstein, Billy Duarte, "Booby" Bellande, etc (the list would be fairly extensive.)If you haven't read the thread already, don't ever try and play Jacks against Daniel when he has q7. It's an easy way to go bust, lol.Sorry I couldn't be of more help.Steve, I'm looking for live play too. That's all I play is live, really. When you do happen to play some live NL, would ya consider posting a hand from time to time though? I'd really appreciate it and I know the other guys would. Seeing inside the mind of someone at thatlevel is rather interesting to me. Link to post Share on other sites
theredpill99 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I think beating the 5/10 NL game is more about being comfortable with the money being bet than knowing the strategy. I could probably beat 5/10 NL if I was given 3 months and a good bankroll. The money scares me, though. The money scares me and my heart rate just increases too fast for me to think clearly and I just don't enjoy the feeling of what they call a "rush".At that level it is more about winning pots that you aren't supposed to win because your opponents are also going to try to win pots that they aren't supposed to win so you have to even that out. Link to post Share on other sites
KTW 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Oops. They are not hands that I played. Sorry. I will try and dig up some of my old hands. No promises. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 I think beating the 5/10 NL game is more about being comfortable with the money being bet than knowing the strategy. I could probably beat 5/10 NL if I was given 3 months and a good bankroll. The money scares me, though. The money scares me and my heart rate just increases too fast for me to think clearly and I just don't enjoy the feeling of what they call a "rush".If you're insinuating that the level of skill, strategy and thought process doesn't jump dramatically from 2/5 NL to 5/10, you've huffed a little too much paint thinner in your time. If the money scares you, you shouldn't be playing out of your bankroll. Link to post Share on other sites
steve7stud 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Here's one. It's from a while ago.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...4466&highlight= Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 Here's one. It's from a while ago.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...&highlight= I hope you don't mind answering a couple questions I have, about that play, do you?I'm gonna ask them/bump that thread. Link to post Share on other sites
sirphatticus 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 i would contribute, but as i may have stated before somewhere on the forum i have very little online experience, much more live experience...the vast majority of the strat section focuses on online play, and most would agree. maybe the limits are not the problems, maybe it is the repetition. and repetition from the people posting questions means repetition from the people answering. there is no real solution to repetition, as the majority of people will not search. another problem is consistency. the same hand can be played numerous ways. in live play, reads and labelling play a huge role, and online betting patterns are easier to follow and give more information away. for discussion sake, why not discuss the same hands from a third point perspective? liveatthebike shows 10-20 and sometimes 50-100 NL cash games... keep it on mute, start a thread, discuss EVERY hand... unrealistic? for sure... but possible.new blood would be better than higher limit players. and not only new blood, but new opinions and open mindedness... there is a million ways to play a hand of poker.as an end note, i just want to say strat’s a good forum, check out my prior posts before you call me a chuckle****, poopoo mcmuffin.edit: as far as live play goes, drawingdead, since you play mostly live, you think there is a DRAMATIC increase or fluctuation in skill, knowledge, etc. when switching from 3-5 to 5-10 NL? as far as live go, i would definatley say they are almost identical, at least at the "tiny" casinos i play at... Link to post Share on other sites
pwoblo 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I think beating the 5/10 NL game is more about being comfortable with the money being bet than knowing the strategy. I could probably beat 5/10 NL if I was given 3 months and a good bankroll. The money scares me, though. The money scares me and my heart rate just increases too fast for me to think clearly and I just don't enjoy the feeling of what they call a "rush".At that level it is more about winning pots that you aren't supposed to win because your opponents are also going to try to win pots that they aren't supposed to win so you have to even that out.There's a big difference between being able to win at higher levels and lower levels, and it is not bankroll.First of all, the real big mistakes stop happening or disappear altogether. You have to try to keep these to a minimum as well. Second, it's about the thought process behind the hand. At a higher level, more thinking and analysis is going on 'behind the scenes' and overall people have a better 'feel' for about where they are at in the hand. The OP has the right idea. ie trying to grasp what is going on in the heads of winning higher limit players that is not going on in his.theredpill and people like him are the reasons why the higher limit players win. There are always fishies who get going on a lucky run and think they can now jump up limits. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 edit: as far as live play goes, drawingdead, since you play mostly live, you think there is a DRAMATIC increase or fluctuation in skill, knowledge, etc. when switching from 3-5 to 5-10 NL? as far as live go, i would definatley say they are almost identical, at least at the "tiny" casinos i play at...Real quick, I want to point out, the NLHE strat section ISN'T JUST FOR ONLINE PLAY. I'd LOVE to see more live hands. As for your question about 2/5(or 3/5) and the differences between 5/10 NL, I think it all depends. My local cardroom doesn't spread 5/10 NL, so the times I've played it haven't been with the normal group of 2/5'ers than I normally see at my local card room.I played 5/10 at Harrah's in KC and I think the play was dramatically different from the 2/5 games I've played both locally and otherwise. That might be that they're just typically better than the players I see on a regular basis, but, I think it's still a dramatic difference. To me, it's the same way that 1/2 NL live and 2/5 NL Live I've played are dramatically different. To me, 1/2 NL, you're honestly just playing your cards and picking your spots. Knowing how to value bet at 1/2 NL puts you miles ahead of most everyone at the table. When you move up to the 2/5 NL there's a lot more pots taken down without show down, a lot more 'moves' being made, and you begin to play the player more. You tend to pick your spots more carefully, utilize position more and tells and betting patterns become more paramount.The 5/10 NL I've played has been even less about cards and showing the best hand down. Instead of using position, we're abusing position. I'm raising in LP with almost any two cards as opposed to a premium holding. We're more often attempting to make someone lay the best hand down than we are showing down the best hand than we would at 2/5.I think 5/10 Live is when you really start to apply more about Pot Odds and pricing people out of their draws and especially when the ability to read people takes over. Sure, you do these things at the 1/2 and 2/5 tables, but it becomes hugely more important--and more costly at the 5/10 tables. You can get away chasing draws without being correctly priced in at 1/2 and 2/5 because a lot of times if you can out play the average 1/2 and 2/5 player. You can't do that at 5/10. Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 Oops. They are not hands that I played. Sorry. I will try and dig up some of my old hands. No promises.How's it coming KTW? Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 I think beating the 5/10 NL game is more about being comfortable with the money being bet than knowing the strategy. I could probably beat 5/10 NL if I was given 3 months and a good bankroll. The money scares me, though. The money scares me and my heart rate just increases too fast for me to think clearly and I just don't enjoy the feeling of what they call a "rush".At that level it is more about winning pots that you aren't supposed to win because your opponents are also going to try to win pots that they aren't supposed to win so you have to even that out.There's a big difference between being able to win at higher levels and lower levels, and it is not bankroll.First of all, the real big mistakes stop happening or disappear altogether. You have to try to keep these to a minimum as well. Second, it's about the thought process behind the hand. At a higher level, more thinking and analysis is going on 'behind the scenes' and overall people have a better 'feel' for about where they are at in the hand. The OP has the right idea. ie trying to grasp what is going on in the heads of winning higher limit players that is not going on in his.theredpill and people like him are the reasons why the higher limit players win. There are always fishies who get going on a lucky run and think they can now jump up limits.I think this is dead on, and it really explains why I would like to see more high limit NL hands and pick the brains of the people posting them a little bit. I understand the theory's behind it all, but unless I somehow come up with the 150k or so I'd need to play TAG at 50-100 NL, I can't sit at the table and be in those positions. I understand why Player X is raising from the CO with 95s, but why's he calling the BB's re-raise? Is it attempt to isolate against a weaker opponent? Is he just hoping to get lucky and stack the BB? Things like that. Link to post Share on other sites
KTW 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 How's it coming KTW?I meant ASAP but not less than a day. Link to post Share on other sites
beans-n-icewater 18 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Here's one. It's from a while ago.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...&highlight= Steve, how the heck are ya???not seen you around for a whileI was in LA a while back and thought about lookin you up (ever hang out in the alley between Ripleys and the parking garage?the odors there are to DIE for...see ya Link to post Share on other sites
DrawingDeadInDM 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Author Share Posted January 23, 2006 How's it coming KTW?I meant ASAP but not less than a day. Haha, good stuff. I just read it and replied. I'd love it if you post more as you get them, or if you dig any more hands up, it'd be awesome. Much appreciated. Link to post Share on other sites
steve7stud 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 Here's one. It's from a while ago.http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-foru...&highlight= Steve, how the heck are ya???not seen you around for a whileI was in LA a while back and thought about lookin you up (ever hang out in the alley between Ripleys and the parking garage?the odors there are to DIE for...see yaClassic. Link to post Share on other sites
ispepi 0 Posted January 23, 2006 Share Posted January 23, 2006 I wish that I could help you out. I've played online nlhe a few times and really didn't like it. 25-50 on UB, and Party's 2k. I managed to book small wins in each session. But I certainly wasn't comfortable playing no limit online. For better or worse, I'm not a math guy. A lot of my no limit game is based on tells. When I'm sitting at the table with a player, I can get a much better "feel" for the situation. Limit poker I find translates much better online.Here is a perfect example. Often times when I played in a no limit game at Commerce with a deep stack, the following would happen. Another player and I would get all the money into the middle on the flop or the turn. To reduce variance, we would "run it, once, twice, or three times". This isn't something that you can do online. If you look in the strat section, I did talk about sessions of no limit that I've played with Daniel and Phil Laak. I've also played with a ton of other players like Allen Cunningham, Stan Goldstein, Billy Duarte, "Booby" Bellande, etc (the list would be fairly extensive.)If you haven't read the thread already, don't ever try and play Jacks against Daniel when he has q7. It's an easy way to go bust, lol.Sorry I couldn't be of more help.you're really good at poker and stuff, but that was a total name drop... brutal Link to post Share on other sites
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