Willing 2 Die 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Villian is just a bad player. My thought process with this hand is that if i hit my 4th club i know i can stack him if he has Kc, or trips, plus I have money to splash around with so i'm ignoring the odds for a sec. Hero has been LAG.Hero has AcAdStacks: Villian$250 Hero $400+Preflop: Hero raises to $15 after a couple of limps, Villian in BB calls, limpers fold.flop: 4c, 10c, QcVillian checks, Hero bets $35, Villan calls.Turn: QhVillian bets $40. (So, obviously he has three queens here, but should i be calling for Implied odds? What should i do?) Link to post Share on other sites
No_Neck 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 this is one of those times where you are going to win a little bit if you are right but lose a lot when you are wrong. Also he could be slowplaying the flush in which case you are down to 2 outs.I would fold and move on. Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 this is one of those times where you are going to win a little bit if you are right but lose a lot when you are wrong. Also he could be slowplaying the flush in which case you are down to 2 outs.I would fold and move on.You mean 11 outs? Link to post Share on other sites
Willing 2 Die 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 this may be a leak but all i was thinking about at the time he bet was his stack and that 4th club. I'm very confident at this point that he has QJ, KQ, so i dont think i'm too far behind here. I'm getting only about 3 to 1 odds on my call though, so it might not be good enough as the first response indicated. Link to post Share on other sites
David_Nicoson 1 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 The turn bet is pretty weird. I wouldn't really know how to interpret that bet size against an unknown villain.I call, I guess, given your deduction that this is trip queens. Link to post Share on other sites
David_Nicoson 1 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 this may be a leak but all i was thinking about at the time he bet was his stack and that 4th club. I'm very confident at this point that he has QJ, KQ, so i dont think i'm too far behind here. I'm getting only about 3 to 1 odds on my call though, so it might not be good enough as the first response indicated.It's not very often we get immediate pot odds in no-limit. We're probably not getting paid on the river unless he happens to have a big club in his hand. But 11 outs is 3.3 : 1 or so. If we get paid once in a blue moon, we're still making money. There's clearly some reverse implied odds lurking here, on the other hand. I don't want to see the J , for instance. Link to post Share on other sites
No_Neck 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 You mean 11 outs?I gotta stop responding before I get a cup of coffee in the morning. Link to post Share on other sites
krup24 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 You mean 11 outs?You mean 9 outs? Link to post Share on other sites
BlueDev 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 You mean 9 outs?I assumed he meant "slowplaying the boat." So 2 outs to the better boat. Link to post Share on other sites
Willing 2 Die 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 flop: 4c, 10c, QcVillian checks, Hero bets $35, Villan calls.Turn: QhVillian bets $40. Hero calls $40River 2hVillian checks. Hero Link to post Share on other sites
Acid_Knight 2 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 I check behind. He has a bad Qx that he's not folding, you'll get check/raised if you bet or he won't call a bet from you in the first place. Link to post Share on other sites
TraptSteve 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Bet 2$ or move in on him.Seriously though, there is like no way you can bet there, even against a donk...If I were playing against a known opponent w/ history on them and feel I could get value out of the my hand, it is still a risky bet. Considering you are against what still is an unknown, this is insta-check. Link to post Share on other sites
Willing 2 Die 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Author Share Posted October 30, 2007 I of course checked, because there is no way he's folding his trip queens. Sure enough, he had KQ. Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 You mean 9 outs?durrrr...I meant ELEVEN outs.Welcome to out-counting 101. I'm Professor Henderson.If he has the flush, there are 7 unseen flush cards, plus 2 aces, plus 2 queens that win for us.The only time we have 2 outs is when villain has a full house already, if it includes the Q.If he has an under set which is now a boat, we still have 4 outs.If he has Qx (not a boat), we have 10 outs (8 clubs that don't make him a boat, or 8 clubs if he holds one, and 2 aces).That will be all for today.Quiz on Friday. Link to post Share on other sites
Sheiky 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 Mmmm, i think this is an ok call against a bad player because you're more likely to get paid of if he has the Kc or just the 3 queens which a better player would fold to a club. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 durrrr...I meant ELEVEN outs.Welcome to out-counting 101. I'm Professor Henderson.If he has the flush, there are 7 unseen flush cards, plus 2 aces, plus 2 queens that win for us.The only time we have 2 outs is when villain has a full house already, if it includes the Q.If he has an under set which is now a boat, we still have 4 outs.If he has Qx (not a boat), we have 10 outs (8 clubs that don't make him a boat, or 8 clubs if he holds one, and 2 aces).That will be all for today.Quiz on Friday.He was obviously assuming the flush he was holding was Jc-9c :)9 outs. Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 lol, I did forget to factor in the straight flush redraws. Link to post Share on other sites
krup24 0 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 durrrr...I meant ELEVEN outs.Welcome to out-counting 101. I'm Professor Henderson.If he has the flush, there are 7 unseen flush cards, plus 2 aces, plus 2 queens that win for us.The only time we have 2 outs is when villain has a full house already, if it includes the Q.If he has an under set which is now a boat, we still have 4 outs.If he has Qx (not a boat), we have 10 outs (8 clubs that don't make him a boat, or 8 clubs if he holds one, and 2 aces).That will be all for today.Quiz on Friday.lolyou would think the 4 semesters of calculus woulda helped, well it didn't Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 30, 2007 Share Posted October 30, 2007 lolyou would think the 4 semesters of calculus woulda helped, well it didn'tCalculus is poison for your mind. Proof is trying to do three simple questions in your head:1) What's the derrivative of 2x3 + 5x 2 + x2) What's 57 * 49?3) Which of the last two answers did you get faster? Link to post Share on other sites
shinzilla 0 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Calculus is poison for your mind. Proof is trying to do three simple questions in your head:1) What's the derrivative of 2x3 + 5x 2 + x2) What's 57 * 49?3) Which of the last two answers did you get faster?If calculus were as easy as question 1, I would've been a much happier camper back when I was taking those classes. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 If calculus were as easy as question 1, I would've been a much happier camper back when I was taking those classes.I'm aware heh. It's a simple example of how low level calc is easier than low level arithmetic. Obviously when you start doing problems that don't have numbers in them brains begin to melt...But calc 1-4 is still easy It's stat calc that's mind numbingly difficult. Link to post Share on other sites
krup24 0 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 I'm aware heh. It's a simple example of how low level calc is easier than low level arithmetic. Obviously when you start doing problems that don't have numbers in them brains begin to melt...But calc 1-4 is still easy It's stat calc that's mind numbingly difficult.i got the first one fast but the second one didn't take long. and calc 4 sucked it was all imaginary numbers i this and i that and differential equations. Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Stacks: Villian$250 Hero $400+[/b]Villian bets $40. (So, obviously he has three queens here, but should i be calling for Implied odds? What should i do?) So we're going to play hard on a 21% draw to a flush on a paired board and slow pressure from a donkey? Meh. I hope you don't shove your flush. Link to post Share on other sites
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