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Small Pair Facing Ss Shove

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#1 SuperJon



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Posted 11 March 2014 - 06:16 PM

Never quite knew what to do in these spots.

Playing a $10+1 8k Gtd on Bovada.

Blinds are 2k/4k with 400 ante

I have 90k
UTG has 25k
MP1 has 21k

UTG shoves, MP1 calls. Folds to me in the BB with 77.

Standard call or better to fold and preserve my stack. I know their ranges are super wide (especially UTG), but I'd love to hear any arguments in favor of folding.

Edit: 49 players left, and the bubble just burst.

#2 TrueAce13


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Posted 11 March 2014 - 11:15 PM

with stack sizes, i don't think either decision is wrong tbh; table dependent here definitely...i love calling w/ 88-99, 77 just seems to be right on the boarder tho
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#3 kaipanoulias


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Posted 02 September 2014 - 01:34 AM

I would always lean towards folding 77 in a multi-way All-in pot in this specific situation. Now since I do not know the full size of the pot, I am going to do a quick estimation. (full details would be great :))

So lets say the Table is 8 handed at the time of this hand. That gives 9200 to the pot before any action.

Now you get a shove from first position for 25K, and at the current blinds is pretty desperate place to be. The caller is in the same boat, desperate for a double up.

The pot is now 55200.

Now you need to call 21000 more in the big blind, giving you about 2.5:1 on your money. Heads up that is a pretty good call, but once you add that extra caller it gets pretty dicey.

Lets Say both players hold over cards to you (which is not hard holding a small pair.) The best possible situation here is they both hold the same hand, and are each only drawing to 4 outs on the flop to beat you. 8 cards to beat you if they hold one of the same card each, and 12 outs if they hold seperate over cards. So average it out to 8 cards to beat you, which is 2 more than a heads up race. So you are worse off than you would be having only one opponent, with only slightly better pot odds. But the extra opponent also adds an increased chance of facing another pair, and with a smaller pair, you have 2 opponents who could possibly hold 88-AA.

Now say you lose the pot. your stack worth almost 10m, is now 7m, putting you closer to the danger zone. Now winning will boost your stack to over 15m, but the odds are against you on the call.

Given that the bubble just burst as well, that makes even more of a reason to fold. With your stack, if you play it right you can make a decent run into the money, and any sacrifice of those valuable chips with less than profitable odds would be a losing proposition.

Now this all sounds a tad nitty, but looking for long range profit in a tourney, folding is the best play.



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Posted 06 October 2014 - 08:51 AM

I think the Dynamics of the table come into effect here for sure. I find in these online tournaments once the has bubble burst then u will get pushes from the paints or A-rag quit a bit. A lot of ppl loosen up their play once they know they are not leaving empty handed. Most of the shorter stacks would like to come back and win it but in reality they are just as satisfied knowing they placed. On the other hand if u have been at that particular table for a little while and watched previous hands, then u might have made a mental note of the aggressors and the tight players. In some cases it the odds can be changed with knowledge of the other two players betting habits , for better or worse. On the bubble and after I find in online poker is a special time lol. On the bubble ppl are super tight and gives the ability to steal some blinds and grow ur stack. Then after the bubble burst ppl loosen up and start calling/raising more and become a bit sloppier, giving u the opportunity for traps and some small ball action.
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