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did i overdo it? (lhe) oct 5th


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#1 Roughness

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:10 PM

PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) converterPreflop: Hero is UTG with 6:club:, 6:spade:. Hero calls, 4 folds, Hero calls, CO calls.Flop: (7 SB) A:spade:, Q:diamond:, 6:heart: (3 players)SB checks, Hero bets, CO calls, SB calls.Turn: (5 BB) 8:club: (3 players)SB checks, Hero bets, Hero calls.River: (13 BB) T:heart: (2 players)SB bets, SB calls.Final Pot: 21 BBThis table is pretty passive preflop, not many raises, therefore I'm not second-guessing calling with 66 utg at all. After we cap the turn, do I have to slow way down on the river? Maybe bet-call or even check-call? I don't ever fold here right? I think I bet way too hard on this hand.

#2 TJ_Eckleburg

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:45 PM

Preflop and flop are fine.I think the turn cap is fine.I might just call the river bet though. He's gotta have SOMETHING to lead into a cap like that. He could have AA, QQ, 88, or some freak nasty other stuff. I don't think I want to cap this river with an unimproved baby set.His OOP preflop raise kinda scares me.
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#3 WonderfulSplash

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:46 PM

Im just calling villains 3bet on the river, other than that it looks good.

#4 pokerplayer24

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:47 PM

Most of the time players only raise from the blinds with monsters only. His check on the flop than major raising on the turn makes me think AA or QQ. The only hand that you possibly have beat is a way overplayed AQ.

#5 TJ_Eckleburg

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 12:51 PM

WonderfulSplash said:

Im just calling villains 3bet on the river, other than that it looks good.
Why would you raise the river if you can't cap? River raises are for value only, because there aren't any more cards coming. You're either ahead, or you're not. If you think there's a better than good chance you're not, you should just show this down rather than "win one or none/lose 2" by raising the river.I think 3-betting the turn check-raise is the right play, because we DO have a set. For his raise preflop AND cap on the turn though, I just want to show down the river.
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#6 creepy20

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 03:51 PM

i think your cap is fine. like TJ said..if your not capping the riv no reason for the raise on the riv unless you think your ahead. i've seen many people overplay AK, AQ, and even AJ here...yes I said AJ...you never know. If he has AA or QQ and you lose, well then you lose, thats poker...move on...you have a set..i play it just the way you did.
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#7 shortypoke

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 04:00 PM

Just call the river. Any reads on SB? I gladly head towards capping the river against someone you have seen routinely overplay TPTK or 2 pair. Despite the horrible players out there, it won't happen too often that you're ahead here.

#8 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 04:05 PM

What format are you using on the converter? Because every time I try to convert a hand it dosen't work and it's really starting to piss me off.

#9 Actuary

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 06:50 PM

Breaking Liberty said:

What format are you using on the converter? Because every time I try to convert a hand it dosen't work and it's really starting to censored me off.
"Bet The Pot"or I can't think of the other one I use.THe one with FTR is down..or was.also...delete the word "Texas"..converter doen't like that.back to hand.You can raise river w/o capping because his 3-bet is more information.Now, whethe its' enough info to go from risking 2 to win one to now just callnig instead of risking 1 more to win one..I don't know. "Im just saying, his 3-bet gives you more info.

#10 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 07:01 PM

Ahhhhhh that was the issue. The fact that it said texas was making it go haywire. Can't really blame it for not likeing that word.

#11 Mattnxtc

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 10:16 PM

the most logical hand for him to have would be pk 8s since he went nuts with it on the turn and he didnt raise it preflop. I like the turn play and depending on who the player was (ie what his stats are) i either may or may not cap the river...likely ill just call the 3 bet and make him show me the set of 8s
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#12 DanielNegreanu

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 10:22 PM

Yes, I think you absolutely overdid it on this hand. Generally when a player raises from the small blind it's a sign of strength. For him to then check and call on the flop that would generally mean one of two things:1) He doesn't like the ace2) He is setting a trap The only hand you could feasibly beat is AK, but it's also unlikely that your opponent would play it that aggressively on the turn, and especially on the river. No offense, but you lost way too much money on this hand. In fact, so many alarm bells would go off in my head that my opponent had aces the way he played the hand that I "might" just call the raise on the turn, and call the raise on the river.
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#13 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 05 October 2005 - 11:59 PM

DanielNegreanu said:

In fact, so many alarm bells would go off in my head that my opponent had aces the way he played the hand that I "might" just call the raise on the turn, and call the raise on the river.
You need to have a very strong read on your opponent IMO to not three bet this turn.You simply cannot be afraid of someone flopping an over set on you.At this limit he could be holding ANY thing, and I can guarantee you are ahead here more times than you are behind.So three bet and if he caps just call down the river. If he calls and then bets out on the river, I would also be weary and just call.Just my $.02 though.

#14 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:09 AM

Oh and before I get flamed I'm not saying Daniel is wrong.I'm just stating that you need a strong read to not 3-bet the turn here. And a read like that at a .50/1 level isn't usually possible.He could have K-Jo. Seriously. I've seen someone cap me with a gut shot straight on the turn before at these levels.And he raised with that from the SB preflop.

#15 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 12:21 AM

DanielNegreanu said:

The only hand you could feasibly beat is AK, but it's also unlikely that your opponent would play it that aggressively on the turn, and especially on the river.
He can beat AQ and AJ here. And it is very feasible that he has either those two or AK. People at this level think it is a great idea to wait until the turn to play AK aggressively when they flop an ace and raise with either of these three hands from any position preflop.

#16 KyleStark

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 08:50 AM

yikes, i'm half assed with Liberty....people at that level geniunley over value their hands way to much. The hand does wreak of AA but also of a typically over played AK or AQ also. At the higher levels that i've never played at I'm thinking DN is right.

#17 Breaking Liberty

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 09:19 AM

KyleStark said:

At the higher levels that i've never played at I'm thinking DN is right.
Me too, but I know at this level you are leaving too much money on the table long term to not 3 bet here.

#18 Actuary

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 09:36 AM

easy turn 3-bet at 0.25 / 0.50just call river after turn cap.

#19 richgambler

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 09:38 AM

I think you played it fine all the way until the river....I'm just calling here, no doubt about it...It friggin stinks of aces
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#20 princeof56k

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Posted 06 October 2005 - 02:50 PM

While I would normally raise this turn in heart beat, Daniel might have a point here. Players at this level do some really crazy things, but this may not be one of them.A lot of players do like to raise out of the SB with tons of hands they shouldnt. This guy could have AT offsuit for all we know. But usually they raise (with 2 people already in) because they plan to bet on the flop, turn, AND river no matter what in an effort to get you to fold. These people arent really creative enough to change their strategy from "bet out no matter what" to, "I'll raise form the SB, then hit TP, check/call he flop, and then suck them in for an extra bet with my check/raise on the turn." He is more likely to play this way if he flopped a monster and wants to let people catch up for fear that he wont get paid. I would be much more likely to think he's full of crap if he had check/raised the flop or just bet out.That being said I probably still 3bet it on the turn, but I think it might be closer than we realize. BTW, call down after the turn cap.




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