what do i do in this spot! 3 handed mtt

[Guest]

Information for the hand:Bizman is very agressive and the large chip leader.Kingslake is the short stack on the table.-----HAND 5------Game #684702813: Texas Hold'em No Limit (2000/4000) - 2005/05/25 - 17:44:41 (GMT)Table "Tourney 623744 - 1" Seat 9 is the button. Seat 2: Kingslake (19267.14 in chips)Seat 6: bizman (136870.25 in chips)Seat 9: Glish (37362.61 in chips)Kingslake: posts the ante 500bizman: posts the ante 500Glish: posts the ante 500Kingslake: posts small blind 2000bizman: posts big blind 4000----- HOLE CARDS -----dealt to Glish [7c 7s]Glish: raises to 20000Kingslake: is all-in 16767.14bizman: raises to 136370.25 and is all-inGlish: is all-in 16862.61Returned uncalled bets 99,507.64 to bizman----- FLOP ----- [9c 3h Ah]----- TURN ----- [9c 3h Ah][2h]----- RIVER ----- [9c 3h Ah 2h][Ks]----- SHOW DOWN -----bizman: shows [Jc As] (A Pair of Aces, King high)Glish: shows [7c 7s] (A Pair of Sevens, Ace high)Kingslake: shows [3c 3d] (Three of a kind, Threes, Ace high)bizman collected 36190.94 from Side pot #1Kingslake collected 57801.42 from Main pot----- SUMMARY -----Total pot 93992.36 Main pot 57801.42 Side pot #1 36190.94 | Rake 0Board [9c 3h Ah 2h Ks]Seat 2: Kingslake (small blind) showed [3c 3d] and won (57801.42) with Three of a kind, Threes, Ace highSeat 6: bizman (big blind) showed [Jc As] and won (36190.94) with A Pair of Aces, King highI open up with enough to put KS all in holding 77... he thinks about it and calls.Comes to bizman who i just expect to fold... however you see his timer running down and then he decided to also move all in.It comes back to me...I think that:I know bizman is agressive and holds a big chip lead, so he can actually afford to lose this hand. I think his raise seemed to be a decision that he wasn't quite sure about as he seemed to think for ages, of course he could have had a great hand and just ran the clock down a bit.Kingslake i decided could either have a pair lower than mine or 2 face cards that must have a strong chance of being dominated by bizman. I thought bizman would have AK / AQs.So i decided i was unlikely to get knocked out... I call and i do manage to come last in the hand. Do any of you fold/play the hand differently? Obviously I coulda just gone all in and the same result happens but after bizman seeing the action and still playing i felt i had a hard decision.

[cdddc75 0]

You played it fine.EV for the hand:7s 7c 0.438As Jc 0.3813c 3d 0.181You had an 82% chance to finish at least second and were a slight favorite to double your stack and add on the small stack. Folding to bizman's allin would significantly reduce your chances of winning and finishing second.The cards just went against you.

[Guest]

thanks... any other views ppl?

[Rocketwadster 0]

I agree that after you had raised it, that you had to call the re-raise, but I definately don't agree with that size of a raise in that position, as it basically pot-commits you. Sure, you bet enough that it would end up putting the short stack all-in, but I don't think that putting that large a raise in is needed to do that. Betting half that amount would accomplish the same objective wouldn't it, in that the short stack would either fold or he would re-raise by going all-in himself, giving you a chance to get out of the hand (should you decide to do so say if the big stack pushes so you would be all-in) at half the costs. Just my opinion though. :wink:

[gobears 0]

Since you mentioned that the big stack is very aggressive. I would push if I had the 7's if you're going to play them here.Without any reads, I would raise 3xBB with the 7's so that I wouldn't be pot committed. In a HU situation, you're typically a slight favorite or a 4-1 dog to a higher overpair and I'd like to see the flop. But with your read, I push since a 3xBB raise invites a re-raise all-in if he's that aggressive.In terms of your play, you've already put 20K of your chips into the stack; I think that the call was justified. Most of the time, you at least get second.

[Guest]

I posted this elsewhere and someone said the only moves i should have done were all in or limp and that my raise was a nothing raise.limping is a bit ridiculous to me as the blinds are antes from the button are definitely worth getting. I make this raise another time they both have junk.I don't really have a problem with all in either.But do you think 20,000 is a nothing raise? Basically i thought it was saying. Kingslake call me if you have something.... i'm pot comitted. As i've already mentioned i felt it unlikley i'd get knocked out that hand and i shouldn't really without the cards falling cruely.

[Big Country 0]

I posted this elsewhere and someone said the only moves i should have done were all in or limp and that my raise was a nothing raise.limping is a bit ridiculous to me as the blinds are antes from the button are definitely worth getting. I make this raise another time they both have junk.I don't really have a problem with all in either.But do you think 20,000 is a nothing raise? Basically i thought it was saying. Kingslake call me if you have something.... i'm pot comitted. As i've already mentioned i felt it unlikley i'd get knocked out that hand and i shouldn't really without the cards falling cruely.

I think that once you had made the decision to raise, you should have pushed. You already said you were pot committed with the raise to 20K, so, if bizman folds, you have the same result as if you pushed, if he calls, you are getting all-in on the flop anyway, so you may as well push all-in preflop. At the very least, it may have made bizman think about folding once you were called by Kingslake as you have shown you are committed all the way with the hand (even though mathematically you alread were by raising to 20K).Basically, raising to 20K and going all-in have the same result for you, but going all-in I think would give you the greater shot of getting heads up, which is better for a middle pair than going against two hands.

[Rocketwadster 0]

Were you raising the 20K to put the guy all-in if he wanted to play, or to establish your hand for both of your opponents? There is a difference there, and as I posted earlier, you could have put half as many chips at risk pre-flop to obtain the same results if you were wanting to get the small stack all-in, but you still had the big stack to contend with. I still feel that betting about 10K will do the same as 20K, and leave you enough that you can fold should the big stack go over-the-top (if you so desire). :wink:

[Outlaw_IA 0]

Limp/fold to the two idiots over-playing shitty hands.When you raised you pot stuck yourself.

[Rocketwadster 0]

Limp/fold to the two idiots over-playing censored hands.When you raised you pot stuck yourself.

I don't think you can really fault the big stack though in this situation, as he has the short stack well covered and every chance you get to eliminate a player he should jump on (within reason). :wink:

[Outlaw_IA 0]

I didnt actually realize it was 3 handed. (need to read closer)I would have moved in to begin with, so i would have still lost my money, lol.

[Guest]

I intended the 20K to say small stack you are all in if you want to play.