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Stepping Down A Level Or Enjoying The Madness?


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Hi all,my first post here. I have been reading (and mostly understanding) here for a while now.I normally play .05/.10 cent NLHE on Pokerstars. According to Pokertracker I'm SLPA.I think my starting hand requirements are good but I just don't like to raise to much preflop because I fell it looks like an invitation to chase down the TopPair/Overpair. (ok... theres a hole in my game I know, but i feel comfortable occasionally limping with AK because donks will automatically put you on AK when you raise).Normally, I am staying about even at this level, playing 4 tables at a time and also being able to read the donks bets.Until last week. I don't know what suddenly went wrong but I somehow started bleeding chips. I kept track (like in the old days with a pen and paper) of what was happening and I was drawn out 17 out of 23 times. By "drawn out" I refer to hands like sets of 6es on a 236-Flop, being pushed all in by the aces and happily calling, then seeing the two-outer hit).So 6 times out of 23 I got my money in "good" on Flop or turn and got actually NOT sucked out against the odds by the wildest chasers.I know. I want them wild chasers to call me.I just can't afford it much longer as I decided to not pay more than 100$ a month on this hobby (and the 100$ of march are currently mostly gone already). I notice when I tilt and am usually able to stop then. A 16th buy in went down the drain though when I picked up QQ in the BB and was raised PF from the smallblinds after the hole ring folded. I reraised, he moved in I called and that was that. Maybe not tight enough?So y'all what next?.My confidence is shattered. After not getting payed a dime with good hands and getting sucked out by donks who'll pay half their stack to catch there gutshot / higher boat flush etc, on the river I dont't know what to do anymore. Stepping down a level? I dont want to smallstack like the suckers waiting for AA and KK, folding everything else. (Anyone else noticed smallstackers have gotten tighter?)Most of the time these guys are just blocking seats in the game? More then 2 of em and I don't play at the table anyway.Suggestions for loosing slower? Keep up the basically good game at .02/.05 and get sucked out slower?Playing less then 4 tables? -> My game gets better then. I make better reads and get sucked out slower.If you want to suck my top sets out too, I am mostly online 6pm to 8pm cet on stars. Username mikebauer26. Call my raises or 5$ bets on flop or turn with any two cards and get paid :-)I know. BBFIDTS (been reading here for a while now) ;-)But what are your ways of handling phases like that?Also, does anyone know if pokertracker and the HUD work with windows vista?CheersMike

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Poker tracker & hud work fine with vista. With regard to your downswing, I would recommend the following - play less tables for the next 2/3000 hands, move down if you don't have confidence to play an aggressive game, re-evaluate ur hands and see if you can plug some leaks. It sounds like your just running bad imo, take a couple of days off and give it another go!

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I just finished running even worse at 5/10$, and I suggest either taking up another game, PLO, PLO8, Stud, Stud8, Razz, 2-7 etc. or another format, MTTs, SNGs etc. until you can return to your cash game with a fresh out look. Dropping down feels like your punishing yourself for some one else's mistakes, but changing it up is both educational and forces you to play tighter until you get the hang of something new, which should stem the losses.Running bad sucks, but just remind yourself that you should be decision oriented and not results oriented.

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I'm currently just coming out of a 200BB downswing on 1/2 limit on Stars (just yesterday had my first winning session, +30BB in a couple hours), so I know how ya feel. We all do. Have you thought of trying limit? The swings are smaller.

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Hi all,my first post here. I have been reading (and mostly understanding) here for a while now.I normally play .05/.10 cent NLHE on Pokerstars. According to Pokertracker I'm SLPA.I think my starting hand requirements are good but I just don't like to raise to much preflop because I fell it looks like an invitation to chase down the TopPair/Overpair. (ok... theres a hole in my game I know, but i feel comfortable occasionally limping with AK because donks will automatically put you on AK when you raise).Normally, I am staying about even at this level, playing 4 tables at a time and also being able to read the donks bets.Until last week. I don't know what suddenly went wrong but I somehow started bleeding chips. I kept track (like in the old days with a pen and paper) of what was happening and I was drawn out 17 out of 23 times. By "drawn out" I refer to hands like sets of 6es on a 236-Flop, being pushed all in by the aces and happily calling, then seeing the two-outer hit).So 6 times out of 23 I got my money in "good" on Flop or turn and got actually NOT sucked out against the odds by the wildest chasers.I know. I want them wild chasers to call me.I just can't afford it much longer as I decided to not pay more than 100$ a month on this hobby (and the 100$ of march are currently mostly gone already). I notice when I tilt and am usually able to stop then. A 16th buy in went down the drain though when I picked up QQ in the BB and was raised PF from the smallblinds after the hole ring folded. I reraised, he moved in I called and that was that. Maybe not tight enough?So y'all what next?.My confidence is shattered. After not getting payed a dime with good hands and getting sucked out by donks who'll pay half their stack to catch there gutshot / higher boat flush etc, on the river I dont't know what to do anymore. Stepping down a level? I dont want to smallstack like the suckers waiting for AA and KK, folding everything else. (Anyone else noticed smallstackers have gotten tighter?)Most of the time these guys are just blocking seats in the game? More then 2 of em and I don't play at the table anyway.Suggestions for loosing slower? Keep up the basically good game at .02/.05 and get sucked out slower?Playing less then 4 tables? -> My game gets better then. I make better reads and get sucked out slower.If you want to suck my top sets out too, I am mostly online 6pm to 8pm cet on stars. Username mikebauer26. Call my raises or 5$ bets on flop or turn with any two cards and get paid :-)I know. BBFIDTS (been reading here for a while now) ;-)But what are your ways of handling phases like that?Also, does anyone know if pokertracker and the HUD work with windows vista?CheersMike
Downswings are normal. When you hit your upswing, you'll forget all about it. Post your hands though, to be sure that you're certainly "playing good" all of the times you get sucked out on. Sometimes people think they are playing good when they are running bad, but aren't really.My advice is if you are unwilling to spend a certain $$$ on poker for a month (and you're already a month ahead of yourself and broke) then take some time off. After I have a bad session, I take a day or two off to settle down, cool off and relax. In your case you may want to take more like a month off because I've never lost 15 buyins on a downswing, so I would be tilting like a madman. Then when you come back, it is much easier.
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Thanks for the replies so far. Hmm. Other types of poker could make an interesting difference. Not to sure about limit though. I sometimes have a fifth window open looking at higher stakes tables or other game types. From what I've seen of LHE play so far I think I would go Nuts with all the multiway hands that take ages to go through because all of the minraising and calling. But maybe that was a weired table and can not count as sample.Think I will cut down to 2 tables per session for a while and maybe tighten up a bit regarding the smaller SCs.What's the problem with the Prefloppassivity anyway? Am I giving away to much information on the strenght of the hands when I finally raise one?Edit:Will post some of the hands when I'm back home. I'm sure they'll be fun to read... don't have a converter yet so bare with me. Will try & cut the nonsense out with an editor.

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Some fun hands... this is a bit more complicated then I expected. Currently only using the trial of the tracker and could load only last 1000 hands.Bought the key and waiting for the reg code."Fished this from the txt file" ( which is a bit complicated, but i remember some hands)First hand: I knew the player takikardiko and knew my hand was good. On the turn I thought I was in for a split hand with another AQ.PokerStars Game #15211763532: Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/02/11 - 11:37:44 (ET)Table 'Adria V' 9-max Seat #1 is the buttonSeat 1: takikardiko ($10 in chips) <= VillainSeat 2: MEFO1964 ($4.55 in chips) Seat 3: MikeBauer26 HER($8 in chips) <= HeroSeat 4: gillouch ($10.45 in chips) Seat 5: Andro_Dawton ($13.45 in chips) Seat 6: Khavotar ($27.80 in chips) Seat 7: utregfc ($9.95 in chips) Seat 8: PeterHalasz ($1.85 in chips) Seat 9: ninocata ($6.80 in chips) MEFO1964: posts small blind $0.05MikeBauer26: posts big blind $0.10*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to MikeBauer26 [Ah Qh]gillouch: folds Andro_Dawton: folds Khavotar: folds utregfc: folds PeterHalasz: folds ninocata: folds takikardiko: raises $0.30 to $0.40MEFO1964: folds MikeBauer26: calls $0.30*** FLOP *** [2h 7s Qc]MikeBauer26: checks takikardiko: bets $0.70MikeBauer26: raises $1.10 to $1.80takikardiko: raises $1.10 to $2.90MikeBauer26: calls $1.10*** TURN *** [2h 7s Qc] [8h]MikeBauer26: checks takikardiko: bets $6.70 and is all-inMikeBauer26: calls $4.70 and is all-in*** RIVER *** [2h 7s Qc 8h] [Tc]*** SHOW DOWN ***MikeBauer26: shows [Ah Qh] (a pair of Queens)takikardiko: shows [Ts Qd] (two pair, Queens and Tens)takikardiko collected $15.30 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot $16.05 | Rake $0.75 Board [2h 7s Qc 8h Tc]Seat 1: takikardiko (button) showed [Ts Qd] and won ($15.30) with two pair, Queens and TensSeat 2: MEFO1964 (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 3: MikeBauer26 (big blind) showed [Ah Qh] and lost with a pair of QueensSeat 4: gillouch folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 5: Andro_Dawton folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: Khavotar folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 7: utregfc folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 8: PeterHalasz folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: ninocata folded before Flop (didn't bet)Loved this one as well... against a "smallstacker"Here I Bet my Set for Value. The Turn is a scare card but I still fell I am good. And my feeling was right.PokerStars Game #15212905951: Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/02/11 - 12:43:37 (ET)Table 'Mireille' 9-max Seat #5 is the buttonSeat 1: littlemanni ($17.15 in chips) Seat 2: andy85II ($12 in chips) Seat 3: MikeBauer26 ($10.35 in chips) Seat 4: greets ($9 in chips) Seat 5: Hoppadooie ($3.50 in chips) <= VillainSeat 6: baxteru ($17.95 in chips) Seat 7: Bolatehghey ($10 in chips) Seat 8: ivanwinWSOP ($10.25 in chips) baxteru: posts small blind $0.05Bolatehghey: posts big blind $0.10*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to MikeBauer26 [6d 6c]Howie272006 leaves the tableivanwinWSOP: folds littlemanni: calls $0.10andy85II: folds MikeBauer26: calls $0.10greets: folds Weedh0 joins the table at seat #9 Hoppadooie: calls $0.10baxteru: folds Bolatehghey: checks *** FLOP *** [5h 6s Jc]Bolatehghey: checks littlemanni: checks MikeBauer26: bets $0.40Hoppadooie: calls $0.40Bolatehghey: folds littlemanni: folds *** TURN *** [5h 6s Jc] [8h]MikeBauer26: bets $2Hoppadooie: calls $2*** RIVER *** [5h 6s Jc 8h] [4c]MikeBauer26 said, "i i see a7 i am gonna come over to you and find you"MikeBauer26: bets $1Hoppadooie: calls $1 and is all-in*** SHOW DOWN ***MikeBauer26: shows [6d 6c] (three of a kind, Sixes)Hoppadooie: shows [7d 8s] (a straight, Four to Eight)Hoppadooie collected $6.90 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot $7.25 | Rake $0.35 Board [5h 6s Jc 8h 4c]Seat 1: littlemanni folded on the FlopSeat 2: andy85II folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 3: MikeBauer26 showed [6d 6c] and lost with three of a kind, SixesSeat 4: greets folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 5: Hoppadooie (button) showed [7d 8s] and won ($6.90) with a straight, Four to EightSeat 6: baxteru (small blind) folded before FlopSeat 7: Bolatehghey (big blind) folded on the FlopSeat 8: ivanwinWSOP folded before Flop (didn't bet)And once more: Fun with a set of 6es. Played a ton of hands with Andro. He's a nice guy and my note on him is "kinda tight fella. When he calls, he usualll has something. Occatsionally he will call the big pots with an overpair. On the Flop I am letting him do the contibet and give him the "I know you have AK and missed minraise" because a big reraise would scare him straight out.Of course he is answering with the "No I did not miss"-reraise. And then I get it in good.PokerStars Game #15212734811: Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/02/11 - 12:34:03 (ET)Table 'Cyane' 9-max Seat #7 is the buttonSeat 1: Gerasi ($11.95 in chips) Seat 2: Trstn7 ($9.60 in chips) Seat 3: PlayCash4 ($6.15 in chips) Seat 6: MikeBauer26 ($11.60 in chips) Seat 7: Andro_Dawton ($4.65 in chips) <= nice villainSeat 8: OneBender ($9.95 in chips) OneBender: posts small blind $0.05Gerasi: posts big blind $0.10*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to MikeBauer26 [6c 6s]Trstn7: folds PlayCash4: folds MikeBauer26: calls $0.10Andro_Dawton: raises $0.30 to $0.40OneBender: folds Gerasi: folds MikeBauer26: calls $0.30*** FLOP *** [9d Qd 6h]alteeule2277 leaves the tableMikeBauer26: checks Andro_Dawton: bets $1MikeBauer26: raises $1 to $2Andro_Dawton: raises $1 to $3MikeBauer26: raises $1 to $4Andro_Dawton: raises $0.25 to $4.25 and is all-inMikeBauer26: calls $0.25*** TURN *** [9d Qd 6h] [Ah]Andro_Dawton said, ":club:"*** RIVER *** [9d Qd 6h Ah] [9s]*** SHOW DOWN ***MikeBauer26: shows [6c 6s] (a full house, Sixes full of Nines)Andro_Dawton: shows [As Ad] (a full house, Aces full of Nines)Andro_Dawton collected $9 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot $9.45 | Rake $0.45 Board [9d Qd 6h Ah 9s]Seat 1: Gerasi (big blind) folded before FlopSeat 2: Trstn7 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 3: PlayCash4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 6: MikeBauer26 showed [6c 6s] and lost with a full house, Sixes full of NinesSeat 7: Andro_Dawton (button) showed [As Ad] and won ($9) with a full house, Aces full of NinesSeat 8: OneBender (small blind) folded before FlopAlso awfully nice hands where i flopped boats with sth like 44 on a 994 board and got all in Preflop against. A9s. Turn and river were a 5 and that was that.the hands are a bit hard for me to reproduce.For your entertainment I searched this one though. Am I on tilt here or would you do the same?Table has been awfully aggro with everyhand being raised pf. I have wasted some three bucks already on setmining with medium pairs and the spots for making moves have just never been there.On this final hand, everybody folded (!) -> First hand no raise and I am soooooo not having the smallblind bluff me of my first premium hand. Well... see yourselfPokerStars Game #15210902125: Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2008/02/11 - 10:42:27 (ET)Table 'Cremona III' 9-max Seat #4 is the buttonSeat 1: Lorenv27 ($2.95 in chips) Seat 2: holzi_hq_mz ($10.95 in chips) Seat 3: Miuler ($1.85 in chips) Seat 4: Paczazs ($10 in chips) Seat 5: Rythious ($9.50 in chips) Seat 6: MikeBauer26 ($10.05 in chips) Seat 7: unter null ($10 in chips) Seat 8: MVB78 ($2.70 in chips) Seat 9: robertove ($10.15 in chips) Rythious: posts small blind $0.05MikeBauer26: posts big blind $0.10*** HOLE CARDS ***Dealt to MikeBauer26 [Qc Qs]unter null: folds MVB78: folds robertove: folds Lorenv27: folds holzi_hq_mz: folds Miuler: folds Paczazs: folds Rythious: raises $0.30 to $0.40MikeBauer26: raises $1.20 to $1.60Rythious: raises $7.90 to $9.50 and is all-inMikeBauer26: calls $7.90*** FLOP *** [9c Jh 2h]*** TURN *** [9c Jh 2h] [7h]*** RIVER *** [9c Jh 2h 7h] [Jd]*** SHOW DOWN ***Rythious: shows [Kh Kc] (two pair, Kings and Jacks)MikeBauer26: mucks hand Rythious collected $18.05 from pot*** SUMMARY ***Total pot $19 | Rake $0.95 Board [9c Jh 2h 7h Jd]Seat 1: Lorenv27 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 2: holzi_hq_mz folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 3: Miuler folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 4: Paczazs (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 5: Rythious (small blind) showed [Kh Kc] and won ($18.05) with two pair, Kings and JacksSeat 6: MikeBauer26 (big blind) mucked [Qc Qs]Seat 7: unter null folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 8: MVB78 folded before Flop (didn't bet)Seat 9: robertove folded before Flop (didn't bet)

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These are all incredibly standard hands where people had a good draw against your good made hand, or an overpair vs your set, or an overpair vs an overpair and a random suckout and these hands happen constantly. This is why you have a bankroll and many buyins to ride out when you lose hands like this.

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What AK meant to say is "Convert your hands and put them each in a separate thread if you want good feedback".Though he could be right that they're all standard.It sucks to lose with sets and I've done it a lot but hands like set vs pair+fd or set vs gutshot+fd are going to get all in and you're not an overwhelming favorite.After an incredible run for the first 3 weeks of Jan I went on a 12 buy-in downswing. Yesterday I posted my first winning day in 2 weeks. I made something like 5 BB in 1K hands. Some of that was through bad beat but quite a bit was from bad play and tilting. I've probably improved more in the last few days than I did when I was running like god though.And lol at people who think LHE is less swingy than NL.

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What AK meant to say is "Convert your hands and put them each in a separate thread if you want good feedback".
That would just result in me having to sarcastically write "BBFIDTS" X number of times, where X = the number of hands that the OP posted :club:
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Also, does anyone know if pokertracker and the HUD work with windows vista?
Run as administrator.==========And, you don't need a converter yourself, all you need to do is follow the link posted in the stickied thread titled "Forum Posting Guidelines", and use the one set up on the web. No downloads or any of that jazz. Easy to do, and mandatory if you're gonna post hands in the future, please.
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These are all incredibly standard hands where people had a good draw against your good made hand, or an overpair vs your set, or an overpair vs an overpair and a random suckout and these hands happen constantly. This is why you have a bankroll and many buyins to ride out when you lose hands like this.
Yeah, you'll see worse than that before you quit playing poker, so I wouldn't worry about it too much.
That would just result in me having to sarcastically write "BBFIDTS" X number of times, where X = the number of hands that the OP posted :club:
You're so good at Algebra.
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here's one fresh from the tables done everything right this time?I posted results because the dedicated reader will know anyway that the river card killed me here :-)PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (9 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)UTG ($5.50)UTG+1 ($9.45)MP1 ($10.30)MP2 ($9.35)MP3 ($12)CO ($9.85)Button ($10.30)SB ($5.45)Hero ($11.75)Preflop: Hero is BB with ah.gif, ad.gif. UTG calls $0.10, 6 folds, SB completes, Hero raises to $0.5, UTG folds, SB calls $0.40.Flop: ($1.10) kh.gif, th.gif, 4h.gif(2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $1, SB calls $1.Turn: ($3.10) 5s.gif(2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2.River: ($7.10) 9s.gif(2 players)SB bets $1.95 (All-In), Hero calls $1.95.Final Pot: $11Results in white below: SB has Qs Jd (straight, king high). Hero has Ah Ad (one pair, aces). Outcome: SB wins $11.

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here's one fresh from the tables done everything right this time?I posted results because the dedicated reader will know anyway that the river card killed me here :-)PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (9 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)UTG ($5.50)UTG+1 ($9.45)MP1 ($10.30)MP2 ($9.35)MP3 ($12)CO ($9.85)Button ($10.30)SB ($5.45)Hero ($11.75)Preflop: Hero is BB with ah.gif, ad.gif. UTG calls $0.10, 6 folds, SB completes, Hero raises to $0.5, UTG folds, SB calls $0.40.Flop: ($1.10) kh.gif, th.gif, 4h.gif(2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $1, SB calls $1.Turn: ($3.10) 5s.gif(2 players)SB checks, Hero bets $2, SB calls $2.River: ($7.10) 9s.gif(2 players)SB bets $1.95 (All-In), Hero calls $1.95.Final Pot: $11Results in white below: SB has Qs Jd (straight, king high). Hero has Ah Ad (one pair, aces). Outcome: SB wins $11.
Get $ in on flop, that's the best possible flop for your hand.Also, LOL Matt.
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I put him all-in on the turn with the AhAx there. Don't bet half of his stack. He's an idiot anyway, calling down with essentially 6 outs in the best case scenario. Just take your lumps. Breast cancer lumps that is.

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Alright Bud, welcome to the forum.I'm gonna lock this up, cuz we don't really need a bad beat/whine thread.If you've got some new hands you want analyzed, please make new threads with them (1 hands per thread), and post them without results, and so on, and the talented NL players here will be able to make sure you're playing well.Again, welcome to the forum.

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