AmScray 355 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 Nobody can believe any of these sentences help society in any way. .. because the title suggests what it is, and it's just too depressing. Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 .. because the title suggests what it is, and it's just too depressing.Don't blame you for much of, just skip to the part with the list of ridiculous sentences. Link to post Share on other sites
AmScray 355 Posted February 11, 2012 Share Posted February 11, 2012 That's whats too depressing to read. I've seen it with my own eyes, otherwise good people's lives ruined because of the 'war on drugs' and the absurd sentencing schemes for possessing some drug. You can get a lesser sentence for possession of an explosive device than they regularly hand out for having cocaine. I always was a 'good American' in that I blew off the rest of the worlds criticism of the United States as typical losers hating on the winner- and in a lot of cases, that's totally true- but man, a lot of that criticism is painfully valid. Our court/justice/prison/incarceration/police system is the laughingstock of the world for damn good reason.We've totally failed there but the problem is, systems never go back. It can only get worse, as we've seen over the past couple decades.The tragedy is, we're way too soft as a people to revolt, so it's impossible to change, as that's the only way a rotten system can be changed. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 What. The. ****?The depth of your lack of understanding just blew my mind.Yea, I failed there.In my defense I was trying to set up a joke that probably wasn't going to work for Cane about class warfare, but my wife was yelling at me to get off the computer and go get the backyard ready fro my granddaughter's 2nd birthday party before I left to set up a lighting job for an event Rick Santorum was going to be at.So I rushed it and screwed it all up and will just take my lumps for failing miserably. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Nobody can believe any of these sentences help society in any way.Just read the first one.More of an example of a guy suffering because of mandatory sentencing rules.He also refused a plea for 15 years and instead got 55 years.The dude had a gun and sold enough pot to pay cash for a Lexus, let's not pretend he was some guy smoking a joint.And I can probably find 5,000 examples of leniency because of it being pot for every one example of overboard sentencing. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 And to finish my entrance into the quagmire of pot legalization laws....Gateway Drug./thread Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 The dude had a gun and sold enough pot to pay cash for a Lexus, let's not pretend he was some guy smoking a joint.And I can probably find 5,000 examples of leniency because of it being pot for every one example of overboard sentencing.He didn't hurt anyone, or even threaten anyone. "Having a gun" is not a crime unless you use it. So here you have someone whose WORST behavior was wanting to sell a harmless plant to another informed consensual adult.... 55 years? There is no way you can think that is moral or reasonable.There are lots of examples of leniency because judges know the laws are stupid and immoral, and don't like destroying people's lives for nothing. Link to post Share on other sites
AmScray 355 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Yea, I failed there.In my defense I was trying to set up a joke that probably wasn't going to work for Cane about class warfare, but my wife was yelling at me to get off the computer and go get the backyard ready fro my granddaughter's 2nd birthday party before I left to set up a lighting job for an event Rick Santorum was going to be at.So I rushed it and screwed it all up and will just take my lumps for failing miserably.This is precisely why you're successful in business. I accept your acceptance of failure and agree to retire the matter from here on out.Let this be a lesson to everyone else.When you fail, do not make excuses. There can be honor in honest failure, the people worth dealing with understand this. There is no honor in transparent excuse-making, or pitiable displays of non-integrity and personal unobjectivity as you yarn and back-pedal.Face failure boldly, confront it, take ownership of it. When you own your failures they become yours to define, rather than allowing them to be claimed by those who would only use them for purposes of criticism and slander.I am wise like the Buddha. Link to post Share on other sites
strategy 4 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Gray had no vices to speak of, and a history that was only marred by a burglary he’d committed at 17 – for which he’d done a couple of months – and two more burglaries committed when he was 21. Convictions so old they were not in the Alabama state computer system when he was arrested.boy do I hate writing like this. Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 He didn't hurt anyone, or even threaten anyone. "Having a gun" is not a crime unless you use it. So here you have someone whose WORST behavior was wanting to sell a harmless plant to another informed consensual adult.... 55 years? There is no way you can think that is moral or reasonable.There are lots of examples of leniency because judges know the laws are stupid and immoral, and don't like destroying people's lives for nothing.Do I agree that the guy got more than he deserved? YesDo I also agree that carrying a gun during a drug deal raises the level from selling a weed to a consenting adult for personal consumption to something else? YesYou know using extreme examples results in bad laws, not better ones. Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Do I agree that the guy got more than he deserved? YesDo I also agree that carrying a gun during a drug deal raises the level from selling a weed to a consenting adult for personal consumption to something else? YesYou know using extreme examples results in bad laws, not better ones.Not when all the power is on one side. That's the whole point of limited government: government has unlimited resources and the barrel of a gun to harass individuals; all individuals can do is cross their fingers and hope they aren't the unlucky one next time.Extreme examples that harm the people out of power is the most important evidence of failed policy. Link to post Share on other sites
AmScray 355 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 boy do I hate writing like this.Is it the grossly apparent intellectual dishonesty by way of their minimizing his meaningful criminal past as a thrice convicted burglar (burglary is one offense that has a 20-1 offense/conviction ratio), or the superfluous comma preceeding 'and'? Link to post Share on other sites
Balloon guy 158 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Not when all the power is on one side. That's the whole point of limited government: government has unlimited resources and the barrel of a gun to harass individuals; all individuals can do is cross their fingers and hope they aren't the unlucky one next time.Extreme examples that harm the people out of power is the most important evidence of failed policy.Better to argue mandatory sentencing guidelines are at fault, not the legality of pot. Link to post Share on other sites
strategy 4 Posted February 12, 2012 Share Posted February 12, 2012 Is it the grossly apparent intellectual dishonesty by way of their minimizing his meaningful criminal past as a thrice convicted burglar (burglary is one offense that has a 20-1 offense/conviction ratio), or the superfluous comma preceeding 'and'?the comma is ultimately what pushed me from condemning to supporting the war on drugs. Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The real world experiment, 10 years laterMany of these innovative treatment procedures would not have emerged if addicts had continued to be arrested and locked up rather than treated by medical experts and psychologists.Free markets work better than central planning for all types of ideas. Link to post Share on other sites
vbnautilus 48 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The real world experiment, 10 years laterFree markets work better than central planning for all types of ideas.Of course, the drug treatments they are referring to were developed by government-run Institute of Drugs and Addiction and the Ministry of Health. Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Of course, the drug treatments they are referring to were developed by government-run Institute of Drugs and Addiction and the Ministry of Health.Evidence? Are you seriously telling me that government bureaucrats came up with the idea and then hired people to implement it? Or did they find people who had ideas that were working and then hired them?See, taking credit is the easy part, the idea part is the tricky part. Link to post Share on other sites
BaseJester 1 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Evidence? Are you seriously telling me that government bureaucrats came up with the idea and then hired people to implement it? Or did they find people who had ideas that were working and then hired them?See, taking credit is the easy part, the idea part is the tricky part.I think you might be trying a bit too hard to fit this into the libertarian narrative. Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I think you might be trying a bit too hard to fit this into the libertarian narrative.I just get tired of the Pounding Rocks Theory of Life -- the insane notion that because the government touches everything, that means that all progress is due to govt, and without it we'd just be sitting in cold dark caves pounding rocks together waiting to be rescued by wise bureaucrats. Link to post Share on other sites
CaneBrain 95 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I just get tired of the Pounding Rocks Theory of Life -- the insane notion that because the government touches everything, that means that all progress is due to govt, and without it we'd just be sitting in cold dark caves pounding rocks together waiting to be rescued by wise bureaucrats. but they ARE good at funding research in un-profitable areas that are unattractive to the private sector-----which is probably how the govt was involved in Portugal. Link to post Share on other sites
vbnautilus 48 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I just get tired of the Pounding Rocks Theory of Life -- the insane notion that because the government touches everything, that means that all progress is due to govt, and without it we'd just be sitting in cold dark caves pounding rocks together waiting to be rescued by wise bureaucrats.The irony is that you have an equally insane notion, that because government touches something, that means horrible failure has occurred. How do the achievements of Portugal's publicly run health ministry get to be used as evidence that "central planning" always fails?!! The treatment of drug addiction in portugal is one of the largest publicly run addiction treatment programs in the world. The government runs a huge system of outpatient clinics and detox facilities that are largely responsible for turning this thing around. This is a shining example of success with a government-run program. The situation in Portugal shows that when government makes wise decisions and spends money on helping its citizens instead of spending on futile prohibition efforts, everyone gains. Link to post Share on other sites
strategy 4 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 it's a libertarian idea* that's showing results in the real world. that's a pretty huge win for libertarians regardless of the fact that it isn't a market-based solution, that it requires some degree of central planning, etc. h is just being greedy here.*maybe some on the left believe it as well, but they do not speak of it as openly as someone like ron paul. Link to post Share on other sites
iZuma 764 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 it's a libertarian ideawhat is? Link to post Share on other sites
strategy 4 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 what is?ending the war on drugs? Link to post Share on other sites
hblask 1 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 The irony is that you have an equally insane notion, that because government touches something, that means horrible failure has occurred. How do the achievements of Portugal's publicly run health ministry get to be used as evidence that "central planning" always fails?!!The government *caused* the problems; their solution was to stop causing problems. It's good news that they stopped making society terrible, but that's hardly evidence of how wise and useful they are.If I break your leg and then give you a crutch, does it prove what a good person I am? Especially since I stopped breaking your leg -- a double win, right? Link to post Share on other sites
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