Interview Palin

[checkymcfold 0]

This leaves a very large unanswered question though Checky, what exactly would a fundementalist do that would be so bad to your way of thinking? The fact is there are many non-religious judges who hold that RvW is bad law, and there are many non-religeous people who like Judeo Christian values, even if they don't lable them that way. Just because a person bases his beliefs on the Bible, their opinion on matters is now suspect because why? Because basing your opinion on your high school biology teacher or a funny Jon Stewart clip is more rational?Until you show why a person having their mind molded by Biblical principles is per se bad, then you are just throwing out a bad strawman cake with rhetoric icing and stupid sprinkles on it.Don't use stupid sprinkles.

i made an edit after the paragraph you just quoted. read that and see if your questions still apply--i'll address them if necessary.however, i will say that i don't think that informing decisions with anything, be it a bible, koran, talmud, whatever, is BAD in and of itself. the problem arises when you start acting politically and trying to convince people of your point of view in the public sphere. sure, in democracy, we all end up with the same ability to cast one vote in the end, but (and perhaps i'm being overly idealistic here), a healthy democracy also depends on our ability to think together about common problems and budge a little one way or the other while reaching a more thorough consensus. in order to do that, we need to be speaking the same language. it's literally the same argument i was making in the rhetoric thread in the religion forum--just from the other direction.

[Balloon guy 158]

i made an edit after the paragraph you just quoted. read that and see if your questions still apply--i'll address them if necessary.

Still lots of stupid sprinklesIn order for what you say to be true, you must make the case that the things the fundementalist want to do are wrong. If I want to reduce the number of abortions because I believe they are children and killing them is wrong, but you want to reduce abortions because they are unneccessary in this age of birth control, so what if you don't agree with my reason? There is no basis for your paranoia of why I came to the same conclusion as you.A Fundementalist in office would make Biblical based decisions, that value life and freedom. When would a person using the Bible do something that would be wrong because it was Biblically based?

[checkymcfold 0]

Strawman. Jails and prisons arent filled up with casual potheads

somewhat true of federal prisons, but it really depends on the state. in NY, 27% of state inmates are in on drug charges. federally, it's more around 5%, but that's still a hell of a lot of people.

[Balloon guy 158]

i made an edit after the paragraph you just quoted. read that and see if your questions still apply--i'll address them if necessary.however, i will say that i don't think that informing decisions with anything, be it a bible, koran, talmud, whatever, is BAD in and of itself. the problem arises when you start acting politically and trying to convince people of your point of view in the public sphere. sure, in democracy, we all end up with the same ability to cast one vote in the end, but (and perhaps i'm being overly idealistic here), a healthy democracy also depends on our ability to think together about common problems and budge a little one way or the other while reaching a more thorough consensus. in order to do that, we need to be speaking the same language. it's literally the same argument i was making in the rhetoric thread in the religion forum--just from the other direction.

The song sounds nice: "Let's all work together and come up with reasonable compromises"In many areas there isn't common ground, one side is wrong, one side is right.I don't want the side that is right to compromise and be a little wrong so they can champion the 'get along' crowd.Also I do not think it is required to 'speak the same language' when it comes to conflict resolution. If I base my belief that a fetus is fully human, there isn't any compromise for abortion.So keep your "Can't we all get along" koolaide and pass me the "Grow a pair and fight for your convictions" Dr. Pepper in a 44 oz NASCAR cup.

[Balloon guy 158]

somewhat true of federal prisons, but it really depends on the state. in NY, 27% of state inmates are in on drug charges. federally, it's more around 5%, but that's still a hell of a lot of people.

'Drug charges' is kind of a large set to pretend casual pot heads makes up a signifigant sub set don't you think?

[checkymcfold 0]

Still lots of stupid sprinklesIn order for what you say to be true, you must make the case that the things the fundementalist want to do are wrong. If I want to reduce the number of abortions because I believe they are children and killing them is wrong, but you want to reduce abortions because they are unneccessary in this age of birth control, so what if you don't agree with my reason? There is no basis for your paranoia of why I came to the same conclusion as you.A Fundementalist in office would make Biblical based decisions, that value life and freedom. When would a person using the Bible do something that would be wrong because it was Biblically based?

i don't think you get my point. it's not about agreeing or disagreeing, which people will do regardless of why they think what they do--it's about the ability to debate issues that makes our democracy "function" (haha, i know). if you're using biblical principles to try to change my mind about anything, it is going to be literally impossible for you to get me to budge, because i don't buy your assumptions. if you want to actually be able to influence the views of anyone else, you have to be able to cast your argument in universally acceptable terms. if we give up on the idea that we're able to change each other's minds, then we may as well just do away with democracy as we know it and go authoritarian on our own asses, as long as we pick someone who's like most americans to be our dictator.

[Balloon guy 158]

i don't think you get my point. it's not about agreeing or disagreeing, which people will do regardless of why they think what they do--it's about the ability to debate issues that makes our democracy "function" (haha, i know). if you're using biblical principles to try to change my mind about anything, it is going to be literally impossible for you to get me to budge, because i don't buy your assumptions. if you want to actually be able to influence the views of anyone else, you have to be able to cast your argument in universally acceptable terms. if we give up on the idea that we're able to change each other's minds, then we may as well just do away with democracy as we know it and go authoritarian on our own asses, as long as we pick someone who's like most americans to be our dictator.

:Ending this debate stream because the other one is more in line with answering this already:

[vbnautilus 48]

Just because a person bases his beliefs on the Bible, their opinion on matters is now suspect because why? Because basing your opinion on your high school biology teacher or a funny Jon Stewart clip is more rational?

I'm gonna go ahead and answer 'yes' flat-out to this one.

[copernicus 0]

somewhat true of federal prisons, but it really depends on the state. in NY, 27% of state inmates are in on drug charges. federally, it's more around 5%, but that's still a hell of a lot of people.

they arent in on jail on simple posession of marijuana charges

[checkymcfold 0]

The song sounds nice: "Let's all work together and come up with reasonable compromises"In many areas there isn't common ground, one side is wrong, one side is right.I don't want the side that is right to compromise and be a little wrong so they can champion the 'get along' crowd.Also I do not think it is required to 'speak the same language' when it comes to conflict resolution. If I base my belief that a fetus is fully human, there isn't any compromise for abortion.So keep your "Can't we all get along" koolaide and pass me the "Grow a pair and fight for your convictions" Dr. Pepper in a 44 oz NASCAR cup.

if you want me to "grow a pair," i will. the sentiments you just described are absolutely annihilating the great thing that used to be america. our greatest achievements in american history have come after long debates, compromises (the great compromise, anyone?), and discussions. if you want to cultivate a new america that does away with the ideas of debate and compromise, fine, but it won't be a great country at all. it'll be a self-righteous twatbag bully of a nation that's hated by everyone else in the world and will lose its status as the greatest country in the world, then its economic power, and will finally fade into history just like so many other self-assured empires.oh, wait.

[Balloon guy 158]

I'm gonna go ahead and answer 'yes' flat-out to this one

Which explains why you are currently in politcal agreement with Lindsey Lohan and Pamela Anderson.

[Balloon guy 158]

if you want me to "grow a pair," i will. the sentiments you just described are absolutely annihilating the great thing that used to be america. our greatest achievements in american history have come after long debates, compromises (the great compromise, anyone?), and discussions. if you want to cultivate a new america that does away with the ideas of debate and compromise, fine, but it won't be a great country at all. it'll be a self-righteous twatbag bully of a nation that's hated by everyone else in the world and will lose its status as the greatest country in the world, then its economic power, and will finally fade into history just like so many other self-assured empires.oh, wait.

Neville Chamberlain called.He wants his opinion back.

[checkymcfold 0]

Neville Chamberlain called.He wants his opinion back.

sigh. this is precisely my point. at least your putting is bad enough to where you're voting the right way whether you believe in it or not.

[Nimue1995 1]

they arent in on jail on simple posession of marijuana charges

In our county, a person arrested on marijuana possession charges is far more likely to go to jail than a person arrested on their 3rd DUI.

[Balloon guy 158]

In our county, a person arrested on marijuana possession charges is far more likely to go to jail than a person arrested on their 3rd DUI.

Maybe in 1950But not today

[copernicus 0]

In our county, a person arrested on marijuana possession charges is far more likely to go to jail than a person arrested on their 3rd DUI.

change counties. That certainly isnt the case in civilized America.

[Nimue1995 1]

Maybe in 1950But not today

With all due respect BG, you don't live here. I could give you the court blotter from the local newspaper that would back up my assertion. In fact, DUI's don't get much more than a slap on the wrist unless they kill or injure someone. It's MADD hell here. But being the most conservative county in the state, they do take marijuana possession VERY SERIOUSLY and it's usually at least a day or 2 jail time for possession.

[Balloon guy 158]

sigh. this is precisely my point. at least your short irons are bad enough to where you're voting the right way whether you believe in it or not.

Again I will ask you, which political subject is so difficult to resolve because Fundementalist are stonewalling it because they are following God's will?Abortion is already shown to be devisive regardless of religious beliefs, unless you agree with Wiz Child and think just minority's children should be aborted because they are worthless to society

[vbnautilus 48]

Which explains why you are currently in politcal agreement with Lindsey Lohan and Pamela Anderson.

And why you are currently in scientific agreement with Nebuchadnezzar.

[checkymcfold 0]

they arent in on jail on simple posession of marijuana charges

enough are to cause a fuss about it.1.6% of all state inmates nationwide are held for marijuana charges ONLY as of 1997 (split about evenly for possession and other trafficking charges), according to a BJS study.according to the DOJ, in 1997 there were 1,528,041 state inmates in 1997.doing that math, we find that approximately 24,448 (i'll round down) state inmates were held nationwide for marijuana convictions ONLY. this is a big number.

[Balloon guy 158]

With all due respect BG, you don't live here. I could give you the court blotter from the local newspaper that would back up my assertion. In fact, DUI's don't get much more than a slap on the wrist unless they kill or injure someone. It's MADD hell here. But being the most conservative county in the state, they do take marijuana possession VERY SERIOUSLY and it's usually at least a day or 2 jail time for possession.

Then change your sentance to "In my backwards area that I choose toi live in'and not 'our country' because in the rest of the country, 2 DUIs and you will be in jail and small pot possesions are usaully just warned and released after they steal their pot.

[Balloon guy 158]

And why you are currently in scientific agreement with Nebuchadnezzar.

Not up to speed on Nebuchadnezzar's treatise on gravity could you link it for me?

[Balloon guy 158]

enough are to cause a fuss about it.1.6% of all state inmates nationwide are held for marijuana charges ONLY as of 1997 (split about evenly for possession and other trafficking charges), according to a BJS study.according to the DOJ, in 1997 there were 1,528,041 state inmates in 1997.doing that math, we find that approximately 24,448 (i'll round down) state inmates were held nationwide for marijuana convictions ONLY. this is a big number.

Is there any differentials between a guy with 2 joints and a case of malt liquor and a guy with 500 pounds in his attic and a subscription to High Times Magazines?

[checkymcfold 0]

Again I will ask you, which political subject is so difficult to resolve because Fundementalist are stonewalling it because they are following God's will?Abortion is already shown to be devisive regardless of religious beliefs, unless you agree with Wiz Child and think just minority's children should be aborted because they are worthless to society

abortion (i don't buy that it's "shown to be divisive regardless of religious beliefs" at all), gay rights, drug laws in various areas of the country, just off the top of my head.

[vbnautilus 48]

Not up to speed on Nebuchadnezzar's treatise on gravity could you link it for me?

Everything you need to know is in the bible.