Zach6668 513 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Well, I tried it using poker speak first, and logic, and what not.I've given up and gone to coloured letters instead. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Roughly the same as the odds as me opening my eyes and accepting that not all questions have one right answer, which is pretty remote.FYP Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Well, I tried it using poker speak first, and logic, and what not.I've given up and gone to coloured letters instead.Feel like racing at the special olympics? I'll win!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites
Acid_Knight 2 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Ya know, I'd actually be happier about this whole hand if Temporary Nuts was just saying:I think you should shove your draw becuase then the button will call off the rest of his stack and then hopefully the BB will fold and we can get HU and see both cards for another $7 while getting a good price and the play might increase my outs if a K is good and I might even fold out the NFD that the BB might hold, which would've really sucked if I played the hand more passively and the spade hit.That scenario would be fine. It's a move that I may or not choose to make, but betting fucking $7 more to put the button all in has to be the stupidest play available here next to folding.Call>Shove>Raise>Fold AINEC Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Call>Shove>Raise>Fold AINECqft Link to post Share on other sites
Danny Dingleberry 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 you know what, I was actually watching this hand, and when it happened, i placed my ear against the computer screen, where the king ten was located on the screen. I said, cards, what do you want the chips to do? and they told me they want the chips to call. argument over. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Call>Shove>Raise>Fold AINECThree way race? Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 party poker 6 players $0.10/0.25 blinds NL HoldemHero is CO with $36.15 and has agg image but haven't done anything crazy (yet), Villian is BB and has standard steady image.BB $26.45Button $12.65Folds to Hero, Hero Riases to $0.85 with K 10 , Button calls $0.85, SB folds, BB calls, $0.60.Pot: $2.65, 3 playersFlop: J 4 5 BB Checks, Hero bets $2.25, Button raises to $5, BB calls $5, Hero?Weak passive players might advocate a call. What I preach here is power poker. But let's not get all willy nilly throwing chips hand over fist. I like to go with the power poker plan of minimum raising, PPPOMR for short. Here's what happens when we min-raise (people that say mini suck at poker btw, it's min):1: We annoy the competition. Everyone hates a minraise. "WTF is that?" is a common reaction to seeing the minraise come out. That's a good thing.2. We get to let that shortstacking wussy decide if he wants to put himself all in. Call and leave $2 behind? I don't think so. That's power! 3. What Acid is completely disregarding in this post is crucial, BB has a full stack and is OOP. What do we do to people OOP in PPPOMR? You're God damn right, we min-raise them, and put them to a decision.Now what BB doesn't understand is this strategy for this hand is unexploitable! Pot odds? Sure we have them with the first call, but guess what?!!? WE STILL HAVE THEM after the min-raise. Gotchya bitch! Who could argue against playing in a completely unexploitable way? I don't have the answer. But clearly not a winning player (Motions head in direction of Acid Knight).I hope that this clears things up for everyone. Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Call>Shove>Raise>Fold AINECMinraise>Miniraise>Slightlybiggerthanminraise>raise>shove Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Weak passive players might advocate a call. What I preach here is power poker. But let's not get all willy nilly throwing chips hand over fist. I like to go with the power poker plan of minimum raising, PPPOMR for short. Here's what happens when we min-raise (people that say mini suck at poker btw, it's min):1: We annoy the competition. Everyone hates a minraise. "WTF is that?" is a common reaction to seeing the minraise come out. That's a good thing.2. We get to let that shortstacking wussy decide if he wants to put himself all in. Call and leave $2 behind? I don't think so. That's power! 3. What Acid is completely disregarding in this post is crucial, BB has a full stack and is OOP. What do we do to people OOP in PPPOMR? You're God damn right, we min-raise them, and put them to a decision.Now what BB doesn't understand is this strategy for this hand is unexploitable! Pot odds? Sure we have them with the first call, but guess what?!!? WE STILL HAVE THEM after the min-raise. Gotchya bitch! Who could argue against playing in a completely unexploitable way? I don't have the answer. But clearly not a winning player (Motions head in direction of Acid Knight).I hope that this clears things up for everyone.-dead-When the Button pushes and the BB just calls again to we 5 bet minraise? Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 -dead-When the Button pushes and the BB just calls again to we 5 bet minraise?These are the kind of questions that bring you to the next level. The answer is of course you minraise again. Let the BB have a chance to make a mistake, maybe he'll fold, maybe he'll misclick, or time out, who knows? Link to post Share on other sites
StPong 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Weak passive players might advocate a call. What I preach here is power poker. But let's not get all willy nilly throwing chips hand over fist. I like to go with the power poker plan of minimum raising, PPPOMR for short. Here's what happens when we min-raise (people that say mini suck at poker btw, it's min):1: We annoy the competition. Everyone hates a minraise. "WTF is that?" is a common reaction to seeing the minraise come out. That's a good thing.2. We get to let that shortstacking wussy decide if he wants to put himself all in. Call and leave $2 behind? I don't think so. That's power! 3. What Acid is completely disregarding in this post is crucial, BB has a full stack and is OOP. What do we do to people OOP in PPPOMR? You're God damn right, we min-raise them, and put them to a decision.Now what BB doesn't understand is this strategy for this hand is unexploitable! Pot odds? Sure we have them with the first call, but guess what?!!? WE STILL HAVE THEM after the min-raise. Gotchya bitch! Who could argue against playing in a completely unexploitable way? I don't have the answer. But clearly not a winning player (Motions head in direction of Acid Knight).I hope that this clears things up for everyone.What are we accomplishing with a minraise other than annoying people? How does this put BB to a decision? Link to post Share on other sites
Zach6668 513 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I'm pretty sure for the 5th raise, it must be a minraise + 1 BB. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 These are the kind of questions that bring you to the next level. The answer is of course you minraise again. Let the BB have a chance to make a mistake, maybe he'll fold, maybe he'll misclick, or time out, who knows?Aha! But what if the BB is in fact Mike Ditka? Link to post Share on other sites
StPong 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 These are the kind of questions that bring you to the next level. The answer is of course you minraise again. Let the BB have a chance to make a mistake, maybe he'll fold, maybe he'll misclick, or time out, who knows?wait...wtf? Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 What are we accomplishing with a minraise other than annoying people? How does this put BB to a decision?Um, the action is back on him. When the action is on you, you must decide whether, to fold, call, or raise. Thus a decision.Next question? Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Aha! But what if the BB is in fact Mike Ditka?Bears, Bears, Bears, Bulls, Bears, Bears, Bears.What was the question? Link to post Share on other sites
StPong 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Um, the action is back on him. When the action is on you, you must decide whether, to fold, call, or raise. Thus a decision.Next question?I don't understand...he can't fold, a call doesn't help or hurt us, and a raise might put US in a tough spot.... Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I don't understand...he can't fold, a call doesn't help or hurt us, and a raise might put US in a tough spot....Only if the BB min-raises are we in a tough spot, but I'm fairly certain we just min-raise him back. Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I don't understand...he can't fold, a call doesn't help or hurt us, and a raise might put US in a tough spot....Why can't he fold? If you are never folding to minraises I'd take a long look into your own game. Those of us that play PPPOMR are no slouches. These minraises do and are working everyday.A call brings us to the next street, where we can min-bet or min-raise depending on what BB does.If he raises into us! We have a flush draw and an overcard, assuming he puts us all in we call (because we can't minraise), but if he makes the foolish mistake of giving us room to minraise him, hell hath no fury like a 5/6bet minraise on the flop. Link to post Share on other sites
Danny Dingleberry 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I think we call, hoping it will be checked to us on the turn, from there, assuming we miss our hand, (actually, even if we make our hand) we open fold, for metagame and table image considerations. Link to post Share on other sites
tskillz187 0 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I think we call, hoping it will be checked to us on the turn, from there, assuming we miss our hand, (actually, even if we make our hand) we open fold, for metagame and table image considerations.I only open fold 1 card. The minimum needed to hit the muck to declare my hand dead. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 I only open fold 1 card. The minimum needed to hit the muck to declare my hand dead.You guys are stupid, obviously you put all but one chip in, and fold to an all-in because it can only be the nut flush, thereby saving $!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites
mtdesmoines 3 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 Minraise>Miniraise>Slightlybiggerthanminraise>raise>shoveIf we keep minraising, we've always got pot odds. Link to post Share on other sites
Temporary Nuts 1 Posted October 19, 2007 Share Posted October 19, 2007 FWIW the flop c-bet should be a min bet Link to post Share on other sites
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