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There was that guy who never comes in here anymore after I put him on ignore, the one that would ask questions that always went in circles and never got anywhere. I can't think of his name, put him on ignore for awhile and then ended up taking him off and having some decent discussions. I was wrong about him in the end, I think.
BWToth?
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Right. And right. So this is where I get confused about the ambiguity.What does the Bible say? Is it a set age regardless of mental capacity and understanding or is it determined by something else? And what indicators should we humans use to know when a child is over that age of responsibility?
The Bible doesn't ever mention it, which is why Lois' "I know I'm correct about this" attitude is troubling to me.
BWToth?
and The Shank
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What is your next excuse for being you?
And what is yours?I've never once lashed out at anyone on these forums who hasn't lashed out at me or someone else who hasn't deserve. All in all, I've been a bit mean to maybe... three people... you and brvheart being two of them.And honestly, I have nothing against you guys. My own personality is a responsive one. You can, obviously, tell that when attacked, I respond. You can also admit that I didn't start this idiotic flame war. You can also see where most of my "attacks" are ended by points saying how foolish this "battle" is.I'm a light hearted, sarcastic person who is serious about those topics I'm passionate about. I don't look to argue with people... that would imply that I don't have solid stances on anything I talk about. Which is more then wrong, I can give you my own personal solid stances on anything I discuss... most of which are logical and reasonable to most people.I'm not a flaming liberal who sits in my mother's basement typing away and wasting my life on an internet forum. I'm a 21 year old guy living in an apartment and working for a living (albeit the fact that I'm a poker dealer, but a job is a job). Your assumptions about my immaturity due to my age are baseless, too. Common stereotypes have rarely ever applied to me.So let's stop this idiotic flame war and let's discuss topics of religion. If I make a sarcastic (even mean) comment about Christianity, take it for what it is and let's just discuss the topic. If I'm feeling a bit sarcastic and I make a one-sentence goofy statement that doesn't really say anything, then don't respond to it.Be an adult and let's talk about religion.
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Right. And right. So this is where I get confused about the ambiguity.What does the Bible say? Is it a set age regardless of mental capacity and understanding or is it determined by something else? And what indicators should we humans use to know when a child is over that age of responsibility?
In regards to human assumption, 13.But in regards to God's decision that they are responsible for their on actions, that only God has an exact time on, and I bet His decision is right. God is not bound by a set age, and He is not going to tell us what each individuals time is.The part of the Bible that says it best probably is where it says: "God is not willing that any should perish, but that all come to salvation." He really wants everyone in heaven.This is why it is important that we "tell the good news" to all, and for the most part the Christian church has done a good job of doing this. End of the Spear was a good movie I just watched about this.
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But in regards to God's decision that they are responsible for their on actions, that only God has an exact time on, and I bet His decision is right. God is not bound by a set age, and He is not going to tell us what each individuals time is.The part of the Bible that says it best probably is where it says: "God is not willing that any should perish, but that all come to salvation." He really wants everyone in heaven.
If I were a Christian, I would agree with the intelligent thought that "God is the judge and how He judges is up to Him". To try and talk/assume about what an unfathomable being would use as rules for when a person is able to sin (or not) seems futile, but is interesting nonetheless.The second part is what gets me. Do we now start the discussion on "If God wanted everyone in heaven, then why not JUST have a heaven where everyone goes when they die?"?Edit: I have a feeling that the discussion would just end up saying "God has a master plan that none of us could understand" and that we'll really get nowhere with it. End results being that agnostic/atheists will just disagree with Christians on whether the point is a valid one or not.
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The Bible doesn't ever mention it, which is why Lois' "I know I'm correct about this" attitude is troubling to me.and The Shank
The bible always mentions salvation being connected to men and women. Show me one example of it being connected to children, and I will change my mind in an instant. The fact is when the New Testament speaks of children it speaks of them in a protective manner, and pretty simple instructions- honour they father and mother, obey the lord, but never connected to a the threat of hell.
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And what is yours?I've never once lashed out at anyone on these forums who hasn't lashed out at me or someone else who hasn't deserve. All in all, I've been a bit mean to maybe... three people... you and brvheart being two of them.And honestly, I have nothing against you guys. My own personality is a responsive one. You can, obviously, tell that when attacked, I respond. You can also admit that I didn't start this idiotic flame war. You can also see where most of my "attacks" are ended by points saying how foolish this "battle" is.I'm a light hearted, sarcastic person who is serious about those topics I'm passionate about. I don't look to argue with people... that would imply that I don't have solid stances on anything I talk about. Which is more then wrong, I can give you my own personal solid stances on anything I discuss... most of which are logical and reasonable to most people.I'm not a flaming liberal who sits in my mother's basement typing away and wasting my life on an internet forum. I'm a 21 year old guy living in an apartment and working for a living (albeit the fact that I'm a poker dealer, but a job is a job). Your assumptions about my immaturity due to my age are baseless, too. Common stereotypes have rarely ever applied to me.So let's stop this idiotic flame war and let's discuss topics of religion. If I make a sarcastic (even mean) comment about Christianity, take it for what it is and let's just discuss the topic. If I'm feeling a bit sarcastic and I make a one-sentence goofy statement that doesn't really say anything, then don't respond to it.Be an adult and let's talk about religion.
Was this a flame war? I wasn't aware. I stated that I was through dealing with you, end of story. I am completey comfortable with that decision.
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And what is yours?I've never once lashed out at anyone on these forums who hasn't lashed out at me or someone else who hasn't deserve. All in all, I've been a bit mean to maybe... three people... you and brvheart being two of them.And honestly, I have nothing against you guys. My own personality is a responsive one. You can, obviously, tell that when attacked, I respond. You can also admit that I didn't start this idiotic flame war. You can also see where most of my "attacks" are ended by points saying how foolish this "battle" is.I'm a light hearted, sarcastic person who is serious about those topics I'm passionate about. I don't look to argue with people... that would imply that I don't have solid stances on anything I talk about. Which is more then wrong, I can give you my own personal solid stances on anything I discuss... most of which are logical and reasonable to most people.I'm not a flaming liberal who sits in my mother's basement typing away and wasting my life on an internet forum. I'm a 21 year old guy living in an apartment and working for a living (albeit the fact that I'm a poker dealer, but a job is a job). Your assumptions about my immaturity due to my age are baseless, too. Common stereotypes have rarely ever applied to me.So let's stop this idiotic flame war and let's discuss topics of religion. If I make a sarcastic (even mean) comment about Christianity, take it for what it is and let's just discuss the topic. If I'm feeling a bit sarcastic and I make a one-sentence goofy statement that doesn't really say anything, then don't respond to it.Be an adult and let's talk about religion.
you can't act like a 3rd grader for ten paragraphs and then in the last sentence say... "Lois, quit being immature... look how mature I am." I would like to think that this is obvious. If you need me to quote some of your various posts that prove you're probably the most immature poster in the religion forums, I would be happy to. I'm not saying you never have decent points, I don't know if you do as I basically ignore the majority of your posts, but when you say things like the bolded part above it's just ridiculous.
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Cannot even imagine the plight that "Christians" found themselves in when they came over here looking for freedom, found a place and started to build. The natives were cool at first, but then the natives decided that it would be best to just start killing them. Women, children, didn't matter. These were brutal warriors. What is a good christian to do? Protect your family, and eliminate the threat. Be peaceful, yes, but don't be stupid. I don't see how there was any other choice, and frankly history agrees with me.
Renae introduced us to Eddie Izzard, who I think has something apropos to say.We built up empires. We stole countries. That's what you do. That how you build an empire. We stole countries with the cunning use of flags. Yeah.You just sail around the world and stick a flag in it."I claim India for Britain!"And they go, "You can't claim us, we live here. 500 million of us.""Do you have a flag?""We don't need a bloody flag. It's our country, you *******.""No flag - No country. You can't have one. That's the rules . . . that I've just made up. And I'm backing it up with this gun that was lent from the National Rifle Association."
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Renae introduced us to Eddie Izzard, who I think has something apropos to say.We built up empires. We stole countries. That's what you do. That how you build an empire. We stole countries with the cunning use of flags. Yeah.You just sail around the world and stick a flag in it."I claim India for Britain!"And they go, "You can't claim us, we live here. 500 million of us.""Do you have a flag?""We don't need a bloody flag. It's our country, you *******.""No flag - No country. You can't have one. That's the rules . . . that I've just made up. And I'm backing it up with this gun that was lent from the National Rifle Association."
So then no comment on how it was peaceful until Indians started killing families? Just a quote from a comedian? O.K.
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If I were a Christian, I would agree with the intelligent thought that "God is the judge and how He judges is up to Him". To try and talk/assume about what an unfathomable being would use as rules for when a person is able to sin (or not) seems futile, but is interesting nonetheless.The second part is what gets me. Do we now start the discussion on "If God wanted everyone in heaven, then why not JUST have a heaven where everyone goes when they die?"?Edit: I have a feeling that the discussion would just end up saying "God has a master plan that none of us could understand" and that we'll really get nowhere with it. End results being that agnostic/atheists will just disagree with Christians on whether the point is a valid one or not.
There is a part in Matthew where Christ is telling a parable about seperating believers and nonbeilievers on judgement day.He says to the believers; "Go to the place I have prepared for you."He tells the non-believers: "Go to the place we prepared for the devil and his angels" So heaven was made for us, and us for heaven. Hell was not made for us.Freedom of choice allows people to reject heaven.I agree that this is a hard thing. Which is why I cringe when I see people be flipant about it. God is not afraid of serious questions, and He has answers that will meet any problems, you only have to be open enough to ask Him.Don't trust boneheads like me to answer your serious questions, it's too important to leave to any man.
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So then no comment on how it was peaceful until Indians started killing families? Just a quote from a comedian? O.K.
It is a comment on that. Moving onto land that someone else lives upon isn't entirely a peaceful act. If I come and build a house in your backyard, you're going to question that. You might even defend your territory.
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It is a comment on that. Moving onto land that someone else lives upon isn't entirely a peaceful act. If I come and build a house in your backyard, you're going to question that. You might even defend your territory.
It was a peaceful act, by the Indians own admission. The indians did not believe that they owned the land anymore than we did, they pretty much just roamed around. What turned them against the white man was when the idea hit that the white man was going to pick and choose where he wanted to stay, and then call it his land- which would be fine, because the indians believed that no one had a claim to the land, not even them. However, this new idea of land ownership bothered them so much the beast came out and they started doing there thing, which was beyond brutal. Some of these- alot of these- tribes were just pure savages. What were the settlers to do? Leave- no. It was land that by the indians own admission was nobodies. So, they eradicated the threat. Incidentally, I read 500 plus books on these issues as a kid, so good luck.
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It was a peaceful act, by the Indians own admission. The indians did not believe that they owned the land anymore than we did, they pretty much just roamed around. What turned them against the white man was when the idea hit that the white man was going to pick and choose where he wanted to stay, and then call it his land- which would be fine, because the indians believed that no one had a claim to the land, not even them. However, this new idea of land ownership bothered them so much the beast came out and they started doing there thing, which was beyond brutal.
Land ownership as an abstract concept probably didn't bother them any. I'm sure the natives didn't give a crap about people owning land in Europe. The conflict arose because the Europeans denied them use of this particular land which provided for them.I don't feel that the Native Americans are uniquely victims in this process. Societies have fought for the control of land for a long, long time. I think the original point was that the Europeans' Christianity didn't stop this process.
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Incidentally, I read 500 plus books on these issues as a kid, so good luck.
My favorite is "Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee." Good stuff.
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My favorite is "Bury my Heart at Wounded Knee." Good stuff.
Do you remember that movie they showed in like 4th grade,"I will fight no more forever", about the Nez Perce Tribe? I don't even remember how that was spelled, but what a great movie. Good book, too.
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Land ownership as an abstract concept probably didn't bother them any. I'm sure the natives didn't give a crap about people owning land in Europe. The conflict arose because the Europeans denied them use of this particular land which provided for them.I don't feel that the Native Americans are uniquely victims in this process. Societies have fought for the control of land for a long, long time. I think the original point was that the Europeans' Christianity didn't stop this process.
Last time I checked Christians don't like getting raped and killed either. It can cause them to do unchristianlike things. Why? Because they are getting raped and murdered. :D:club:
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Last time I checked Christians don't like getting raped and killed either. It can cause them to do unchristianlike things. Why? Because they are getting raped and murdered. :D:club:
  1. I thought you hypothesized that Christians don't get raped.
  2. Turning the other cheek is hypothetical until some strikes the first cheek.

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  1. I thought you hypothesized that Christians don't get raped.
  2. Turning the other cheek is hypothetical until some strikes the first cheek.

They don't. Now you are getting the point. Maybe, but if not I will hold your hand. Sometimes, people claiming to be christians..psssttt..come closer...closer....closer..(Lois picks up a bullhorn and puts it next to your ear) NOT REALLY CHRISTIANS!!!!! Do ya get me, sweetheart? Either way,in the situation, if you actually knew the history, you would realize that it was alot deeper than the white man killed indians. Glad to have been of some help.
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They don't. Now you are getting the point. Maybe, but if not I will hold your hand. Sometimes, people claiming to be christians..psssttt..come closer...closer....closer..(Lois picks up a bullhorn and puts it next to your ear) NOT REALLY CHRISTIANS!!!!!
Sometimes I get the feeling you haven't read your own posts. Maybe you're just trolling. I have no idea.When you make a statement about Christians, these other people who falsely claim to be Christians are completely irrelevant. I feel a No True Scottsman Fallacy is going to pop up here pretty soon. I'd suggest we don't go there.
Do ya get me, sweetheart? Either way,in the situation, if you actually knew the history, you would realize that it was alot deeper than the white man killed indians.
That's a strawman.
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They don't. Now you are getting the point. Maybe, but if not I will hold your hand. Sometimes, people claiming to be christians..psssttt..come closer...closer....closer..(Lois picks up a bullhorn and puts it next to your ear) NOT REALLY CHRISTIANS!!!!! Do ya get me, sweetheart? Either way,in the situation, if you actually knew the history, you would realize that it was alot deeper than the white man killed indians. Glad to have been of some help.
What the crap are you talking about? Maybe I'm not understanding. Are you saying that it's not possible for a true born again believer to be raped? I'm assuming that I'm just misunderstanding.
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