Rams Reply

[nutzbuster 7]

The lessons learned here seem obvious.1. Make sure you do your homework before accepting a wager from Phil Ivey (or anyone for that matter).2. If you agree to the wager, then smell a rat ...BUT KEEP PLAYING, then you only have yourself to blame.Pay the man Ram.

[TheGuvnor 0]

NO RAM SHOULDNT HAVE TO PAYIVEY IS A CHEAT AND A SWINDLERIN MY BUSINESS HE WOULD BE EATEN ALIVE

[flyingdonkey 0]

NO RAM SHOULDNT HAVE TO PAYIVEY IS A CHEAT AND A SWINDLERIN MY BUSINESS HE WOULD BE EATEN ALIVE

Sooooooo now you're in the cannibal business? Make up your mind sir!

[Balloon guy 158]

Sooooooo now you're in the cannibal business?

I wonder how the benefits are? Other than the free clothes I mean

[pokerfriendly 0]

ok wtf this can't be real, he really thinks he should'nt pay. even if he got hustled he should pay!!there so many wimps gambling these days make me sad about my choices of being a professional hustler

[Andr4w 0]

If Phil Ivey hustled me so blatantly the only thing he'd get is a punch in the face. I can't beleive you guys actually think its ok to hustle someone so openly and expect to be paid!

[flyingdonkey 0]

Wow, Ram isn't the sharpest tool in the shed... even his own wife thought he was an idiot for continuing to play.

[Sodabone 0]

I love it on here. "I iz a pRoFessIONAL hUstler" etc...All the people who are saying the above are just Daniel 'oh no, I am not going bald - honest' Negreanu fan boys and the only thing they have 'Hustled' in reality is their Mothers and Fathers for pocket money.FTR Greenstein, once he knew the WHOLE story, distanced himself from Ivey's argument in this scam.

[Sodabone 0]

A sucker is born every minute. Pay the man his money.I used to play pool and hustle a lot. If you see a mark, you take it down. If you don’t, another shark will. Happens every day in pool halls, Wall Street, casinos etc…This was set up nicely and Ivey was going through the motions. Ram had no chance, he continued because of stupidity, mad tilt and stubbornness. Ivey just showed that he’s a classless poker celebrity and really doesn’t care how he’s being portrayed. Hey, who gives a s.h.it “all about getting paid biatch!” Ivey “the hustler” pwned Ram but may have burned a lot of bridges. It may cost him even more money down the road. If there was ever going to be another poker boom, his image has been tarnished. Some sponsors may pass on him, not like cares anyways.Great hustlers get paid by suckers, without even letting them know they just got hustled. Ivey is not great yet.

Some tool posted this on The Hendon Mob forum.

Seriously.....The fact is.... Ram got hustled.Regardless...... He was getting hustled and lost alot of money.After the first round he thought something was up and still played.After they played he found out his "thoughts" were true and he did get hustled.Regardless..... he owes this money.He considered Phil his friend and his friend lied. Real friends do not lie to true friends....Pay the money..... Everyone aware of this situation already thinks you are a joke for backing out, regardless of any hustling or lies..... you lost and you owe.I cannot wait until you get to America and get the cold shoulder from everyone.I also look forward to the next time you and Daniel are sitting at the same table and he busts your terriost ***.Qball.

[MikeJohnson724 0]

LOL @ ALL THE HENDON MOB PEOPLE COMMING OVER HERE TO SAY RAM IS RIGHT. The first 3 pages were all people with 11 posts lmao. Ram, you got whooped bro. Pay the **** up. I agree with your wife Ram. WHY DIDNT YOU GET OFF THE COURSE? the answer is because your ego wouldn't let you.I said it once i will say it again PAY UP.

[Sodabone 0]

LOL @ ALL THE HENDON MOB PEOPLE COMMING OVER HERE TO SAY RAM IS RIGHT. The first 3 pages were all people with 11 posts lmao. Ram, you got whooped bro. Pay the **** up. I agree with your wife Ram. WHY DIDNT YOU GET OFF THE COURSE? the answer is because your ego wouldn't let you.I said it once i will say it again PAY UP.

Would you pay?

[MikeJohnson724 0]

I am not dumb enough to play for those kind of stakes without researching phils game. Ram is a moron for playing that high without finding out what phil has been up to the past 6 months. I would have negotiated after the first 9 holes of getting smoked. Also, I wouldn't have kept playing after getting killed. I definitely wouldn't have played for higher stakes. The answer to would I pay is...Obviously Yes. after the first 9 holes I would have gotten up and went to the bar and had a drink. After a few days of golf, I would also pay, but fortunately I am not stupid enough to dig myself a hole that big.

[Jam-Fly 8]

Dignified and pertinent response? Ram didn't say anything we didn't already know from that side.But from his post I now know Barry Greenstein is on Phil's side also.Along with:Daniel NegreanuTodd BrunsonDoyle BrunsonAnd a lot of other pros.Ram will man up and pay sooner or later.

lol, I dont see any relevance in 'who's on who's side'

[Sodabone 0]

I am not dumb enough to play for those kind of stakes without researching phils game. Ram is a moron for playing that high without finding out what phil has been up to the past 6 months. I would have negotiated after the first 9 holes of getting smoked. Also, I wouldn't have kept playing after getting killed. I definitely wouldn't have played for higher stakes. The answer to would I pay is...Obviously Yes. after the first 9 holes I would have gotten up and went to the bar and had a drink. After a few days of golf, I would also pay, but fortunately I am not stupid enough to dig myself a hole that big.

[tobytobey 0]

Finally - a rational and coherent account of what really happened. And not one iota of conjecture or hearsay.

And who are you to call anyone a welcher????Danielle made a mistake posting and now Ram has given a dignified andpertinent reply.

I love how one side of a story can be totally dismissed as being incorrect and the other side of a story is "a rational and coherent account.......". I'm also a HUGE fan of adolescent name calling "Danielle". I mean its so witty and classy. Without it, his comment would have been immediately disregarded.There are truly only a handful of people who know the real story and the matter should be left with them.

[Andr4w 0]

Ivey is a cheating c-u-n-t, I hope he gets lots of **** for this one.

[JoeyJoJo 18]

I'm also a HUGE fan of adolescent name calling "Danielle". I mean its so witty and classy. Without it, his comment would have been immediately disregarded.

Well, well, well, if it isn't our little friend Danielle. What's the matter? Your mommy isn't here to dress you?

[Jam-Fly 8]

Ivey is a complete low life scumbag who hussles his friends. Ram should pay his debt and consider it an expensive life lesson.Also, for everyone that believes in Karma, Ivey should get one outed on the bubble in the main event for the next 3yrs.Just because it's a name player like 'Phil Ivey' doesn't make him any better than the trebor guy who hustled $50. If he's a scumbag, he's a scumbag, but Phil Ivey fans shouldn't make excuses and should accept that he is a low life./

[James D 0]

I don't particularly care about the outcome of this any more... they'll settle it, and all be fine in the end. But I will say that my opinion of Phil Ivey has changed a lot. Especially after watching that clip of him at the Aussie Millions cash game talking about it.Is he a great gambler? - Yes. Would I trust him in any way, even away from the poker table? - Nope.I guess in the interests of fairness, I'll say that they were definately stupid to get involved in something that, apparently, everyone else knew about - that Ivey had been coached and had improved drastically. So yeah, they're dumb.And guys.. please stop all this BS about Euro v USA. That's not even the issue. It's about 3/4 guys and a golf game, and that's it. If you are basing your decisions purely on where you are from, then it's ridiculously narrow-minded.

[milbucksfans 0]

Could we hear some more from the bare-knuckle boxer please?

[sfighter9 0]

I love how one side of a story can be totally dismissed as being incorrect and the other side of a story is "a rational and coherent account.......". I'm also a HUGE fan of adolescent name calling "Danielle". I mean its so witty and classy. Without it, his comment would have been immediately disregarded.There are truly only a handful of people who know the real story and the matter should be left with them.

And this is why Danielle made an error of judgement getting involved.Can any, even just one, of Danielle's sycophants not see he made a mistake?...........

[farmist 0]

Could we hear some more from the bare-knuckle boxer please?

No doubt...I wanna hear more stories of how he :BEATS THE YANKS AND MAKES THEM CRY

[tskillz187 0]

And this is why Danielle made an error of judgement getting involved.Can any, even just one, of Danielle's sycophants not see he made a mistake?...........

Meh, Daniel said Ivey asked him to tell that side through his blog, so if that's the case then you can't be too mad he got involved. Daniel says stuff a lot of times without full information, I'm not sure I like that about him too much. With that said you can't honestly say Negreanu would knowingly back something that was incorrect/not up to snuff. Anyways, I have never really golfed so I don't know the rules of betting and junk. It seems odd to me Ram wouldn't notice significant improvement and that he would be so ignorant of Ivey's game yet play for high stakes, especially when it was apparent that SO many people knew of Ivey's improvement.That being said what Ivey did was pretty garbage, IMO. But then again I have no clue what is acceptable and unacceptable behavior regarding golf betting. And this is where the real argument is, is it okay to lie about your handicap and hustle someone? Most people say no, but there was certainly a point on the spectrum where Ram knew he had the bad side of the bet and pushed trying to get some of his losses back.I don't really know where I stand other than I think it's a crappy spot that Ivey put Ram in.Edit: I think Danielle is funny.

[farmist 0]

We are discussing something that we cannot possibly validate. Daniel said something in his blog, and Ram replied on his own. Does that make any of it 100% factual? If what Ram said was true, then Ivey hustled him...but did not cheat. Cheating and hustling are two very different things.

[Pot Odds RAC 23]

I never expected to see such a prejudiced remark on a public forum. You should be ashamed of yourself.Just because a person is a member of a particular group does not mean that person's opinions are wrong or invalid.I believe Hitler made that assumption many years ago.

Amazingly ignorant reply.I read Ram's entire post and am shocked that he could have made such a statement with a straight face. Incidentally the Fan Boy mentality over on The Mob is laughable. I know some people here are fan struck with DN, but there is much more rational debate here. They slam the FDP over there and then come here and try and support RAM while disrespecting DN. Nice.Specifically to Ram's post..."My second point is regarding raising the stakes. At the start I wanted to play $10,000 a hole and Phil wanted to play bigger. We agreed to play $20,000 a hole singles and doubles. By the end of the first round we were playing for $25,000 a hole. This carried on to near the end of the second day. When it looked like Mark had had enough I offered to take his side of the remaining bet and put it on to the singles. Phil wanted to play both bets for $50,000 so he was the one who actually wanted to raise the stakes. We ended up playing $50,000 on the singles for another two holes before Mark walked off and then I took his doubles bet for the remaining 4 or 5 holes."He seems to complain about Ivey wanting to set higher stakes, but then accepted the stakes anyway. What a degenerate gambler this guy seems to be. Even his wife is disappointed in his actions. He played for MULTIPLE days and lost his butt, throwing more money at his lack of golf skills. How do you allow yourself to get hustled for a matter of DAYS?"All of these things taken into account I later worked out I was losing over 20 shots per round which just shows this for exactly what it is. To be playing 5 shots out would be bad enough but that is blatantly ridiculous." Is he expecting us to believe that Ivey go 20 strokes better in a matter of months?!? "As far as I am concerned it’s a void game"Yeah, sure you do.Bottom line, Ram lost and now wants to welch out of a bet.What a total scumbag.