Sit N Go Catch 22

[NEtwowilldo 0]

This is not a specific question, but something like this comes up often enough that I have to ask about it.Hypothetically:Six handed in turbo Sit N GoBlinds 50-100We are on the button with 1,000.We hold A 4 offsuit.The blinds have 2500 each.We cant: 1. Raise to 300- Looks like a steal and I think we have to fold to an all in re-raise getting just under 2 to 1, and could easily be a 3 to 1 dog. Also folding to reraise after a button raise is bad for image.2. Call- Defines our hand as weak and we have no chance of winning the pot preflop.3. Go All In- They will only call off that big of a raise and for that much of their stack with a hand that crushes ours.4. Fold- Any Ace-high is usually the best hand against the blinds.Seems like there is no right play but we have to do something.Obviously everything is situational and read dependant (Blinds weak-tight, or capable of re-steals?) But in general what's your play?I was thinking that if we push we are risking 1000 to win 150, or 15% of our stack. Thus our hand would have to the best hand 85% of the time to make this profitable? Is A 4 good here 85% of the time? Is that reasoning even correct?This always seems to be a tough decision for me.What are your thoughts?

[CobaltBlue 662]

I was thinking that if we push we are risking 1000 to win 150, or 15% of our stack. Thus our hand would have to the best hand 85% of the time to make this profitable? Is A 4 good here 85% of the time? Is that reasoning even correct?

PokerStove lists A4o as a top 35% hand. That said, there are plenty of "better" hands that should fold to our push. The blinds should really only be calling with the top 5-7% of hands. If you add the chances of one of the blinds having one of those hands, the push is slightly profitable.

[simo_8ball 0]

http://www.thepokerhaus.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1863This is a very similar example where I show that shoving is better than folding. I haven't developed the arguments for calling or making a smaller raise, but I believe it is relatively intuitive that shoving is better.

[iowahawk09 0]

Fold anything below AJ...it only leads to trouble....and in some cases, kick in AJ-AK

[simo_8ball 0]

Fold anything below AJ...it only leads to trouble....and in some cases, kick in AJ-AK

What?

[ChrisRichey 1]

Fold anything below AJ...it only leads to trouble....and in some cases, kick in AJ-AK

No.

[copernicus 0]

I'll be very surprised if the answer is anything but push. Youre ahead about 75% of the time, with about a 10% chance of a dominating Ace behind you, theres about a 15% chance of a pair behind you and you arent a huge dog unless they are Aces. (Those are off the top of my head with no sleep last night...correct me if Im way off!) I want a call here, and hope that it looks like a steal and get a call from KQ, KJ etc. If its folded we bought another rounds. A limp doesnt help us figure out what to do when one of the blinds raises or leads the flop.A standard raise is almost unfoldable on the flop anyway.Edit after reading the rest of the OP....the math is wrong about needing the "Best hand" 85% of the time, since it ignores fold equity and ignores the cash EV improvement from doubling up when you do win.Edit after reading iowahawks response...lets give him the benefit of the doubt and assume it was sarcasm

[TwoFourOffsuit 0]

If we're that short and first-in from the button, we may as well push.Though if you're in this sort of position frequently enough to ask the question, I think you have a much bigger general dilemma than how to play A4o on the button vs the blinds.

[NEtwowilldo 0]

If we're that short and first-in from the button, we may as well push.Though if you're in this sort of position frequently enough to ask the question, I think you have a much bigger general dilemma than how to play A4o on the button vs the blinds.

It's not like I blind myself to death in every sit n go I enter, but sometimes you lose a race or whatever. No need to get personal.

[TwoFourOffsuit 0]

Not meant to be personal. Just sayin.

[SlackerInc 0]

I'll be very surprised if the answer is anything but push. Youre ahead about 75% of the time, with about a 10% chance of a dominating Ace behind you, theres about a 15% chance of a pair behind you and you arent a huge dog unless they are Aces. (Those are off the top of my head with no sleep last night...correct me if Im way off!) I want a call here, and hope that it looks like a steal and get a call from KQ, KJ etc. If its folded we bought another rounds. A limp doesnt help us figure out what to do when one of the blinds raises or leads the flop.A standard raise is almost unfoldable on the flop anyway.Edit after reading the rest of the OP....the math is wrong about needing the "Best hand" 85% of the time, since it ignores fold equity and ignores the cash EV improvement from doubling up when you do win.Edit after reading iowahawks response...lets give him the benefit of the doubt and assume it was sarcasm

QFT, except I'm not so sure I want a call. I'd be happy to add 15% to my stack without a fight and move on to the next hand.