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http://www.queerty.c...layer-20130305/

 

 

Looks like Josh Gorges might be coming out as the first openly GAY NHL player..

 

Good for him, it cant be easy for him but its a very positive thing to happen.

 

It's not true.

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The bolded part is evidently now public. I was not aware. An excerpt from the press conference during the donation pledge....   At Wednesday’s announcement, P.K. was filled with emotion as he talked

This is not the Leafs thread...we don't celebrate every little accomplishment.

Doesn't really matter though. If he creates 5 goals and costs his team 4 goals, he is still more valuable than a super shut down defenseman who never gives up a goal but who never creates a goal for e

That story does not appear to have any basis, but it wouldn't be surprising at all if the first openly gay player was an NHL'er (since the sport is more Canadian than the others, and we're generally more progressive, and because of the amazing stuff being done by You Can Play). It would be doubly unsurprising if that player came from the very progressive city of Montreal (born or playing).

 

It'll happen sooner or later, and I look forward to it being the first of many. Hopefully anyone out there "waiting" for someone else to be first either decides to step up first, or when someone else does, they step up quickly second, so that the first person isn't out there alone for too long.

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That story does not appear to have any basis, but it wouldn't be surprising at all if the first openly gay player was an NHL'er (since the sport is more Canadian than the others, and we're generally more progressive, and because of the amazing stuff being done by You Can Play). It would be doubly unsurprising if that player came from the very progressive city of Montreal (born or playing).

 

It'll happen sooner or later, and I look forward to it being the first of many. Hopefully anyone out there "waiting" for someone else to be first either decides to step up first, or when someone else does, they step up quickly second, so that the first person isn't out there alone for too long.

 

I agree with you totally..Its just that even with all the progress hockey has made, I am sure the hockey dressing room is one of the most backward, racist, homophobic places of society. It has to be very difficult for a guy to come out

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I agree with you totally..Its just that even with all the progress hockey has made, I am sure the hockey dressing room is one of the most backward, racist, homophobic places of society. It has to be very difficult for a guy to come out

 

I'm not sure I would say that. I'm sure there are racist and homophobic jokes made, but I'm not willing to say that it is racist or homophobic. These guys are a team. If some rookie said he was gay, then walked into a dressing room, it might be a difficult situation. But if an existing player in a strong room decided to come out, I think (most) of his teammates would provide a lot of support.

 

I hope some player holds a press conference to announce that he's heterosexual.

 

Good call, because there's lots of heterosexual kids out there really desperate for role models and community leaders.

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Good call, because there's lots of heterosexual kids out there really desperate for role models and community leaders.

 

I laughed, I agreed, and then sadly, I think I realized that actaully there are a lot of heterosexual kids that need role models+community leaders too.

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I laughed, I agreed, and then sadly, I think I realized that actaully there are a lot of heterosexual kids that need role models+community leaders too.

 

Well, that is true I suppose, but the point is that there are plenty of people out there. If Shane Doan (random person who is probably a good role model) who is already married and has kids (I have no idea if this is true) wants to announce that he is heterosexual, and that he is happy to be a role model for all those confused or abused heterosexual kids out there, then I would applaud Doan for that.

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What kind of society is it when we need to designate role model status on whether someone prefers anal sex over vaginal sex?

 

Perhaps focusing on the actual issues and morals of community leaders rather than their sexual preferences would be better. Call me crazy.

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What kind of society is it when we need to designate role model status on whether someone prefers anal sex over vaginal sex?

 

Perhaps focusing on the actual issues and morals of community leaders rather than their sexual preferences would be better. Call me crazy.

 

 

I understand what your saying, and I think you+I (and I hope others here) could care less what someone does sexually. Whatever, to each his own, I got bigger problems in my life then who likes who, and who marries who.

But dont you also see the point of having these "role models/idols in pro sports" to help kids to not feel so different? Doesnt having someone, anyone, come out publically allow for a kid to at least see that there are others like him and its nothing to be secretive about?

Stereotypes are coming from a lack of education, and these same stereotypes are fed by a lack of openness.

 

I realize its a small bandaid on a huge problem, but if you cant get half the country to think logically, at least having someone, anyone, in your corner helps.

 

(I dont know if any of what I just said makes sense, I feel like Im having a bad day communicating....too tired!)

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If there are close to 700 NHL players and 1 player comes out and says he is gay, what is that really saying? Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think it really has much of an impact on some 16 year old boy who is struggling with his sexuality. It's not like everyone is going to be supportive of a gay hockey player. That 16 year old boy might view the hockey player as brave, but is it going to help the kid much? Is the kid going to suddenly feel more comfortable because a hockey player announced that he was gay? I'm not so sure. He's still going to see or hear some people reacting negatively toward the announcement. As a society, I think we'd be better off if EVERYONE (gay or not) talked more about accepting people's differences instead of highlighting the specific differences. Not sure if I expressed that clearly...

 

Btw, Ray Emery is the first NHL goalie to ever start the season 10-0.

 

Or as some would rather say...Ray Emery is the first black NHL goalie to ever start the season 10-0.

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What kind of society is it when we need to designate role model status on whether someone prefers anal sex over vaginal sex?

 

Perhaps focusing on the actual issues and morals of community leaders rather than their sexual preferences would be better. Call me crazy.

 

Arp gave some good example, but I don't think you could be more wrong about this. Can you imagine what it's like to feel very different from everyone else for reasons you don't understand. To see no one like you in areas you have interest? There are thousands of gay kids playing minor hockey, and yet not one professional can show them what the road ahead is like by saying "yes, I am like you. I conquered some difficult things that you will face. The fact that I succeeded can give you the strength to push through the bad times."

 

If Shane doan gives to charity or works hard, but hasn't had to deal with any of the same sht that I'm going through, how does he set an example for me?

 

If there are close to 700 NHL players and 1 player comes out and says he is gay, what is that really saying? Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think it really has much of an impact on some 16 year old boy who is struggling with his sexuality. It's not like everyone is going to be supportive of a gay hockey player. That 16 year old boy might view the hockey player as brave, but is it going to help the kid much? Is the kid going to suddenly feel more comfortable because a hockey player announced that he was gay? I'm not so sure. He's still going to see or hear some people reacting negatively toward the announcement. As a society, I think we'd be better off if EVERYONE (gay or not) talked more about accepting people's differences instead of highlighting the specific differences. Not sure if I expressed that clearly...

 

Btw, Ray Emery is the first NHL goalie to ever start the season 10-0.

 

Or as some would rather say...Ray Emery is the first black NHL goalie to ever start the season 10-0.

 

You don't think young black kids coming up playing hockey might have an easier time now than 10, 20, 30 years ago, since there are now so many black players, showing everyone that they're no different? You don't think it makes it easier for a young black goalie, coming up against teammates, coaches or opponents who are less than accepting to be able to point out to himself and them that there have been other black goalies that have been very successful? It's easy for you and me to say that we just should accept everyone, and there is no difference between black, gay, or whatever, but not everyone feels that way, and those who are different have to deal with those people!

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Arp gave some good example, but I don't think you could be more wrong about this. Can you imagine what it's like to feel very different from everyone else for reasons you don't understand. To see no one like you in areas you have interest? There are thousands of gay kids playing minor hockey, and yet not one professional can show them what the road ahead is like by saying "yes, I am like you. I conquered some difficult things that you will face. The fact that I succeeded can give you the strength to push through the bad times."

 

If Shane doan gives to charity or works hard, but hasn't had to deal with any of the same sht that I'm going through, how does he set an example for me?

 

 

 

You don't think young black kids coming up playing hockey might have an easier time now than 10, 20, 30 years ago, since there are now so many black players, showing everyone that they're no different? You don't think it makes it easier for a young black goalie, coming up against teammates, coaches or opponents who are less than accepting to be able to point out to himself and them that there have been other black goalies that have been very successful? It's easy for you and me to say that we just should accept everyone, and there is no difference between black, gay, or whatever, but not everyone feels that way, and those who are different have to deal with those people!

 

 

I think the goal is correct. I don't agree with the route taken.

 

Hey kids! There are gay astronauts, gay teachers, gay hockey players, gay janitors, gay politicians, gay doctors, gay actors, gay bank tellers. Whether you are homosexual or heterosexual does not determine who or what you can become in your life. You, like everyone, are unique in some way or another. You will encounter people in your life who will highlight those differences and try to put you down for them. You will encounter many more people who will accept you for who you are. Be one of those people.

 

We should be teaching that to all kids, not just the gay ones.

 

Coming out seems more like: "Hey kids. I'm gay and look what I was able to accomplish. If you're also gay you can still accomplish anything you set your mind to." It's as if we're highlighting a difference and labelling it as a handicap of sorts and showing that it can be overcome.

 

 

And it may be easier for young black kids coming up now than it was years ago (I'm not so sure though), but if it is I don't think it's because of the black players that have played in the NHL. I think it's because of the people that have accepted that the colour of someone's skin is about as relevant as the colour of their eyes.

 

Someone's sexuality or the colour of someone's skin should be non-issues. I don't see how highlighting those differences will ever lead to them becoming non-issues.

 

There will always be racists and homophobes and bullies.

 

--------

 

The "no bullying" programs that I see in schools are a similar issue for me. I don't think they are solving the problem. There will always be bullies. In my opinion, it would be more effective if we educated our children and explained why other children bully and how to deal with it.

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The "no bullying" programs that I see in schools are a similar issue for me. I don't think they are solving the problem. There will always be bullies. In my opinion, it would be more effective if we educated our children and explained why other children bully and how to deal with it.

 

I'm more in favour of fixing the perpetrator and not just teaching the victim how to deal with it.

 

I think it starts with having parents who don't raise assh*les.

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But isn't that what you're doing by educating children? I think it would work both ways. By educating potential victims you're also reducing the likelihood they will become bullies.

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I think the goal is correct. I don't agree with the route taken.

 

Hey kids! There are gay astronauts, gay teachers, gay hockey players, gay janitors, gay politicians, gay doctors, gay actors, gay bank tellers. Whether you are homosexual or heterosexual does not determine who or what you can become in your life. You, like everyone, are unique in some way or another. You will encounter people in your life who will highlight those differences and try to put you down for them. You will encounter many more people who will accept you for who you are. Be one of those people.

 

We should be teaching that to all kids, not just the gay ones.

 

Coming out seems more like: "Hey kids. I'm gay and look what I was able to accomplish. If you're also gay you can still accomplish anything you set your mind to." It's as if we're highlighting a difference and labelling it as a handicap of sorts and showing that it can be overcome.

 

 

And it may be easier for young black kids coming up now than it was years ago (I'm not so sure though), but if it is I don't think it's because of the black players that have played in the NHL. I think it's because of the people that have accepted that the colour of someone's skin is about as relevant as the colour of their eyes.

 

Someone's sexuality or the colour of someone's skin should be non-issues. I don't see how highlighting those differences will ever lead to them becoming non-issues.

 

There will always be racists and homophobes and bullies.

 

--------

 

The "no bullying" programs that I see in schools are a similar issue for me. I don't think they are solving the problem. There will always be bullies. In my opinion, it would be more effective if we educated our children and explained why other children bully and how to deal with it.

But isn't that what you're doing by educating children? I think it would work both ways. By educating potential victims you're also reducing the likelihood they will become bullies.

 

Ok, now I'm agreeing with a lot of what you say. I think you underestimate the benefit of having someone who shares your sexuality/skin colour/haircut, etc, that is the cause of your confusion or abuse to hold as an example. Not as a general solution, but something that a certain individual can use. I see the You Can Play organization as doing basically what you suggest, and I would argue that what they are doing is much better and more productive than a single NHL'er coming out. In lieu of such a well-connected and well run grassroots organization though, I think you need examples, because general purpose positivity and education just doesn't do the trick well enough.

 

With the work the You Can Play organization is doing, I don't think we need any NHL'ers 'coming out,' which is as high a compliment I can think of to that organization.

 

The only aspect I disagree with is your implication that highlighting a difference makes it out to be some sort of handicap. Being homosexual, or any of a number of other groups is a handicap in hockey right now. You can't tell me that a homosexual kid, whether his friends/teammates/family/himself are aware of it or not, would not face disadvantages coming through the system. By highlighting it, you force people to deal with the issue and have to rationalize the decisions/actions they take/make that are unfair to that person, including their own. To me, that is the critical step - until you highlight the problem and force people to question it's validity, the issues these people face will not be publicized, and they'll each have to forge their own path.

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A healthy Markov the biggest difference ?

 

At the beginning of the season, for sure! His age/injuries are showing more now...can't close gaps as fast and easy as he once could.

 

If I had to pick one thing I would say it's been because of a better all-around team effort. When someone like Pacioretty has a bad game it seems like another guy like Desharnais will pick it up. Bourque was playing very well when he went down, but they just plug someone else in his spot and don't seem to miss a beat. They haven't had many games where they've all stunk.

 

tenacity > truculence

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