The New V Blog Is Up

[irishguy 14]

There is a difference here. Just like black people can call one another the N word, _______ people can make fun of their own also.Wow, now I'm a comedian too.

I am offended by your Avatar. Not as a short red with glasses but as a friend of many people that fit this criteria. After getting to know these people I am very much in touch with there plight. As if being fair skinned and red headed which stands out in a crowd of many isn't enough they now have the added inflictions of site and vertical impairment. These are three distinct areas of minority and ridicule through out our culture yet you pick a cartoon depiction as your advatar. This is a mockery of a people that have suffered for many years from discrimination from big business on down. Your lack of sensitivity has hurt my sun scared friends immensly and I would appreciate it if you would remove this.

[DCJ001 0]

Let's see what you think about this:A Canadian is walking down the street with a case of beer under his arm. His friend Doug stops him and asks, "Hey Bob! Whatcha get the case of beerfor?" "I got it for my wife, eh." answers Bob. "Oh!" exclaims Doug, "Good trade."

[rgold79 0]

Are New Yorkers allowed to be offended that DN called Toronto the most multi-cultural city in the world? Where's our apology? I feel lame having posted this, and I haven't even hit submit yet. Wait, here I go. Stupid index finger.

[DCJ001 0]

Or this:One day an Englishman, an American, and a Canadian walked into a pubtogether. The proceeded to each buy a pint of Molson Canadian. Just as theywere about to enjoy their beverage three flies landed in each of theirpints. The Englishman pushed his beer away from him in disgust. TheAmerican fished the offending fly out of his beer and continued drinking itas if nothing had happened.The Canadian picked the fly out of his drink and started shaking it over thepint, yelling, "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT YOU *******!!!"

[DCJ001 0]

How's this:On the first day of Grade Three, Johnnie's teacher asked the students tocount to 50. Many of them did very well, some getting as high as 37. ButJohnnie did extremely well; he made it to 100 with only 3 mistakes. At homehe told his Dad how well he had done. Dad told him, "That's because you arefrom Newfoundland, son." The next day, in language class, the teacher askedstudents to recite the alphabet. Some made it to the letter "k" with onlyone mistake, but Johnnie outdid them again. He made it all the way through,missing only the letter "m". That evening he once again brought his Dad upto date and Dad explained to him, "That's because you are from Newfoundland,son". The next day, after Physical Education, the boys were takingshowers. Johnnie noted that, compared to the other boys in his grade, heseemed overly "well-endowed". This confused him. That night, he asked hisDad, "Dad, they all have little tiny ones, but mine is ten times bigger thantheirs. Is that because I'm from Newfoundland?" "No, son, "explained Dad,"That's because you're 18!"These three jokes are funny, in my opinion. They are "Canadian jokes" but they are not funny because they had to do with Canadians but because of the way that they are written. I hope that the Canadians on the message board find some humor in them and, if they don't, oh well...

[Viking145 0]

Tyler-You are young and you think you know the score, so I will cut you some slack, but you need to try not to weigh in on issues on which you do not have a good handle.First: there is no such thing as the "Jamaican Race," unless that is some kind of run from Kingston to Montego bay.Second: you were supposed to recognize that relying on the dictionary to think for you is a bad, bad idea; therefore, coming back at me with new definitions is especially charming.Third: there is a historical context for discussions of race in this country (along with other ethnic and national stereotypes), and this needs to be considered.Finally, I would hope that we can agree that fixed and oversimplified views of anything are another bad idea.

[TylerSalzman 0]

Tyler-Finally, I would hope that we can agree that fixed and oversimplified views of anything are another bad idea.

How does a person do a decent act of someone with a much darker skin tone, unless they use makeup and use actions that are usually attributed with those people? Daniel didn't say one bad thing about the Jamacan PEOPLE or make them look bad with his actions. Could you just explain why you find it so offensive?

[TylerSalzman 0]

Tyler-Second: you were supposed to recognize that relying on the dictionary to think for you is a bad, bad idea; therefore, coming back at me with new definitions is especially charming.

You threw this Definition at me first bud. "Stereotypes are derogatory by definition: "a widely held but fixed and oversimplified image or idea of a particular type of person or thing"." I was just trying to show you that you were wrong and that Derogatory and Sterotypical do not in fact go hand in hand. Haven't you thought about Positive Stereotypes??? Like asians are good at math? Etc.

[DanielNegreanu 141]

All jokes=blog worthy, lol.

[Viking145 0]

Tyler-I am not trying to give you a hard time, but you need to think these things through. There is no such thing as a "positive stereotype". Your example, Asians are good at math is both a big generalization and an oversimplification (these are not good things), and the origin of stereotypes like these are not benign. We might think "Jews are good businessmen" could be an exmaple of a "positive stereotype" and yet it is related to all kinds of negative historical views of the Jewish people.We can then connect this with what is wrong with the video blog. When I label it offensive, it is not because I think that Daniel made fun of Jamaicans (though I am confident that not all Jamaicans would want to be characterized as pot-smoking rastas). It is offensive because of the dark history of white comedians in this country painting themselves black in order to further the racial oppression of African-Americans. Therefore, the very image of Daniel with shoe polish on his face is enough to offend, regardless of what he actually said.We should simply try to be aware of the history of these issues. I am a fan of edgy humor, but I also think that public figures who have staked some of their reputation on being thoughtful observers of contemporary society ought to avoid situations where they might easily offend many, many people.To return to stereotypes, the problem is that they are generalizations about a whole group. When Daniel imitates Minh Ly while Minh is sitting at the poker table with him, it is pretty funny. We know that they know eachother, and we can tell for ourselves that Minh thinks his own English is funny. At the same time, if Daniel did a video blog mocking the speaking skills of Asian immigrants, I would find it offensive.

[Canuckickstan 2]

I just watched the Vid blog and thought it was funny. I'm Canadian though....

[TylerSalzman 0]

Tyler-I am not trying to give you a hard time, but you need to think these things through. There is no such thing as a "positive stereotype". Your example, Asians are good at math is both a big generalization and an oversimplification (these are not good things), and the origin of stereotypes like these are not benign. We might think "Jews are good businessmen" could be an exmaple of a "positive stereotype" and yet it is related to all kinds of negative historical views of the Jewish people.We can then connect this with what is wrong with the video blog. When I label it offensive, it is not because I think that Daniel made fun of Jamaicans (though I am confident that not all Jamaicans would want to be characterized as pot-smoking rastas). It is offensive because of the dark history of white comedians in this country painting themselves black in order to further the racial oppression of African-Americans. Therefore, the very image of Daniel with shoe polish on his face is enough to offend, regardless of what he actually said.We should simply try to be aware of the history of these issues. I am a fan of edgy humor, but I also think that public figures who have staked some of their reputation on being thoughtful observers of contemporary society ought to avoid situations where they might easily offend many, many people.To return to stereotypes, the problem is that they are generalizations about a whole group. When Daniel imitates Minh Ly while Minh is sitting at the poker table with him, it is pretty funny. We know that they know eachother, and we can tell for ourselves that Minh thinks his own English is funny. At the same time, if Daniel did a video blog mocking the speaking skills of Asian immigrants, I would find it offensive.

Okay.. I agree that stereotypes and generalizations in general are bad. but you have to agree that Daniel's intent here was not malicious. Intent is very important. I'm sorry that you disagree, but I think you need to see where Daniel is coming from and that he was just trying to be humorous with no ill intent. If you spend your life trying to find Offensive material where there is none, then that is going to make life a little harder in my opinion.

[ahosang 0]

Ahosang- I am glad that you were not offended, and I agree with you that America has a long way to go.

And most of the world too...

I also note that for all your calls for equality, you are just as busy as everyone else playing identity politics. It should not matter whether one is black or white if one is offended by this.

I'm not clear on this part. If you're saying "I'm offended, and it doesn't really matter what colour I am", then I agree with that. But, nowhere did i state that whites didn't have the right to be offended. In fact i said that I was 'sorry that they were' - I found the skit funny, you see(that's my right!).No identity politics here!!

You criticise a certain use of "political correctness," but it is this same definition of "PC" that would give one group a greater legitimacy to criticize something as offensive.

I did not say that only us Jamaicans(or Black people) had right of criticism regarding this type of skit. I have sent it to Jamaican friends because the character is Jamaican, and there are bits that other people wouldn't get. The fact is that it is 'political correctness' which says that certain things are taboo. I am not 'politically correct'. That doesn't mean I'm an Uncle Tom, nor does it mean that only jamaicans may have right of criticism of a jamaican parody. It means that I believe that things should be done(or not done) according to logic, direct effect, meritocratic considerations etc, not according to some sort of 'taboo list'.

This is potentially offensive to Americans of all types precisely because of the history of race relations in our country.

Yes, I understood that from the very start. I've read the threads at 2+2, here, and am aware of what happened to Ted Danson(even though he was dating Whoopi). That's why I am sorry that you're all offended. Can you accept that a Jamaican could hope that you not be offended by this skit though?? If you're white and offended because of what your contemporaries or your ancestors may have done, i'm sorry.if you're black and offended because of what you or your ancestors went through at the hands of whites, I'm sorry. That's why i said America(and the world) has a long way to go. I wasn't offended, and i found it funny - sorry if you're offended that I found it funny. We're not exactly singing in complete harmony in Jamaica either, but we're a lot more relaxed. The bottom line is that maybe the US is too steeped in racial problems for you to understand my indifference(and that of my Jamaican friends) to the 'black up'. And that's what's sad, but it's not my job to apologise for that...

[Viking145 0]

Tyler-If you look at my first post, you will see that I conceded at the outset that Daniel's intent was in no way malicious.That is why I have highlighted the need to understand the broader historical context of issues like this, so that Daniel can see why some might take offense even when he meant nothing of the sort.

[Viking145 0]

Ahosang-NH sir.It is not that I do not understand/accept your indifference, but I am too aware of the racial problems here in the U.S. and the history that goes with them to be able to enjoy a performance like the video blog.

[ChrisOfSpades 0]

Okay.. I agree that stereotypes and generalizations in general are bad. but you have to agree that Daniel's intent here was not malicious. Intent is very important. I'm sorry that you disagree, but I think you need to see where Daniel is coming from and that he was just trying to be humorous with no ill intent. If you spend your life trying to find Offensive material where there is none, then that is going to make life a little harder in my opinion.

ok i'm going to chime in here - i think the two of you are having a pretty good discussion about this, and i think an analogy can help explain why daniel's intent isn't the big issue here. in some parts of the world the make very realistic bb guns, but those bb guns aren't allowed in this country (united states). now a person owning one of these bb guns probably doesn't intend to harm anybody, but the law errs on the side of caution because those bb guns appear dangerous (actual intent notwithstanding).daniel is the bb gun here. his intent isn't harmful, but what he's representing definitely is.

[DanielNegreanu 141]

To ahosang: Thanks for chiming in. At least it helps me feel like I'm not totally crazy and that I didn't offend Jamaicans or Jamaican culture. I think a small number of Jamaicans may not like it, but I believe that a majority of them would be fine with it. What I don't get, is why so many white people are offended by it? It's not like I was wearing a tuxedo and white gloves tap dancing with blackface on.

[beans-n-icewater 18]

Its a good thing that I wasnt in charge of directing that vid...The slice of watermelon stuck in the Corona bottle wouldve caused much more fallout:second though face:...does Colt 45 come in a bottle?

[TylerSalzman 0]

Well, the badger game is on, and dinner is served so I will talk to you gentlemen later. Peace!

[cuddlemonkey 0]

To ahosang: Thanks for chiming in. At least it helps me feel like I'm not totally crazy and that I didn't offend Jamaicans or Jamaican culture. I think a small number of Jamaicans may not like it, but I believe that a majority of them would be fine with it. What I don't get, is why so many white people are offended by it? It's not like I was wearing a tuxedo and white gloves tap dancing with blackface on.

White people are offended because it's the PC thing to do. To laugh at it might mean they get perceived as racist.

[DanielNegreanu 141]

White people are offended because it's the PC thing to do. To laugh at it might mean they get perceived as racist.

I actually think there is some truth to that. It seems many people spend so much time worried about "not looking racist." Thing is, if you spend a lot of time with people of other cultures, you actually become way more comfortable making fun of each other in a friendly way. I don't living life walking around on egg shells all the time worrying about the intracicies of political correctness. It's way too exhausting and counter-productive in my opinion.

[davezz5 0]

The safe play would of been to hire a real jamaican for .50 cent and all the Ganja he could smoke, then no one would of been offended.

[Fred Sanford 0]

What I don't get, is why so many white people are offended by it?

Cauze theys dont thank dat theys posed ta makes fuz ofz usd andymore fer sum readon er anoder. We cen takes a damn joke, ya know. I godda grin outta it, but Iz too old fer all dat racist junkI hadda TV show makin fun of uz fer years and nobodee saidda damn word bout itTimez iz changed Mr Neg....Nega....Negggerra.... caint pronounciate itJuzz watch out fer that Ester, she dont never get a funny

[ahosang 0]

Or this:One day an Englishman, an American, and a Canadian walked into a pubtogether. The proceeded to each buy a pint of Molson Canadian. Just as theywere about to enjoy their beverage three flies landed in each of theirpints. The Englishman pushed his beer away from him in disgust. TheAmerican fished the offending fly out of his beer and continued drinking itas if nothing had happened.The Canadian picked the fly out of his drink and started shaking it over thepint, yelling, "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT YOU *******!!!"

Um, everybody know it's an Irishman that yells at the fly to spit out the beer...ps. my best friend(an irishman) told me that joke, so I'm OK right?!

The safe play would of been to hire a real jamaican for .50 cent and all the Ganja he could smoke, then no one would of been offended.

now that's offensive. Start again at $200...

[lamont 0]

You sed it PopsWe med fun of dem white folks fer years on nationial telebizion and neva hear a word bout itSum peoplez need ta lightened da hell up!Uh oh here comez Esta!