Phil Ivey, The Andy Beal Of Golf?

[Jam-Fly 8]

I know Daniel was kidding, and I know there have been threads about the blog already, but I'm gona make this thread anyways.I got me thinking, what if the 'Andy Beal' factor was applied to other sports/games, like golf. Could Ivey challenge Tiger for such an amount of money that Tiger would get nervous and choke constantly? This is what Beal 'attempted' to do to the corporation, but we know how that worked out.Or how bout shooting free throws with LeBron James? If Erik Lindgren challenged him to $500,000k a basket, could Lindgren come out on top? That actually brings up another question for Daniel, who is better at basketball, Lindgren or Ivey?

[LongLiveYorke 38]

No, neither would ever win.

[king_tanner 84]

I know Daniel was kidding, and I know there have been threads about the blog already, but I'm gona make this thread anyways.I got me thinking, what if the 'Andy Beal' factor was applied to other sports/games, like golf. Could Ivey challenge Tiger for such an amount of money that Tiger would get nervous and choke constantly? This is what Beal 'attempted' to do to the corporation, but we know how that worked out.Or how bout shooting free throws with LeBron James? If Erik Lindgren challenged him to $500,000k a basket, could Lindgren come out on top? That actually brings up another question for Daniel, who is better at basketball, Lindgren or Ivey?

Doesn't Tiger make about 80 mil a year in winnings and endorsements... I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure Ivey doesn't make that much. So the answer to this question is most likely hellllllllll no.(edit) Tiger also makes money just showing up to tournaments.... they pay him a couple mil to show up overseas. This thread is done I don't know why Im commenting in it.

[chrozzo 19]

No, neither would ever win.

true, an amateur golfer playing a pro golfer is not the same as an amateur poker player playing a pro poker player

[rgold79 0]

Yeah... I would say Tiger has much much more money at his disposal than Phil Ivey. I can't find a verifying link, but Fortune Magazine estimated Tiger's net worth a while back at around $300 million (and I think this was in 2005), and Golf Digest did a piece that speculated his net worth would approach $1 Billion by 2010. Actually, here's the link to the GD article, which cites Fortune. Suffice to say, Phil Ivey can't afford the kinds of prices that might make Tiger Woods nervous. http://www.golfdigest.com/features/index.s...00602top50.htmlAlso, LeBron makes tens of millions in endorsements each year. He has much more money than Erick Lindgren. LeBron and Tiger are likely the two best in the world at their respective disciplines, and luck is far less of a factor in both sports. Golf you can handicap, though. But not basketball. If you want to see an entertaining prop basketball bet, watch Charles Barkley race Di.ck Bavetta for charity this weekend. And, um, lol at the man's name being censored.

[akoff 0]

I know there has been rapment speculation about the net worth and potential income of guys that play in the big game. DN posts his yearly results from time to time on this site, while they are nice, it really isn't a whole lot of money in the big picture.I am going to assume that he is one of the more profiable pros if not from table earnings alone but certainly with endorsements...would that be a fair guess? If so and i think it is....poker pros aren't even close to some other sports yet! Give it another 10 years or so...Bottom line is Ivey isn't going to have anywhere near the cash to make tiger choke...however Ivey is going to have about 100 times more gamble in him then Tiger. Tiger has a reputation for being tight with cash and won't quit any bets until he gets back to even....I would be very interested to see how Ivey would take advantage of that.

[Governator 54]

Tiger's the richest athlete in the world, topping 87mil/yr... I believe its 80mil from Nike per year + tournament earnings. I think he's targeted by forbes to be the first athlete to hit a billion dollars in career earnings including endorsements of course.

[nutzbuster 7]

I know Daniel was kidding, and I know there have been threads about the blog already, but I'm gona make this thread anyways.I got me thinking, what if the 'Andy Beal' factor was applied to other sports/games, like golf. Could Ivey challenge Tiger for such an amount of money that Tiger would get nervous and choke constantly? This is what Beal 'attempted' to do to the corporation, but we know how that worked out.Or how bout shooting free throws with LeBron James? If Erik Lindgren challenged him to $500,000k a basket, could Lindgren come out on top? That actually brings up another question for Daniel, who is better at basketball, Lindgren or Ivey?

NO. Tiger is a human laser guided cruise missle.

Tiger's the richest athlete in the world, topping 87mil/yr... I believe its 80mil from Nike per year + tournament earnings. I think he's targeted by forbes to be the first athlete to hit a billion dollars in career earnings including endorsements of course.

I've heard all totaled it's upwards over 100 mil. SO sick!http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/index.c...d=SBD2007011130btw, how go the wedding plans buddy?

[rgold79 0]

NO. Tiger is a human laser guided cruise missle.

QFT. I've watched Tiger Woods play golf for more than 10 years, and I literally cannot remember one time when he choked (like Mickelson in last year's U.S. Open).

[Jam-Fly 8]

How about if Tiger made no money off Nike etc. and just had money that he won from Golf, same with LeBron.

[Oziumrules 0]

I dont think Tiger has ever choked in is life.....

[rgold79 0]

How about if Tiger made no money off Nike etc. and just had money that he won from Golf, same with LeBron.

Too hypothetical. They have the money, so you can't separate that from the reality. The luck factor is really what makes poker different from golf or basketball. When a poker player is running hot, all the skill in the world isn't going to help his opponent. On the other hand, in golf each shot occurs independent of the other. So even if you were to get lucky and stick an approach 3 feet from the pin, there's nothing to preclude Tiger from following you up and doing the exact same thing. And statistically he's much more likely to do so and to do so more often. Another thing you have to consider about Tiger is the physical nature of his skills. He's an exceptionally strong athlete from a mental standpoint (along with MJ maybe one of the best I've ever seen), but his skills are also the product of years worth practice contributing to muscle memory. What I mean is, when you or I swing a golf club we have to be consciously aware of how we are moving our body and keeping our eyes on the ball and following through and the million other things that go into a solid swing. Since Tiger has hit several million more balls in his lifetime than either of us, a lot of the things the average golfer needs to be conscious of come instinctively to him. He's much less prone to flub a swing because of pressure because his body is simply repeating the motions it's made millions of times in the past.

[Tigerlite 0]

I know Daniel was kidding, and I know there have been threads about the blog already, but I'm gona make this thread anyways.I got me thinking, what if the 'Andy Beal' factor was applied to other sports/games, like golf. Could Ivey challenge Tiger for such an amount of money that Tiger would get nervous and choke constantly? This is what Beal 'attempted' to do to the corporation, but we know how that worked out.Or how bout shooting free throws with LeBron James? If Erik Lindgren challenged him to $500,000k a basket, could Lindgren come out on top? That actually brings up another question for Daniel, who is better at basketball, Lindgren or Ivey?

Tiger made 99 million dollars last year alone. I doubt that a five million dollar bet is going to worry him much. If Ivey did in fact make or accept this challenge, he is a complete moron. Tiger will crush him even putting with his driver. Tiger could drive and putt with an axe and kick Ivey butt.

[Balloon guy 158]

One thing for sure, Tiger Woods is scary good. Scary.Phil is really good, I hear, for a poker player.

[ajs510 122]

Phil facing off against Tiger would have a much bigger choke factor than Tiger facing off against Phil's money. Even if he practiced for a year specifically for that match on that course, he'd still drop 3-4 strokes a side off his average just because he has to tee off, chip, and putt in front of the best golfer in the world. Phil's money vs some random, typical golf hustler would be a different story, and makes for a better parallel. If the other hustler was a noticeably better golfer, Phil upping the stakes out of the hustler's comfort level could even the playing field (the way Beal tried to do to the Corp).

[showstopper24 0]

A couple of things with the lindgren vs. LBJ issue.Unfortunatley, LBJ has been struggling for the line. But the real issue is that 500k. LBJ can obviously afford to lose a couple of shots becuase he has a crap load of money. E-dog does (as far as I know) not have enough money to lose more than a couple of shots. He would have more of the pressure.Lets say LBJ misses 5 and E-dog makes him, LBJ would lose 2.5 million out of about the 100 million he is worth. If LBJ made five and E-dog lost five, that would be a much bigger percent of his money.

[Mr. DNA 0]

I love how Daniel's blogs can go from super-serious affairs about God and love, and then a week later he's winding us up with some little made-up stories. Daniel is a talented guy, not just in a poker sense. I don't want to sound too sucky-uppy here, but this is why I keep returning to his blog. It's very entertaining.

[James D 0]

There's only one way to make Tiger Woods choke... make him play Matchplay, against Paul Casey. Btw, to those who say they have never seen Tiger baulk under pressure, did you not watch the last two Ryder Cups? Did you not see him hook his first drive off the first tee at the K-Club, with all that pressure and hype built up on him... straight into the water?There are many better Matchplay golfers than Tiger, for some reason he can't perform to his usual level when playing it. I will qualify this however, by saying that... as for Strokeplay, he's the best there's ever been, better than Nicklaus, no question. I have also never seen him choke playing Stokeplay. He is relentless. I repeat, (to prevent flames saying that I am dissing Tiger Woods' golfing ability) he is the best golfer that there has ever been. Just noting that there are great differences between the two games, requiring different abilities, and as yet Tiger simply hasn't done as well in Matchplay.To answer the OP, seeing as Tiger would drown Ivey in terms of net worth, there's no amount that Ivey could put up to worry Tiger. The only way it may be possible, would be if Bill Gates leant Ivey all his money to play with, and they played for every last penny that Tiger had, every single hole... i.e - every hole of a challenging 18 hole course, Tiger would have all of his money and everything he owns at stake. Then, maybe, the thought of losing everything would make Tiger shank a tee shot, or fluff a bunker shot on one of the holes... maybe. Or Ivey could get lucky on a par 3 or something... This would obviously be unfair, as Tiger would win the match, but it's the only scenario I can think of where Ivey may possibly have a shot of winning Tiger's money.Other than that, the parallel between the Andy Beal v The Corporation does not really compare to amateur v pro in other sports, as has already been said. For example, the chances of me beating Roger Federer in a tennis match are 0%, even if we played every day for 10 years. However, the chances of me beating Phil Ivey in a game of poker, even just in one heads up match, would be no less than 20% imo. I can always get lucky against him, whereas I can't against a professional athlete in any given sport.

[copernicus 0]

There are many better Matchplay golfers than Tiger, for some reason he can't perform when playing it.

I don't think the format has anything to do with it. Many of his big amateur and college wins were match play, and many of those were in "Tiger style", coming back from seemingly insurmountable deficits and applying relentless pressure on this opponents forcing them into errors. In fact I believe you'll find his match play record as an amateur is one of if not the best since Bobby Jones.More likely his Ryder Cup problems are because of the "team" nature of the event, and not playing solely for himself.

[James D 0]

I don't think the format has anything to do with it. Many of his big amateur and college wins were match play, and many of those were in "Tiger style", coming back from seemingly insurmountable deficits and applying relentless pressure on this opponents forcing them into errors. In fact I believe you'll find his match play record as an amateur is one of if not the best since Bobby Jones.More likely his Ryder Cup problems are because of the "team" nature of the event, and not playing solely for himself.

The team aspect does seem to affect him, maybe because he's very much an individual competitor. I'm not saying that he cannot play Matchplay. He's probably ranked in the top 3-4 Matchplay golfers in the world. He may be number 1, I haven't seen the rankings. But there are others I would back ahead of him (Els, Casey, Singh), whereas in a normal tournament you could never put anybody but Tiger as the far-away favorite.

[rgold79 0]

The team aspect does seem to affect him, maybe because he's very much an individual competitor. I'm not saying that he cannot play Matchplay. He's probably ranked in the top 3-4 Matchplay golfers in the world. He may be number 1, I haven't seen the rankings. But there are others I would back ahead of him (Els, Casey, Singh), whereas in a normal tournament you could never put anybody but Tiger as the far-away favorite.

In addition to his three U.S. Amateur titles (decided by match play), he's also won the WGC Match Play Championship twice (2003, 2004). That pits him against the top 64 golfers in the world. And his record in international team play merits scrutiny only because his bar is set so high. Really, you could make the case that almost everyone on the American Ryder and President's Cup teams underwhelms, which is why the U.S. keeps losing these events. You had it right when you said he was the best golfer ever. In every field he enters he's far and away the favorite regardless of format.

[rog 0]

I've never seen Lindgren shoot, but he might be able to beat Lebron from the line for any amount. Make it one on one, and Lindgren has no chance (for any stakes).

[MR_BIZKITZ 0]

I say tiger would choke and only shoot 67

[silkyjonson 1]

Yeah... I would say Tiger has much much more money at his disposal than Phil Ivey. I can't find a verifying link, but Fortune Magazine estimated Tiger's net worth a while back at around $300 million (and I think this was in 2005), and Golf Digest did a piece that speculated his net worth would approach $1 Billion by 2010. Actually, here's the link to the GD article, which cites Fortune. Suffice to say, Phil Ivey can't afford the kinds of prices that might make Tiger Woods nervous. http://www.golfdigest.com/features/index.s...00602top50.htmlAlso, LeBron makes tens of millions in endorsements each year. He has much more money than Erick Lindgren. LeBron and Tiger are likely the two best in the world at their respective disciplines, and luck is far less of a factor in both sports. Golf you can handicap, though. But not basketball. If you want to see an entertaining prop basketball bet, watch Charles Barkley race Di.ck Bavetta for charity this weekend. And, um, lol at the man's name being censored.

Free Throws is different thoug, I would imagine there a lot of non pros out there that could beat lebron in ft's, but I dont think there are any non-pros that could ever come close to Tiger without major handicapp. I mean have you seen Lebron shoot free throws lately . And for the tiger thing, Ivey has no shot in hell

[Omaha Hi/Lo 0]

Shooting free throws is WAY different than playing 18 holes... WAY different.It's a lot easier to hit a few free throws, than to out drive/chip/put the most impressive golfer alive for 18 holes straight (I say this because for an amateur to beat Tiger Woods he would have to consistently beat him almost every hole).